Jig to deepen neck pocket?

[ndcaster]

My saddles have to be cranked up too high, so I'd like to deepen the neck pocket of my tele by 3/32". I have a router. I really, really don't want to ruin the body, which is 120-year old pine.

What's the best way of doing this?

 

[old wrench]

If you use a neck pocket template, it's a pretty simple operation.
But, you may not need a template or jig at all.

If you have a top bearing router bit with a short cutter length, like 1/2", you should be able to use the existing neck pocket as a template. This assumes that your neck pocket is already at approx. the standard depth of 5/8" (.625"). For this method to work properly, the bearing needs to ride against the existing inner wall of the pocket.

A 1/2" diameter bit and bearing works excellent for a Tele neck pocket; it matches up correctly with the standard Tele neck pocket corner radius.

Best Regards,
Geo.

 

[SweetClyde99]

I was going to say the same thing. The existing neck pocket should serve as your template if you have a top bearing bit for your router. Just be careful about your depth and go slow, and it should be an easy job.

 

[ndcaster]

Well, that's good news.

I don't have a template right now, so how should I deal with the exposed bottom edge of the pocket, toward the lower bout? The bearing wouldn't have anything to ride on there.

 

[ale.istotle]

You may be able to shim the neck pocket furthest from the bridge to tilt your neck 'down' toward the guitar face. You won't need a lot of shim to get the impact you want.
Or as a test at least shim the bridge up 3/32 to make sure it does what you want before you alter the body.

 

[ndcaster]

You may be able to shim the neck pocket furthest from the bridge to tilt your neck 'down' toward the guitar face. You won't need a lot of shim to get the impact you want.
Or as a test at least shim the bridge up 3/32 to make sure it does what you want before you alter the body.

good ideas

the problem is that the pocket is at a non-standard depth already -- even the neck screw configuration is non-standard, which required me making a custom neck plate

which was fun, don't get me wrong, and I don't mind

but the tech had to crank up the saddles quite high, and I've read that doing so tends to produce ice-pick regardless of the pickup

don't know if that's true (first I've heard of it), but it'd make my life easier overall if the pocket were the standard 5/8"

 

[ale.istotle]

Also, Stewmac sells angled neck shims that can reversibly tilt the neck. 0.25 degree, 0.5 degree or 1 degree.

 

[FenderLover]

I'd favor a correct pocket depth over shims. Use masking tape on the top for your router to slide on, and it should be an easy fix.

 

[old wrench]

Well, that's good news.

I don't have a template right now, so how should I deal with the exposed bottom edge of the pocket, toward the lower bout? The bearing wouldn't have anything to ride on there.

It will be OK. It's true that you will be operating "out in space", or "free-hand" for part of the cut. I find that using an over-sized router base works real good for an operation like this. It adds a lot of stability to the operation. I make my own from plexi-glass or any type of rigid plastic. In a pinch, I've used 1/4" plywood too.

It will work in much the same way as it does when routing a neck pocket from scratch. You'll just need to pay close attention when you approach the left and right side walls so you keep to the inside of the pocket. If you do that, the guide bearing will keep you away from cutting anything that you shouldn't.

The key is to have the bit down far enough so the bearing will ride on the inside wall of the pocket. That is why you need a bit with a short cutter depth.



Another thing that helps, is to pay close attention to the way your router bit spins. Generally, looking down from the top, it spins clockwise.

This means that looking face to face with the workpiece, when you travel from left to right the bit is digging into the work. This left to right travel is generally reccommended for most routing.

The alternate is traveling from right to left, this is called "climb cutting", and generally not recommended. As you can imagine, the router bit has a tendency to try to climb out of the cut and move to the left much faster than you intended . However, with care and practice, "climb-cutting" can be mastered and used to an advantage to reduce edge splintering or tear-out.

 

[ndcaster]

It will be OK. It's true that you will be operating "out in space", or "free-hand" for part of the cut. I find that using an over-sized router base works real good for an operation like this. It adds a lot of stability to the operation. I make my own from plexi-glass or any type of rigid plastic. In a pinch, I've used 1/4" plywood too.

It will work in much the same way as it does when routing a neck pocket from scratch. You'll just need to pay close attention when you approach the left and right side walls so you keep to the inside of the pocket. If you do that, the guide bearing will keep you away from cutting anything that you shouldn't.

The key is to have the bit down far enough so the bearing will ride on the inside wall of the pocket. That is why you need a bit with a short cutter depth.



Another thing that helps, is to pay close attention to the way your router bit spins. Generally, looking down from the top, it spins clockwise.

This means that looking face to face with the workpiece, when you travel from left to right the bit is digging into the work. This left to right travel is generally reccommended for most routing.

The alternate is traveling from right to left, this is called "climb cutting", and generally not recommended. As you can imagine, the router bit has a tendency to try to climb out of the cut and move to the left much faster than you intended . However, with care and practice, "climb-cutting" can be mastered and used to an advantage to reduce edge splintering or tear-out.

really helpful, thank you

the climb-cutting may become important here because the pine I've got is very old and seems brittle. this makes it ring like a bell, since any sap has long been crystallized, but I'm a bit worried about the torque of the router snapping things off if I've got the thing spinning in the wrong direction

so clockwise for most of the cutting, and then climb-cutting to come in from the lower bout edge?

 

[Mike Simpson]

Have you determined what is incorrect to original Tele specs?
Neck pocket should be .625" deep and level with the top.
The neck should be 1" thick at the heel from the back of the mount pad to the crown of the radius.

 

[eallen]

really helpful, thank you

the climb-cutting may become important here because the pine I've got is very old and seems brittle. this makes it ring like a bell, since any sap has long been crystallized, but I'm a bit worried about the torque of the router snapping things off if I've got the thing spinning in the wrong direction

so clockwise for most of the cutting, and then climb-cutting to come in from the lower bout edge?

Be careful climb cutting as it can take your router for a quick ride where you dont want it to go.

If you start out clockwise around the pocket with a 1/2" long bottom bearing bit you will be fine. Route the perimeter first starting at the high E pocket entrance. After that shave back and forth a little at a time until the rest is gone. You are only talking about a micro off so it is won't be much work for a decent router.

 

[dsutton24]

but the tech had to crank up the saddles quite high, and I've read that doing so tends to produce ice-pick regardless of the pickup

Ignore what you've read for a moment. What does the guitar sound like to you?
`

 

[Garruchal]

I would be inclined to sand down the neck instead, it is replaceable. Anyone know why this wouldn't be a good idea?

 

[user34603]

I would be inclined to sand down the neck instead, it is replaceable. Anyone know why this wouldn't be a good idea?

...I would like to know as well.... why rtout the body of a nice Tele to correct a problem easier done by shaving material off the neck heel face ? Simpler, easier to manage, and if it is wrong.... get another neck. What is wrong with that simpler approach ?

 

[trev333]

If you are going to use a router.... I'd make a pattern from your neck heel shape, so you have a nice flat surface to work on...

there's not much landing area around a neck pocket, you wouldn't want the router to tip and ruin your pocket...

 

[guitarbuilder]

Routing a neck pocket would be easier than trying not to mess up the heel. There is more surface area for the router to be supported on top of the body. I'd measure the body and neck and find what's not to fender spec, and fix that part. If it's the neck heel, then there is some jigging up to do.

 

[Meteorman]

Agree with Marty on this. While it sounds simple enough, taking a sanding block to the heel is a low success rate proposition. If you’re not experienced with a router, build the pocket template, use at least 2 clamps, and go slow.

 

[telemnemonics]

I would be inclined to sand down the neck instead, it is replaceable. Anyone know why this wouldn't be a good idea?

The OP said the pocket is not deep enough, and we generally get better results fixing the part that is wrong, rather than the part that seems easier to sand down.
It seems very common to hear that question though: "Why use the proper tool to fix the problem when I can just sand it down?".

Somehow the general population has gotten the idea that sandpaper is a good tool for stock removal.

One thing about body and neck heel dimensions is that we want the right length screw to thread the right distance into the neck heel.
If the body's neck pocket is too shallow, there is less screw thread holding the neck on. If we "fix" this by making the neck thinner, the screws get closer to the fingerboard surface without gaining any thread purchase.

For this routing job I'd agree that a bigger router base would be the sensible fix along with the top bearing bit.
Both of these tools will be used over and over on the guitar bench.
I would not use 1/4" plywood though, it will flex too much IMO.
Lexan is great for making router bases, stronger than plexi.

The operation could also be done on a router table.

 

[ndcaster]

The OP said the pocket is not deep enough, and we generally get better results fixing the part that is wrong, rather than the part that seems easier to sand down.
It seems very common to hear that question though: "Why use the proper tool to fix the problem when I can just sand it down?".

Somehow the general population has gotten the idea that sandpaper is a good tool for stock removal.

One thing about body and neck heel dimensions is that we want the right length screw to thread the right distance into the neck heel.
If the body's neck pocket is too shallow, there is less screw thread holding the neck on. If we "fix" this by making the neck thinner, the screws get closer to the fingerboard surface without gaining any thread purchase.

For this routing job I'd agree that a bigger router base would be the sensible fix along with the top bearing bit.
Both of these tools will be used over and over on the guitar bench.
I would not use 1/4" plywood though, it will flex too much IMO.
Lexan is great for making router bases, stronger than plexi.

The operation could also be done on a router table.

Lexan how thick? would 12"x12"x3/8" do?