Truss rod feels like it’s working but doesn’t seem to affect relief

[8bit]

So I have this tele and it has the truss rod at the heel where you have to remove the neck. Because that’s a PITA and the relief seemed good enough to me, I just never really messed with it. Today I decided to give it a proper setup. And when I went to adjust the truss rod, I could “feel” it turning but it didn’t seem to affect relief. So I turned it some more. Nothing. A little more. Still nothing. So then I decide to totally loosen it to see if that gave me any change. Absolutely nada.

I’m confident I have taken it about as far as it can go in either direction and there’s still been no actual impact on relief. What gives? Could the truss rod be broken even though I’m “feeling” it working? Could the wood itself be too soft or something? It’s a maple neck fwiw. And it was purchased during the pandemic when Fender QC was less than stellar. This isn’t an issue I’ve run into before so any advice/insight would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Caffiend]

I'd put it to one side for s day and look again. Necks don't necessarily move immediately with truss rod changes which is where the 1/4 turn come back next day idea comes from.

 

[plusorminuszero]

Interesting...is the rod giving resistance
to the turning of the nut?
Is there any indication of a rattle
coming from inside? Suspend the body from the
upper bout and using the butt of your palm
give a few raps to the middle of the rear of neck.
Do this with rod loosened, and with it snugged up.

Usually if there's a disconnection problem, you can
isolate it with some rapping. Answer the first question,
this will tell you if something has let go.

I handled a Gibson with a truss rod that couldn't
hold down a set of 10's. I reasoned that the arch
above the rod was collapsed, so the rod was straight
under any tension.

It was as you say, having zero, zilch effect on the
relief except when it was loosened, making more curve
and relief than anyone would want. What I am trying to tell you is that in this case, the rod was attached at both ends
and not slipping at the hs anchor as proven by the final thread crush. I am assuming you aren't running onto any
thread end shoulder, on your Fender rod, btw. I don't know
if these rods are always made with fully threaded stock.

 

[Wallaby]

I guess I'd double- & triple-verify that the wrench is actually seated in the adjusting nut and it is actually turning?

I guess if you're removing the neck to adjust at the heel it's pretty obvious if the wrench is seated and the nut is turning, though?

Are you able to just turn the nut endlessly to tighten it without it ever meeting resistance?

 

[ruger9]

The truss rod on my #1, a '93 Am.Std. is like that. I basically can't use the truss rod. It's as loose as it can be without rattling... and luckily, that's been fine for a number of years. In the winter when the humidity drops it does buzz a little due to lack of relief, but there's nothing I can do about it. It's not terrible, it's like a 1/4-turn thing. I just live with it, because it's my #1. If it were any other guitar, I'd replace the neck.

Jeez, I hope I don't have to ever play a lighter string gauge in my old age, because that would likely be the end of that neck, for me. I play 10-52.

 

[Boreas]

What can happen is the wooden ledge where the nut rests can crush. When this happens, the nut runs out of threads. Sometimes adding a washer can help, sometimes it is necessary to remove wood and cut longer threads in the rod. StewMac has a video on this and the tools necessary to do it without temoving the rod. Best to find a tech who is familiar with the operation and has the proper tools.

StewMac Truss Rod Rescue Tools - StewMac

Fixes damaged and broken guitar truss rods. Cleans old threads, cuts new ones and even rescues rods when the adjusting nut has broken off!

www.stewmac.com

 

[Matthias]

Some necks can take a day or two to fully adjust to the truss rod. It’s also relative… A quarter turn is a very fine adjustment and the advice to go in that sort of step is good as a starter… But you might need to do that a few times to get where you want, and a quarter turn on a nut that hasn’t got to it’s effective range won’t do anything.

Necks are so different to each other. I have some that don’t really need a truss rod… They’re fine with it backed off. Others I am forever adjusting. Also, the stiffness of the nut differs. Stubborn ones don’t give you the feedback that you’d normally look for to tell if you’re doing things right. If in doubt, take it to a good tech.

 

[Peegoo]

@8bit

The rod should tighten as you turn the nut clockwise just like the handle on a water faucet. If it keeps spinning, it's broken.

 

[8bit]

Are you able to just turn the nut endlessly to tighten it without it ever meeting resistance?

@8bit

The rod should tighten as you turn the nut clockwise just like the handle on a water faucet. If it keeps spinning, it's broken.

It doesn’t just keep spinning. When I tighten it I definitely feel increasing resistance. To the point that I don’t feel comfortable turning it anymore because I’m fairly confident I’m at the truss rod’s limit. And when it gets to that point there’s been zero effect on the relief. Likewise, when I loosen it all the way there’s also zero effect on the relief.

I’m definitely no expert but I am somewhat familiar with truss rod adjustments and have never encountered anything like this before. It’s like the rod is technically “working” in there as I can feel the resistance tightening and loosening. But it’s just not actually effecting relief at all. Which is what made me wonder if it could somehow be a problem with the wood itself.

I appreciate the responses!

 

[Wallaby]

It would be worth trying this - manually apply tension to the neck to induce a little backbow, and then test tightening the adjusting nut a bit more, to see if the resistance to tightening is the same, less than, or greater than when trying without manually applying tension.

And also, if it tightens, will it hold the backbow after releasing the manually applied tension?

At 41 seconds in this video a neck is shown getting some manual help to create back bow.

 

[plusorminuszero]

It doesn’t just keep spinning. When I tighten it I definitely feel increasing resistance. To the point that I don’t feel comfortable turning it anymore because I’m fairly confident I’m at the truss rod’s limit. And when it gets to that point there’s been zero effect on the relief. Likewise, when I loosen it all the way there’s also zero effect on the relief.

I’m definitely no expert but I am somewhat familiar with truss rod adjustments and have never encountered anything like this before. It’s like the rod is technically “working” in there as I can feel the resistance tightening and loosening. But it’s just not actually effecting relief at all. Which is what made me wonder if it could somehow be a problem with the wood itself.

I appreciate the responses!

The plot thickens....reminding me of the Gibson I described
above wherein the neck just stayed the same despite increasing rod tightening, with commensurate nut resistance.

A truss rod channel has an arch. In Gibsons, they lay down a strip of curved wood, packed under the fingerboard. I guessed that in any case the rod had nothing to lever
against into a healthy back bow response. Probably the arch
shaped strip was soft wood and compressed from trauma of some sort, or movement among the laminations under the fb.

I don't recall if yours is a one piece or a two piece neck.
On one piece maple necks Fender simply routes the arch
into the neck. The stripe on the back doesn't really matter
in terms of truss operation. It's hard to believe the maple
arched route channel compressed or collapsed enough
to flatten the curve there....

I suppose there's a chance they made a bad pass with
the tool but isn't all of this mass produced using cnc by now?
In the old days that stripe on back was thinner in width
indicating smaller channels were strived for...closer to .1875"
I believe than where they are now. I never appreciated
a oversize channel relative to truss rod diameter because they will rattle and vamp strings. In the worst case
the rod could reorient itself sideways, defeating function.

???

If you relax the rod, esp. when you remove the nut, try rapping the back of neck.
This will help to indicate how snug the channel is to the rod.
An oversize route can definitely change rod response. Rattles and note vamps can be addressed by wicking through the channel some type of wood swelling resin (chair loc). A sideways leaning rod could cause real grief. tbh I haven't looked close at what 21 Century Fender is doing. The rods are, I believe,
.1875" (3/16"). How wide are the channels being cut nowadaze?

 

[Steve Holt]

Could be a one way truss rod. Those exist and typically only increase backbow to counter string tension.

 

[Randy07ACV6]

Am I missing something here?
If you take the neck off there are no strings pulling on it. Without the strings I don't know what the neck would look like as you adjusted the truss rod.

I have one Fender like that and am thankful the rod didn't need adjusting. It is a stupid design. If you remove the pickguard, is there any way enough of the adjusting end shows that you can adjust it without removing the entire neck?
Wait, this video makes it easy and fast.


I don't feel comfortable with big turns on truss rod adjusters, I go something less than 1/4 turn (with the strings on) then give it a few minutes to settle before checking it.
If I were using the directions in the video I would do the same, only less than 1/4 turn at a time. JMO.

 

[PomPomPudding]

Am I missing something here?
If you take the neck off there are no strings pulling on it. Without the strings I don't know what the neck would look like as you adjusted the truss rod.

I have one Fender like that and am thankful the rod didn't need adjusting. It is a stupid design. If you remove the pickguard, is there any way enough of the adjusting end shows that you can adjust it without removing the entire neck?
This video makes it easy and fast.


I don't feel comfortable with big turns on truss rod adjusters, I go something less than 1/4 turn (with the strings on) then give it a few minutes to settle before checking it.
If I were using the directions in the video I would do the same, only less than 1/4 turn at a time. JMO.

With Teles, you don't need to take the neck off like the guy in the video does. There's already the channel for truss rod adjustment, so you just need a proper tool.
I use a Swiss Tools offset driver, but StewMac also sells this. https://www.stewmac.com/luthier-tools-and-supplies/types-of-tools/wrenches/truss-rod-crank-for-tele/

Now, the problem is with Strats, which Leo designed it so that you actually need to remove the neck to adjust the truss rod. This is indeed a stupid design and the fact Fender still uses the same design just because "purists" would be infuriating if they "improved" it on vintage models is silly.