WGS Blackhawk 12"...hmmm...not sure

[schotter611]

Ok, took my PRRI out to band practice and the stock speaker kind of farted out beyond Vol 6, which is where I usually set it in a small room with loud drummer. Bass got weak and crunch was a little stringent. Sounded alright on the recording, but not in the room. Put in my Veteran 10" and it got worse. Nothing left of what I used to like about the speaker.

So I started looking for something more solid that would offer me the upper mid sweetness of the 10"ers I like at higher Vol, secretly hoping it would also fare well at low volumes. Looked at Celestion Blue/Gold types and I ended up getting a Warehouse Blackhawk and put it into an ext. open back cab.

Now comes the weird part: I've switched back and forth and always end up liking my 10ers much more at around Vol. 2-3 at home.

The BH does as advertised: A very clear, detailed voice w. slightly chimey upper mids, huge, authoriative bass, warm, slightly rolled off treble, but very 'immediate' overall. Extreme note separation and very dynamic. Actually, it is awesome for middle-of-the-night clean, single note stuff. 'Intimate' describes it best.

But chords and crunch (trough stomp box) fail to impress me. Firstly, it does not come across as 'a whole'. There's the bass and on top sits treble. Hi-Fi. Mids feel very 'enclosed' in between w. rounded edges and I feel I have to dig in very hard to 'free the tone from the speaker' while I am turning down the Volume; it's just too damn dynamic. 'Spongy'. 'Gluey' comes to mind. No fun.

My 10"ers both seem more 'wholesome'. Unruly in a good way. 'Raspy' instead of 'spongy'. More alive. Way more fun.

This being said, I have not had the chance to really crank it, no band practice so far.

So:
Do speakers' voices change drastically when driven at their respective 'sweet spot' Volume?

Or could this be a case of 'wrong speaker for the amp'. I know, a lot of people will probably scream 'You should have bought the Celestion Gold!' But I am cautious and also wonder if that would just end up similar since the Blackhawk is supposed to be similar.

Or is what I am describing inherently Alnico and I am just not the Alnico type?

I am making a 12" baffle and see how it behaves as combo but I am not expecting a huge change.

Sorry for being vague and hopelessly unscientific here but...

any thoughts?

 

[homesick345]

I got a BH HP (the 100 watt) - & it doesn't display lack of warm mids. The Blackhawk is indeed in the british speakers camp, but not radically. It does display more warmth & complexity in the lows & lower mids, than your typical celestion.

However, I tried it once with a deluxe knockoff (Fargen blakbird) & did not like the results.

Mind you - I never liked a british speaker for any BF Fender sound.

 

[uriah1]

Funny thing about alnicos and about tone..it is totally unscientific. They can be finicky in diff amps. Love 4 alnicos together in my super...Not so much when I had a 12 in another situation..The princeton may probably be "chimier" with a high power ceramic, possibly. a 12 baffle definitely.

I guess just more testing....I just hate the wait..
wish you luck...

 

[waparker4]

Have you tried sending the amp thru a bigger cabinet eg a 12? It could be other parts of the amp being taxed at high vol, output transformer, tubes, and not (just) the 10" speaker

 

[schotter611]

Have you tried sending the amp thru a bigger cabinet eg a 12?

yes, through some 1x 12 Peavey (rehearsal room inventory). Healthy bass but other than that, it sounded linear and a little boring. So I kept using the stock speaker that day.

 

[schotter611]

I never liked a british speaker for any BF Fender sound.

I have a hunch I will be ending up with a similar conclusion.

I guess just more testing....I just hate the wait..
wish you luck...

me too. I like to tinker but in the process and always end up wondering why I even bother...for now, the cab makes for a nice piece of furniture and I keep playing the 10"ers.

 

[MadJack]

I've been contemplating the PRRI, but have been so-so on the stock Jensen speaker. I love the AlNiCo Blue tones in general and I have oredered a Weber AlNiCo Blue Pup for use in another amp.

I love the PRRI with the AlNiCo Blue Pup here:

 

[mad dog]

Is it the 50 watt blackhawk, or the 100? Is the speaker broken in? Your description of it sounds rather like I've heard from new speakers before they're broken in.
MD

 

[schotter611]

I love the PRRI with the AlNiCo Blue Pup here:

Yeah, that video probably contributed to my PRRI purchase. Actually, I can get it very similar sounding with the Blackhawk (sans the extreme STRATiness here). Just a touch warmer in the lower mids and a smidge less sparkle.
The clean tone is to die for.

 

[schotter611]

Is the speaker broken in?
MD

It's the 50W. I ran 30-60hz loops for 100hrs (got the cone moving) plus almost daily playing through the last month. I don't think it is going to become an entirely different speaker from now on.

Just started cutting a 12" baffle and see how it goes when cranking it in the combo.

 

[leorville]

WGS Blackhawk - No Satisfaction

I have had one for some months now and I can not get along with it. Tried it with a Mesa Solo 50 and a new Deluxe Reverb RI Head and a couple of F clones. Tried it open back and closed back with single coil, humbucker and active pups. Nothing satisfies.

I would gladly take an exchange or back trade from the supplier as it is doing me no good at all. The Jensen ceramic from the factory combo would be better. To my ears, 'detailed' is not a word I want to hear now. This speaker is not warm. There is just too much sound. Lots of highs and the mids have a boxy edge. Low end is ok. I don't see why I should have to throttle back the gtr or amp to suit a speaker.

This speaker talks a good game but I can't use it for more than 15 minutes. After playing that time a good sound will lead the player to keep going. This thing makes my ears sore - literally. Is it broken in - I can't play it long enough to find out. I've tried it on clean jazz, blues, country and with the Mesa on all overdrive settings possible. As far as SPL's are concerned I have a Rivera Rockcrusher so I have tried it at all amp volume settings.

Now if WGS think this is a good speaker i will be wary of their other products. I can see how this speaker could be called good - alnico, detailed sound, hyper efficient (loud) but musical it is not. Shame it took some months and good money to find this out.

So what would i call a good speaker. Luckily I have an aged EVM 15L in a sealed box to mate up to the DRRI head and Mesa etc. I will be looking for a genuinely warm 12" to pair with the DRRI head.

By the way - the DRRI (volume 10) into the Rockcrusher into the EVM 15L is a genuine classic blues/rock sound. This is a sound where you want to just keep playing into the night. Sorry WGS - but no thanks on this one.

 

[uriah1]

Wow..this is a zombie...but, thanks for your review.

If you want a warm 12, perhaps a ceramic. Also, maybe a et65 or creamback 55hz not the 75hz. Some of the TT line are good for warmth too.

wish you luck..