Telecaster Body Route Microphonics: Advice?

[Buzzin_Cousin]

Fairly recently I modded an Affinity tele. One of the things I did was route out the body under the neck pickup for most of the wood underneath the pickguard all the way down to 1/4" from the back of the body. See pics below.















The guitar sounds great with full gain even pretty loud and when sitting with the guitar right on front of the amp. But I played out for the first time with it today. And when I turned the gain up to match the drums this thing went microphonic like crazy, with very little room for sustain feedback. Even at times between Palm mutes it was squeaking at me. There was no safe zone either as I moved around to try to find a pocket where it wouldn't squeak at me. The problem was mostly with the bridge pickup, I could mostly keep the neck pickup from squealing, but I need both pickups for what I'm doing.

It's a predictable thing I know. I should've known this was going to happen, the guitar is kind of like an acoustic under there now that I've routed it.

Anyway, is there any way to fix this? Pad and fill this area in or something? Products that are made for acoustic guitars so they don't feed back on stage? Aren't there production guitars that have these problems, like the Gibson Byrdland?

 

[robt57]

Screw the neck HB to the body instead of floating in the guard.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

Screw the neck HB to the body instead of floating in the guard.

To do this I guess I'll have to glue posts into the appropriate two spots gap of the body, or just much longer screws or?

 

[src9000]

Fill the hole with cotton balls?

 

[xtrajerry]

make sure the bridge is flat against the body, and fill the voids with foam. The strip type that's used to insulate around ac units.

 

[robt57]

Remember that the back is thin and don't put a screw through it if you body mount the pickup. So gluing some wood in first sounds like a good idea if it is only 1/4" thick.

Backing the info up a little, does it feedback on one pickup or the other mostly. In other words is it in fact the neck pickup doing the feedback mostly? If yes, try some insulation under and around it in the swimming pool route. enough under it that it gets compressed, but not so much that it raised the whole pickguard and pickup. Again, if it is the neck pickup doing the feeding back...

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

Backing the info up a little, does it feedback on one pickup or the other mostly. In other words is it in fact the neck pickup doing the feedback mostly? If yes, try some insulation under and around it in the swimming pool route. enough under it that it gets compressed, but not so much that it raised the whole pickguard and pickup. Again, if it is the neck pickup doing the feeding back...

No it is mostly the bridge pickup doing the really bad squealing. The neck is not perfect however and could use the treatment recommended.

But I'm wondering why the bridge is worse. Seems like this is backward?

The problem was mostly with the bridge pickup, I could mostly keep the neck pickup from squealing, but I need both pickups for what I'm doing.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

make sure the bridge is flat against the body, and fill the voids with foam. The strip type that's used to insulate around ac units.

I'll look into this stuff. You mean to fill all voids in the bridge area as well?

 

[FallsRockShop]

I wouldn't try to body-mount the pickup AT ALL if you're only 1/4" from the other side of the guitar.

I would shield both cavities with copper self-adhesive tape and then pad the entire thing with closed-cell foam. Pad it enough so that the pickups won't move in their mounts. If that doesn't worth, wax pot the pickups if they aren't currently potted.

Lastly, are you sure the bridge is grounded?

 

[simonsp]

No it is mostly the bridge pickup doing the really bad squealing. The neck is not perfect however and could use the treatment recommended.

But I'm wondering why the bridge is worse. Seems like this is backward?

Could it be to do with the two screws holding the bridge humbucker? I would try packing some lightweight material around the pocket behind the bucker, see if it improves things.

 

[xtrajerry]

yes fill the voids in the bridge cavity too.. actually you could probably get away with just using foam beneath the pickups. I would't use shielding unless there were other noise issues like hum and rf interference.

 

[robt57]

Start with some foam under bot pickups, but so much as it pushed them up. Also, maybe the springs could be heavier, or at least stretch them longer so they exude more tension. Make sure no part of the bridge pickup is touching or very close to the wood.

I have de-coupled tele bridge pickups from the saddle section by cutting the plate and adding screws. I hate doing it with a regular Tele bridge pickup, but with a HB would not care.

If you tap the bridge plate with your finger really hard, a stiff poke and you can hear a click, it is not seated totally flat, makes for squeals.


How close are the strings to the poles when you are fretting up high? That action seems low to the extreme in the pic.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

I wouldn't try to body-mount the pickup AT ALL if you're only 1/4" from the other side of the guitar. I would shield both cavities with copper self-adhesive tape and then pad the entire thing with closed-cell foam. Pad it enough so that the pickups won't move in their mounts. If that doesn't worth, wax pot the pickups if they aren't currently potted. Lastly, are you sure the bridge is grounded?

Guitar is fully copper shielded, with the exception of the lower bout where the switchcraft switch control is located. I had to remove the copper foil in this region as it was causing grounding issues via contact with the switch.



So, secure the pickups so they don't move.
If it doesn't work, wax pot them. Is this to keep the metal points on the pickup from making contact with anything else that is metal and defeating the ground ?

I thought the bridge was grounded, but will check again. The guitar is dead quiet with the clean channel and even with distortion at fairly high volume. I thought this was evidence enough that the bridge and all electronics were grounded.

It's only when I turn the volume with gain way up that I'm having this problem, and then it's really bad.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

yes fill the voids in the bridge cavity too.. actually you could probably get away with just using foam beneath the pickups. I would't use shielding unless there were other noise issues like hum and rf interference.

Yeah in hindsight I shouldn't have shielded it bc the result is basically metal walls that could come in contact with anything.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

Make sure no part of the bridge pickup is touching or very close to the wood. .

This could definitely be occurring.

I have de-coupled tele bridge pickups from the saddle section by cutting the plate and adding screws. I hate doing it with a regular Tele bridge pickup, but with a HB would not care.

If you tap the bridge plate with your finger really hard, a stiff poke and you can hear a click, it is not seated totally flat, makes for squeals.

How close are the strings to the poles when you are fretting up high? That action seems low to the extreme in the pic.

So if nothing else works maybe I could go with a Wilkinson saddle plate and a pickup ring.

I'll tap the bridge plate and see what I hear.

The action is super low, I hope this isn't the problem bc this is how I like my setup.

 

[FallsRockShop]

Yeah in hindsight I shouldn't have shielded it bc the result is basically metal walls that could come in contact with anything.

If you pad it with the foam that shouldn't be an issue. The foam, which will also help with microphonics, will shield the pickup from contacting the shielding. Another remedy would be to layer electrical tape over the shielding. Tedious, but effective.

 

[robt57]

The action is super low, I hope this isn't the problem bc this is how I like my setup.

Well, if too close to the poles... I mean like crazy close.. if you have room to drop the pups try that as well.. could be accentuating things. Easy thing to see, if you have the room before the pickup bottoms or falls off the srews. Of course if the springs are not under a lot of tension dropping the pup will make them less so.

 

[Steve_U1S]

Tubing rather than springs on the pickups can make a difference too, I'm taken to understand.

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

If you pad it with the foam that shouldn't be an issue. The foam, which will also help with microphonics, will shield the pickup from contacting the shielding. Another remedy would be to layer electrical tape over the shielding. Tedious, but effective.

I plan in doing the foam or AC material.

So you are saying laying the copper tape down first shields the electronics from IF, and the electrical tape keeps the copper tape from causing grounding issues?

 

[Buzzin_Cousin]

Well, if too close to the poles... I mean like crazy close.. if you have room to drop the pups try that as well.. could be accentuating things. Easy thing to see, if you have the room before the pickup bottoms or falls off the srews. Of course if the springs are not under a lot of tension dropping the pup will make them less so.

Pickups are pretty far down already.
I'll see if I can get then lower and if this helps.