Jaguar problems

[chris m.]

I've wondered if they roll also. Really tiny balls, not sure if you could mark them or not. I dont have one currently but have installed a few in the past.
Still, even if they dont roll it's one point contact on a chrome (?) ball and may work well. ?
The big advantage of a Strat Tremelo is it rocks the bridge instead of dragging strings across a bridge. But has it's issues also...

I was actually referring to a roller bridge, not an lsr nut. I suspect the lsr nut just minimizes friction. But some lube on a regular nut works just fine imo.

 

[BorderRadio]

A little thread drift, but not entirely:
I wonder why no one has made a roller bridge similar to the LSR Roller nut?
There are tons of complaints out there regarding common roller bridges and the Gretsch crowd over on Gretsch Talk generally hate them, although some dont. The LSR approach is smooth and not bulky etc.
?

Good question. I have never confirmed it, but I read somewhere that due to the downward pressure on the roller that thay don’t actually roll when you use the vibrato…. I wonder if someone could investigate. Easy enough to put a small mark with a sharpie on the side of the roller and then see if it rotates.

Cheaply made rollers have the reputation of sucking 'tone' and collapsing under the string pressure, hence why some Bigsby/Gretsch guys hate em. The highest quality roller is an ABM 2400 and it does in fact roll, but it rocks like all bridges do, even as the strings roll over the saddle. I have a cheapo roller for my Guild Starliner Deluxe so I'll have to check it out. Maybe it's good enough for 10s on a 25.5" offset scale?

 

[whoanelly15]

I have found the Johnny Marr bridge to be an improvement on the original design. It was a drop in replacement on my Classic 60’s Jaguar - tight fit in the thimbles, vintage radius, available in both narrow and wide string spacing. Wider screws with proper fitting nylon bushings that, once set, prevent the bridge from vibrating down over time. No loctite required. Mustang saddles. No rattle. No buzz. Still rocks with the vibrato as it should, as well. As stable tuning, pitch-wise as anything I have with a vibrato, even with 9-42’s. Nice low action and with the short-scale, it has become my easiest guitar to play.

I attribute part of this to the pitch-back built into the neck pocket. Every offset with a Jag or JM vibrato should have that from now on. What is it - 3 degrees?

 

[john_t]

Well, I decided I don't like this cheap roller bridge anymore. I'm getting some "plink" with the non-wound strings. I think the strings are getting wedged in the deep grooves of the rollers (which are all identical depth, but they shouldn't be). I think I'll go back to the original AOM - not ideal, but it sounded a little better.

 

[bendercaster]

You might have better luck with a better roller bridge. Some of the folks here helped me find the Tonepros TP6R roller bridge that I put on my 61 Standard SG to help maintain tuning stability with a palm bender. It has been awesome. it wasn't a perfect fit for the ABR-1 posts, but it has a locking mechanism and enough adjustability to allow it to fit and stay in place. I get zero squeaks or rattles out of it. Compared to the original ABR saddles, the roller bridge tamed a little of the spike treble on my SG, but not in a bad way. I wouldn't consider it a "tone suck." And a Jag has plenty of treble.

 

[Chuckster]

A very timely thread...

I wasn't getting along with 11s on my Johnny Marr, so last night I changed them out to a set of Super Slinky (9-42).

I was getting the plinky buzzes, so I went the extra step to re-set the intonation. During the process, the bass side adjustment screw jammed, and the post inset started spinning.

Looks like I'm buying a new bridge.

 

[cyclopean]

There isn’t much contact, which is part of the plink. But my JM is similar (with a Staytrem bridge) and it’s not particularly buzzy (I’m not even sure that bridge contact in the thimbles can contribute to the buzz you hear). If you’re concerned though, you can try more shimming, necessitating more bridge height, leading to greater downward pressure on the bridge from the strings.

A proper set-up is possible with 10’s, but will likely be a little easier with 11’s. I do t have any experience with Jags specifically but perhaps the shorter scale length makes this even more the case (since strings will be more loose than on a longer-scale guitar, all other things being equal).

I can’t imagine playing a jag with strings that light.

 

[SixStringSlinger]

I can’t imagine playing a jag with strings that light.

To be fair, my offset experience is limited to Jazzmasters, and even there I prefer 11’s. I imagine a Jag’s shorter scale would tilt that preference in a heavier direction.

 

[Colo Springs E]

Jags have always been a PITA! I recommend finding a good indy mechanic, preferably of British descent.

Oh, wait...

 

[sloppychops]

A very timely thread...

I wasn't getting along with 11s on my Johnny Marr, so last night I changed them out to a set of Super Slinky (9-42).

I was getting the plinky buzzes, so I went the extra step to re-set the intonation. During the process, the bass side adjustment screw jammed, and the post inset started spinning.

Looks like I'm buying a new bridge.

I replaced the bridge on my JM with a Staytrem. If you're interested, I'll sell you the original bridge from mine. Only thing is that it's the wider width bridge, not the slightly narrower one that comes with newer JM Jags.

BTW, 9 gauge strings on a Jag is way too small. I use 10.5s on mine.

 

[jrblue]

It's a short scale guitar so a larger string gauge is often needed to get the normal tension required for all the terribly fiddly hardware components to function solidly. Setup is critical as it is totally possible to get all the elements, from nut slots and neck angle to the fit of the bridge, break angle, etc, in decent order and still have creaking, detuning, and general action/feel difficulties. Personally, I think Jaguars are a poor mechanical design with baked-in problems (including some junky hardware that is best upgraded, and a too-short scale length) but I know through experience that really skilled setup should yield a very playable, if fiddly, guitar. Get a good bridge! The Mustang type is maybe the best bang-buck. Good luck.

 

[howardlo]

Jaguars and Jazzmasters are really not much harder to setup than any other guitar equipped with a trem, just a bit different.

Like any guitar normal adjustment of the nut, relief and intonation need to be checked and adjusted if needed.

The bridge and trem of these guitars are unique to them, as is the trem on a Strat.

I bought a new Jazzmaster back in the spring of 1965 right after high school graduation. It came with a small booklet that gave directions for setup and adjustment of the trem. The first thing is to make sure you have a decent break angle of the strings over the bridge. This can be done by adjusting the height of the bridge and the saddles, making sure that the strings clear the back edge of the bridge.

The Squires don’t have the trem lock that the Fender guitars have, and had. Fender recommended adjusting the tension on the trem spring until the lock could be slid into position with just a slight downward pressure on the trem arm. That was really the only time I ever used the lock on my old one, just for initial setup.

Since the Squires don’t have a trem lock you can still adjust the spring tension. If you adjust it so that the front end of the part where the strings are secured is perpendicular to the top of the bridge that will put it just about where adjusting the lock would have put it.

Since the tolerances of the adjustment screws on the saddles and bridge height screws are a bit sloppy the screws can tend to work themselves down while playing, lowering the action. A tiny bit of Blue Loctite easily cures that. The only other thing to keep in mind is that when these guitars were designed the normal gauge of strings (actually all that were available at the time were very heavy by today’s standards, they were in the range of 12’s. String packaging didn’t even indicate string gauge, they were simply marked for either electric or acoustic. So these guitars work well when used with strings of at least 11 gauge (especially true on the shorter scale Jaguar).

One other thing to keep in mind is that no one had even thought of doing aggressive use of a trem back then so of course they weren’t designed to do so. They certainly weren’t designed for things like dive bombs.

These are really nice, well designed guitars once initially setup.

I purchased a new Squier VM Jazzmaster in 2012 and a new VM Jaguar in 2013. Replaced nothing on either guitar. Both are still stock other than putting a set of Fender ‘62 pickups in the Jazzmaster and a set of Fender ‘65 pickups in the Jag ( only done to get them closer to the vintage sound). After doing the initial setup I have had to make no further adjustments to them in the over 10 years I have had them. Very stable guitars.

Sorry for the long post.

Here I was with my old Jazzmaster back in college in 1965.

 

[john_t]

A very timely thread...

I wasn't getting along with 11s on my Johnny Marr, so last night I changed them out to a set of Super Slinky (9-42).

I was getting the plinky buzzes, so I went the extra step to re-set the intonation. During the process, the bass side adjustment screw jammed, and the post inset started spinning.

Looks like I'm buying a new bridge.

Going from 10's (my usual preference) to 11's did make a difference with my CP Jag - i.e. less buzzing. There is still some weird buzz/plink unplugged, but not audible when plugged in. You may have raised the post screw so high that it may have come off the bridge - that's what happened to me when I tried to use the AmPro bridge; the height maxed out.

 

[Chuckster]

Going from 10's (my usual preference) to 11's did make a difference with my CP Jag - i.e. less buzzing. There is still some weird buzz/plink unplugged, but not audible when plugged in. You may have raised the post screw so high that it may have come off the bridge - that's what happened to me when I tried to use the AmPro bridge; the height maxed out.

Yes, it seems that way, then the pressed flange on the post failed and started spinning. Argh#!?#£€¿

I've done a lot of setups, but never on a Jag. I guess this is learning the hard way. Grateful that it's on my guitar and not someone else's.

Also grateful for the help and info here... 'preciate it.

 

[BorderRadio]

Going from 10's (my usual preference) to 11's did make a difference with my CP Jag - i.e. less buzzing. There is still some weird buzz/plink unplugged, but not audible when plugged in. You may have raised the post screw so high that it may have come off the bridge - that's what happened to me when I tried to use the AmPro bridge; the height maxed out.

A properly set up AmPro, Staytrem, Mustang or stock bridge would never max out. They need to be set in the proper thimble cup to work properly, and the range of adjustment on the post screw is more than enough.

Yes, it seems that way, then the pressed flange on the post failed and started spinning. Argh#!?#£€¿
View attachment 1209804

I've done a lot of setups, but never on a Jag. I guess this is learning the hard way. Grateful that it's on my guitar and not someone else's.

Also grateful for the help and info here... 'preciate it.

That sucks. If you’re the original owner I’d reach out to Fender for a replacement. Otherwise the bridge should still work. The nylon was designed to keep the bridge post from self-leveling, which even if it’s spinning it should do the job just fine provided you set the height, then snug the nylon bit up to the metal frame. You might have to unscrew the nylon portion and run it through the screw a few times to clear up the threads.

 

[Chuckster]

That sucks. If you’re the original owner I’d reach out to Fender for a replacement.

I am, I bought it the same day they were released in the US, in October of 2022.

I reached out to Fender and they said it could still be under warranty but I have to bring it to an authorized service shop for assessment. The closest one is an hour away but I'm hoping I can get there soon. I'd like to get this up and running again.

 

[cyclopean]

To be fair, my offset experience is limited to Jazzmasters, and even there I prefer 11’s. I imagine a Jag’s shorter scale would tilt that preference in a heavier direction.

I’ve never spent much time with jazzmasters, but i put 11s on my tele and 13s on my jag seem to have a pretty similar amount of tension.

 

[SixStringSlinger]

I’ve never spent much time with jazzmasters, but i put 11s on my tele and 13s on my jag seem to have a pretty similar amount of tension.

Makes sense. I put 10's on all my electrics (except the JM with 11's). Most are 25.5" scale, and on my LP 10's feel almost too loose. It's not quite there, but enough that I have to adjust how I play.

What's funny's that on my Reverend Tricky Gomez (another 24.75" like my LP) 10's feel perfectly normal. I don't know is it's the six-in-line headstock and/or Bigsby making for more tension, some thing about the body size/shape that makes me play differently in a way that I don't feel the lower tension like I do on the LP.

Mike Adams swears by 12's on his Jags, and given how I like 11's on my JM I'd be tempted to give that a try if I ever get a Jag.

 

[whoanelly15]

I replaced the bridge on my JM with a Staytrem. If you're interested, I'll sell you the original bridge from mine. Only thing is that it's the wider width bridge, not the slightly narrower one that comes with newer JM Jags.

BTW, 9 gauge strings on a Jag is way too small. I use 10.5s on mine.

Obviously, there are no rules, regulations, laws, rights, wrongs, legislations or regu-strations for any of this. Every guitar and setup is different. I have one strat that can work in any tuning, and another that (for how it is set up) only likes standard. Some play gauge 7 or 8 string sets on Fender- and Gibson-length guitars. Not for me, but to each their own.

That said, I'd defy anybody to play my Jaguar and to still feel that 9-42 is too light for that guitar. It just works. And there is no downside. It may not have worked as well when I had the stock bridge and threaded steel saddles on it. I used 10-52 on it back then. It is even easier to play now with 9-42s.

 

[chris m.]

I wish I had a tensiometer to confirm, but based on feel I think that the total length of the string from tuning peg all the way to wherever it is ultimately anchored at the other end has an effect on string tension....it's not just the length from nut to bridge that determines tension, IMO. The longer that total distance, my experience is that results in more tension. For example, a JM bridge or a trapeze bridge on a 25.5" scale guitar results in higher tension than you would get from a Tune-O-Matic or Stratocaster bridge on a 25.5" scale guitar.