Clay dots

[ponce]

How did Fender process their clay dots back at the time? Did they form and bake them before glueing in or just filled the holes and let them dry on air? Does clay get hard sufficiently or even shrink and fall out that way? Was it a 'Naked gun' movie type of material or some dirt, dug in a yard behind their Fullerton facility? As you see no clay experience here.

 

[dogmeat]

they're not actually clay. they were cut from some kind of fiberboard and then cellulose, then PVC/ABS. it was something I read & I don't remember the dates when they switched

 

[Fretting out]

@Marn99 usually has pre cbs answers

And may know better details

 

[DougM]

They just gained the nickname "clay dots" 'cause of their color.

 

[Kloun]

This are close up shots of what "clay dots" look like from a pre CBS tele neck.

IMG_0844

• Kloun
• Aug 15, 2020

IMG_0843

• Kloun
• Aug 15, 2020

IMG_0842

• Kloun
• Aug 15, 2020

The dots appear to be white because they're set against a dark Brazilian rosewood board. I put a pic of it next to a white sheet of paper so you can compare the color.

Clay Dots 2

• Kloun
• Aug 14, 2020

Clay Dots 1

• Kloun
• Aug 14, 2020

P.S. I live in Orange County, CA where Fullerton is located. If you want, I'd be more than happy to go dig in the back yard and mail you authentic clay from the area.

 

[Fretting out]

If you look really close they almost have a grain to them

 

[tubegeek]

EDIT: You know, I posted this just to be silly, but of course, it's also an amazing tune with beautiful guitar picking.

 

[Marn99]

The clay dots were not clay, or any paste for that matter, at all, they were punched out white vulcanized fiberboard, it was the same material as the pickup bobbin flatwork, just white instead of black. Vulcanized fiber is nearly 100 percent cellulose, when installed, it was pretty bright white, but due to the absorbent nature of cellulose, it would quickly turn that clay color, depending on how much the guitar was played, of course, by soaking up pigments from the rosewood and finger oils. here's a picture circa 1963 of punched out clay dots being installed.

 

[EsquireOK]

They were thin vulcanized white fiberboard, not clay.

The fact that Callaham makes "clay" dots out of actual clay is one of the biggest eye-rolls in the world of aftermarket guitar parts. It's just plain ignorant on his part.

If you want a neck that has the right material, or very close to it, order from Guitar Mill. They are the only high volume made-to-order neck maker I know of who uses, or is even aware of, the proper material.

By biggest complaint about the Fender AV Series is that they got so many things so right, but still used "fake" looking tan plastic dots instead of fiberboard dots. Really cheesy looking.

 

[Marn99]

They were thin vulcanized white fiberboard, not clay.

The fact that Callaham makes "clay" dots out of actual clay is one of the biggest eye-rolls in the world of aftermarket guitar parts. It's just plain ignorant on his part.

If you want a neck that has the right material, or very close to it, order from Guitar Mill. They are the only high volume made-to-order neck maker I know of who uses, or is even aware of, the proper material.

not a lot of companies make white vulcanized fiber anymore, at least not in the quantities that are reasonable for a hobbyist. The last time I tried to buy white vulcanized fiber, they said their minimum order was, for material with a thickness of .063 in, a sheet 54 inches by 25 feet.

 

[EsquireOK]

not a lot of companies make white vulcanized fiber anymore, at least not in the quantities that are reasonable for a hobbyist. The last time I tried to buy white vulcanized fiber, they said their minimum order was, for material with a thickness of .063 in, a sheet 54 inches by 25 feet.

It's not hard to find, and anyone who could make serious use of it would have no problems buying in quantity.

Like I said, Guitar Mill bothered. So it's a matter of knowledge and will power, not availability or cost. And if anyone in the guitar world could afford to buy specialized materials in bulk, it's Fender. They just decided not to.

FWIW, it's also called fish paper, and 1/16" is too thick IME with vintage Fenders.

 

[Marn99]

It's not hard to find, and anyone who could make serious use of it would have no problems buying in quantity.

Like I said, Guitar Mill bothered. So it's a matter of knowledge and will power, not availability or cost. And if anyone in the guitar would could afford to buy specialized materials in bulk, it's Fender. They just decided not to.

Also, FWIW, it's also called fish paper, and 1/16" is too thick IME with vintage Fenders.

You are correct, .063 is on the thick side. I like to play it safe and have extra height to sand down once installed, rather than risk the, albeit small, likelihood of sanding through.

 

[Fretting out]

They were thin vulcanized white fiberboard, not clay.

The fact that Callaham makes "clay" dots out of actual clay is one of the biggest eye-rolls in the world of aftermarket guitar parts. It's just plain ignorant on his part.

If you want a neck that has the right material, or very close to it, order from Guitar Mill. They are the only high volume made-to-order neck maker I know of who uses, or is even aware of, the proper material.

By biggest complaint about the Fender AV Series is that they got so many things so right, but still used "fake" looking tan plastic dots instead of fiberboard dots. Really cheesy looking.

The way the “clay” dots on the A.V 59 look is one of the biggest reasons I didn’t buy one

Seems kind of petty but for as accurate as they were you think they could have gotten that right

To me The A.V series is like walking into a music store in that given year and buying new, those dots were not brown when new

Sorry I got off on a tangent

 

[EsquireOK]

P.S. Here's what a very shallow search turned up: https://www.etsy.com/listing/718012...MI4vaWvY756wIVQgnnCh1TswsmEAQYASABEgLLOfD_BwE.

Haven't tried that product yet, but I am curious to.

 

[EsquireOK]

The way the “clay” dots on the A.V 59 look is one of the biggest reasons I didn’t buy one

Seems kind of petty but for as accurate as they were you think they could have gotten that right

To me The A.V series is like walking into a music store in that given year and buying new, those dots were not brown when new

Sorry I got off on a tangent

Yup.

I plan on eventually sending my necks to Guitar Mill to have them replace the ones on my AV '64 Jazz and my Page Mirror Tele – at least the top dots.

That said, at least the ones on the Page are a better color. They're a slightly warm white.

 

[deytookerjaabs]

Yeah, AV series with a few tweaks would be gold.

The finishes on the necks were just too damn thick. Clay dots were wrong, IMO the pickups lacked a bit of edge/brightness and the "vintage" wire was a bit too crowned/tall. Still, great guitars. Also the veneer on the veneer board may have been a bit thicker than vintage too.

 

[old wrench]

I've seen "clay" dots made from solid surface material like Corian or Avonite.

They looked pretty darn nice, and they are something you can make yourself with a plug cutter and a drill press.

I think it might be All-Parts that sells the pre-made ones made from Corian.




.

 

[old wrench]

P.S. Here's what a very shallow search turned up: https://www.etsy.com/listing/718012...MI4vaWvY756wIVQgnnCh1TswsmEAQYASABEgLLOfD_BwE.

Haven't tried that product yet, but I am curious to.

I've used a very similar product for liners on Knife handles.

We always called it "fish paper" .

I'm pretty sure you can also buy it through McMaster-Carr.

.

 

[EsquireOK]

I've used a very similar product for liners on Knife handles.

We always called it "fish paper" .

I'm pretty sure you can also buy it through McMaster-Carr.

.

Yes, it's also called fish paper. McMaster has it, but not in white.

It's basically just pressed and bonded paper. Cellulose, for the most part.

 

[ponce]

They were thin vulcanized white fiberboard, not clay.

The fact that Callaham makes "clay" dots out of actual clay is one of the biggest eye-rolls in the world of aftermarket guitar parts. It's just plain ignorant on his part.

If you want a neck that has the right material, or very close to it, order from Guitar Mill. They are the only high volume made-to-order neck maker I know of who uses, or is even aware of, the proper material.

By biggest complaint about the Fender AV Series is that they got so many things so right, but still used "fake" looking tan plastic dots instead of fiberboard dots. Really cheesy looking.

A

They were thin vulcanized white fiberboard, not clay.

The fact that Callaham makes "clay" dots out of actual clay is one of the biggest eye-rolls in the world of aftermarket guitar parts. It's just plain ignorant on his part.

If you want a neck that has the right material, or very close to it, order from Guitar Mill. They are the only high volume made-to-order neck maker I know of who uses, or is even aware of, the proper material.

By biggest complaint about the Fender AV Series is that they got so many things so right, but still used "fake" looking tan plastic dots instead of fiberboard dots. Really cheesy looking.

That's what made me ask here. Seeing a few aftermarket companies selling real clay dots. I thought it was the real thing.What's next - a genuine snake oil for the fretboard!?