Rivera-era Fender amps club

[dada]

I'm joining. I have a 1982 Champ II and a 1983 Princeton Reverb II both close to mint. I just purchased the PR II today. I love these amps as much as any of my Silverface amps.

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By dada1952 at 2011-09-03

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By dada1952 at 2011-12-23

 

[stoph]

I'm in. I have recently purchased a Concert, not sure of the year? Any pointers on how to find out?

Also does anyone have any good suggestions for replacement speakers? Was looking for an Alnico one but they don't seem to have power ratings high enough and mine's a 1x12.

Anyone have any feedback about the footswitch for these? I've read about a little and people say that change the sound of the amp quite a lot? Mine didn't come with one but I'm thinking of making one as there are schematics out there.

 

[Manolian]

I'm in. I have recently purchased a Concert, not sure of the year? Any pointers on how to find out?

Also does anyone have any good suggestions for replacement speakers? Was looking for an Alnico one but they don't seem to have power ratings high enough and mine's a 1x12.

Anyone have any feedback about the footswitch for these? I've read about a little and people say that change the sound of the amp quite a lot? Mine didn't come with one but I'm thinking of making one as there are schematics out there.

Lucky you, I had one that I bought new in '82, unfortunately I sold it,great amp, my suggestion for a speaker? Eminence red ,white & blues.

 

[Toppscore]

Ask, and ye shall receive: Rivera was involved in Fender amp design 1981-1985. The tube amps he worked on were the Super Champ, Champ II, Princeton Reverb II, Deluxe Reverb II, Twin Reverb II and the Concert (confusingly with no "II", although it's obviously the same species, although apparently Bill Hughes had a hand in it--maybe that's the reason). That's it. The Rivera-era solid state amps were designed by Bill Hughes (ex-Ampeg) and Bob Haigler (long-timer who worked on the Zodiac series of Fender SS amps).

Rivera also had a hand in the conception of the solid state amps of that era--the London, Montreux Showman and such, although the design was done by Bob Haigler and Bill Hodges (apparently having the initials "B.H." was a requirement in Fender Amps at that time...). None of the "Rivera-era" amps have red knobs, and none of the RK tube models are left over from that era. While I've never been able to find a specific, explicit mention of who designed the Super 60, the RK Dual Showman and the Champ 12 were done by Mark Wentling, formerly of Music Man, with input by Hughes. Wentling, Hughes and Haigler also did the SS "Fast Four" of that era. Remember, Rivera gets purged from Fender after the buy-out because he was backing a rival buy-out offer. Rivera's designs were old school PTP, were expensive to make, and apparently not very profitable for Fender, although they were well-received.

The name that I've never seen crop up in published history of Fender amps regarding the red knob is "Paul Rivera". What I have seen is that Fender wanted to make a clean break with the Rivera designs, and that the red knob amps were designed by people other than Rivera. If anyone has documentation that suggests otherwise, I'd love to see it. I'm not dissing RK amps, but for the sake of historical accuracy I'd like to stick to what's been documented.

Fantastic info, TicTok.
Question. I just saw Paul Rivera interviewed and Paul stated he started
at Fender during May, 1981 and left in May 1984. Basically three years.

You listing to 1985 is a bit off. The reason I am making a point of it,
is that I see on EBay Fender amps from 1979 1981 1982 1985 1986 1987(+)
all incorrectly claiming Paul Rivera design.

Paul Rivera was initially courted by Fender during December 1980
and came on board at Fender in May. He felt squeeze in many ways
during early 1984 and left Fender before Summer, 1984.

So, if you or anyone might know about the amps that Paul worked on,
but also the last year of that amp's Rivera influence. Thank you. Toppscore

=====================================
I just purchased my first Rivera Designed amp:
1983 Fender 60w 1x12 Concert II ~ heavily modded to an expreme perfection.
Check it out: (link removed)
Here's hoping to play with you guys, some day soon
Toppscore

 

[Swingville]

How would you describe the tone of the Fender75 clean and dirty. Is the clean more blackface or tweed type? Tight or flubby bass? Highs? Do you typically use the dirty channel or a pedal with it?

The Fender 75 was before the Paul Rivera era.

 

[Swingville]

I had a Fender 75 1x12 combo for over 20 years. The clean sound was fine, the overdrive channel was horrendous. The really unique feature was how they managed to get an amp about the size of a Princeton to actually weigh more than most Twins. It was always funny to watch someone try to pick it up the first time as their arm would nearly get pulled out out the socket.. ;-) I put wheels on mine. -- CS

IMHO, is not the Fender 75 and the Fender 140
designed by engineers before Paul Rivera arrived during may 1982?
and both the 75 & 140 shipped starting in 1979?
I could be wrong. PLMK. Thank you.

 

[Swingville]

I just recently scored one of those in a 15" Combo...did some research on them, and while a lot of folks consider them Rivera era...He actually had nothing to do with it much...they were an Ed Jahns design...least that what I read in the Soul of Tone Amp book ??

+1. They were shipped from 1979-1982 before Paul Rivera went aboard Fender. I believe
that Rivera influenced his modifications on about five major production amps from 1983-1986:
Fender Twin Reverb II 2x12
Fender Twin Reverb II amp head
Fender Concert II 4x10
Fender Concert II 2x10
Fender Concert amp head
Fender Champ II
Fender Super Champ
Fender Princeton II
Fender Deluxe Reverb II
Fender Harvard Reverb II
Fender Yale Reverb II

I do not own any of the above, but have been searching for a good
amp from the Fender Paul Rivera 1983-1986 era.
I may be inaccurate regarding all of the models, but I was seeking
the models that Paul Rivera actually had influence over. I have read
that some amps were more "hands-on" for Paul Rivera, and other amps
were still under his direction.
================================

Fender 30
Fender 75
Fender 140

Reading amp listings, owners of the above 3 amps constantly claim their amp is from
the Fender Paul Rivera era, but these three were designed by the Ed Jahns engineering
and amp design group. There are other amps from the Ed Jahns group, as well,
but IMHO, I believe that the "Push/Pull" control technology was introduced by Ed Jahns
in 1978; and that technology later was enhanced by Paul Rivera in 1983-1986.

===============
Check out the three ten minute interviews of Paul Rivera on YouTube.
Paul Rivera clearly states what he did before, during and after Fender.
Paul states that he joined Fender during May 1982 and left in May 1985.
His influence towards Fender amps were specifically Fender 1983-1986 model years.

 

[Swingville]

Well I thought they were the first Rivera design because I had read it somewhere as well, but as they were pretty much the first cab of the rank when they changed from Silverface back to Blackface in 1980, maybe it makes sense that Rivera was not yet at Fender...

They are an interesting amp because some people hate them with a passion and some people (like me) love 'em. I guess that could be due to the exact type of sound you prefer.

They are quite loved as the Paul Rivera era and the Ed Jahns era of amps
utilized the Push/Pull gain technology. This technology and design circuit
is very easy for knowledgable amp techs to modify in many ways.
Plus, it is/was easier to modifiy a 1980s amp than the vintage amps
from the 1948-1973 Fender era. That is sacrileges!!!

Like me, some like the Fender modded Paul Rivera & Ed Jahns era amps,
and also like the straight ahead vintage Fender amps. I have the older,
and am looking for something different.

 

[Swingville]

UH-OH! The red knobs are sneaking in

I've read that these are Rivera designs as well (even if they were made after he left). Bought my Super 210 new, around 1990.

Still pretty much showroom fresh, since I'm primarily a living room player and don't take it out much (usually take a smaller/lighter amp, like my 25R, to friend's homes), but I love it! Clean for days, and sweet... and heavy (I put some casters on it).

Actually, the Rivera era ended quite quickly as the CBS sold out in 1985 to
an employee group. Paul Rivera did not fit in. By 1987, the post-Rivera
design amps began to have different circuits and features.

Many amp owners want to cling to "more Fender amp value" by claiming their amp
is a "Fender Paul Rivera Era Amp", and from what I have read,
there are "Fender Rivera Era Amp" claims from 1975-1995

Just think 1983-1986 and you will be safe.
Ultimately, all amps came from Leo Fender, and before that, Thomas Edison

 

[Swingville]

Rivera was involved in Fender amp design 1981-1985. The tube amps he worked on were the Super Champ, Champ II, Princeton Reverb II, Deluxe Reverb II, Twin Reverb II and the Concert (confusingly with no "II", although it's obviously the same species, although apparently Bill Hughes had a hand in it--maybe that's the reason). That's it. The Rivera-era solid state amps were designed by Bill Hughes (ex-Ampeg) and Bob Haigler (long-timer who worked on the Zodiac series of Fender SS amps).

Question, TikTok.
If Paul Rivera started at Fender during May 1982
and his designed amp influences started shipping in 1983,
how is it that your statement claims 1981?
I could be wrong, but I have been interested in this subject.
Thanks. Swingville

 

[tap4154]

Swingville may want to read the entire thread before responding to old news.

 

[Swingville]

Swingville may want to read the entire thread before responding to old news.

Hello. I am sorry. What did I miss?

 

[tap4154]

Hello. I am sorry. What did I miss?

No biggie, but you were responding to a post from 2009. I, and most others, have long since been well informed that the red knob amps are not Rivera designs. In fact in the Super 60/112/210 thread one of the designers of the RK series provided a bunch of great info.


The RKs are great amps IMO, no matter who designed them

 

[DocM]

Just joined so this reply is probably way too late to be of any use but about a year ago I put a Celestion G12K100 in my Concert and cranked up my Valley Arts Bent top through it and the sound was unbelievable and loud. It still had the rich mid tones and that wonderful warm, bluesy clean sound that I have always wanted (controllable too) but when I put an 808 Tube Screamer in front of the clean channel I get a classic 70's lead sound.

If your still out there - hope it helps

 

[sccloser]

1983 Fender Concert 1x12

I acquired a 1983 Fender Concert 1x12 in a trade. The grill cloth was missing and the speaker had been replaced, but it was otherwise all original and in good shape.

I swapped out the Cannabis Rex speaker that was in it with a Vintage 30. Has a great clean tone. Sounds good with a boost / od on the clean channel. Not liking the od channel much. Reverb is sweet.

 

[morgansofas]

C'mon, let's keep the Rivera train rolling! I have a Concert II 2x10 with stock EVs. Definitely heaver than and Eminence 1x12 model, but does that big twin speaker mid-bass thing! I thought I'd found my ultimate gigging clean amp, until I tried a SF Twin with JBLs today...does it ever end?

 

[SamClemons]

Here is my Deluxe Reverb II. Really like the amp

 

[dporto]

I've got the earliest of the Princeton II's see here (scroll down to the one in the "pink" room) http://www.stratopastor.org.uk/strato/amps/prii/gallery/modified/modified.html#top
It had the EV/Fender 12F when I got it, but have changed it out for a Greenback.** Paul Rivera didn't really "design" these amps in a literal sense. He was the sales and marketing director and it's probably more accurate to describe his role as "conceptual" as opposed to "design" Ed Jahns was responsible for the actual design of the amp(s).

 

[Jack Knife]

Here is my Deluxe Reverb II. Really like the amp

My absolute fave of this line! I've had the Super Champ, Princeton Reverb II and the Deluxe Reverb II.

The DR II is the perfect size, weight and power for a big sound. I ran a Weber Sig 12B in it and it matched up very well with the amp. Cleans are superb as is the reverb. The OD can get a bit '80s buzzy but if you keep the gain lower it makes a terrific crunch sound.

 

[JAnderson]

My favorite amps.