Yes, another Princeton Reverb speaker thread...

[Hoodster]

Here’s a comparison I did, with the asterisk that all 3 speakers sound MUCH better with a tube amp (the Quilter is quite muffled in comparison):

 

[BobbyMac]

You just cannot go wrong with the Celestion Gold 10" speaker. The Princeton Reverb amp is meant to have a clean and pristine sound and the Gold 10" lets you go all the way to 10 with that sweet, sweet Princeton clean tone. There are other great speakers but the Celestion Gold 10" is the one you want in your Princeton!

 

[Bob Arbogast]

The original speaker is a CTS ceramic - it actually sounds pretty dang good. It appears to have a felt dust cap - which I didn't know was a thing on these old speakers... possibly reconed?

I had a '64 Super Reverb with original Jensen C10R speakers. They had flat felt dustcaps.

 

[Dacious]

I know this has been discussed endlessly but hey after 2 feet of snow, I'm a little bored..

I was able to score a vintage PR (Dec 64) back in the fall from one of my local shops. It was basically untouched, so it needed a proper service and cleanup. Now it's running great!

The original speaker is a CTS ceramic - it actually sounds pretty dang good. It appears to have a felt dust cap - which I didn't know was a thing on these old speakers... possibly reconed?

Naturally the speaker wonder bug has gotten me and I've started trying some different options. I'm in a tricky spot because I'm mostly using this amp at home (DR and up for most gigs) but I'd like to use this on some small jams/gigs. Trying to find the middle ground that maintains the amps sweetness but just a little more headroom.. I play singer/songwriter, blues, jazz, pop, light rock...

I've been able to test the amp through the following speakers...

10F150-T (well broken in... nice but too loud/strident)
GA-SC64 (pretty close in sound to the original speaker minus some sparkle)
WGS G10C (just wasn't feeling it...)

Do I need to try the Alnico Gold?!

What's in your PR in 2022?!

All speakers will take a while to break in. They sound stiff and lack dynamics when new.

The Gold is a great speaker but it's nothing like a Jensen or any other BF era Fender. It's really a high wattage Blue made in 10" and 12" sizes. You are likely to find it lacking sparkle and Fender-ness. Not to say you will hate it.

 

[PooTwang]

66 PR OG Jensen C10n.

 

[knavel]

I have a 67 Princeton Reverb with a C10 Gold. So that's my vote. My brother's 58 Harvard with a C10 Gold is the finest amp I've ever heard.

I would mention that a C10 Gold will noticeably add more weight to your amp, if that is a concern.

 

[2L man]

Yeah, that's my dilemma.. I'd say this amp is 75% home and 25% small gigs.

I've been curious about the 1028k - I bet it has really nice feel and sparkle but breaks up pretty quick?

A friend of mine has a Copperhead in his original 65 PR... it's used as a house amp at a weekly jam. He runs it with a 12AT7 in V1 for more headroom... It does sound pretty great... Been curious how the Copperhead stacks up against the 1058.

Best low and mid volume 10" american sounds for fenders I get from P10R-F. Best compromise 10" speaker for all sounds and volumes is Tornado 100 but for fenders it is great. Neodyms compess more than Ceramics and less than alnicos but 10" Tornado seems to compress more than other Neos.

 

[uriah1]

Ya. Go for the gold

I thought it had pretty much , ya. The CTS have spankier mid.
The new celestion creamback has some too, and keeps up with
band , however, some of high end chime is not as present,
but still nice. You can look at some Amp mfg too.
Dr Z and SUpro have their own line of modded 10 speakers.

 

[eastendmartinguy]

I had a '64 Super Reverb with original Jensen C10R speakers. They had flat felt dustcaps.

Wow... maybe the felt is why I find this CTS a little "sweeter"

I have a 67 Princeton Reverb with a C10 Gold. So that's my vote. My brother's 58 Harvard with a C10 Gold is the finest amp I've ever heard.

I would mention that a C10 Gold will noticeably add more weight to your amp, if that is a concern

C10 Jensen? Or Gold Celestion?

Best low and mid volume 10" american sounds for fenders I get from P10R-F. Best compromise 10" speaker for all sounds and volumes is Tornado 100 but for fenders it is great. Neodyms compess more than Ceramics and less than alnicos but 10" Tornado seems to compress more than other Neos.

Have you tried the Tornado in a PR? 100 watts seems crazy but I will say, it sounds like one of the best tones in the Jensen line up when I listened to the clips...

 

[eastendmartinguy]

C10N, same one used in the Brownface editions...a killer combination.

I understand wanting to stay with the 10", they are punchier and more focused. If you do that, I suggest moving the amp farther away from you to take advantage of the smaller sound cone and let it open up before it reaches the ears. The speaker will sound
better that way.

I have noticed that! Big difference.

Weber 10F150T.

If you dig the original CTS ceramic, you might really like the WGS Veteran 10 for home use. I tried one in mine and thought it had great vintage character. Super-sweet cleans, and I loved the way it transitioned to breakup. Perfect recording speaker if you love the sound of records made with Fender amps in the early-mid 70s, which I do. Not all cone breakup is created equal, and the Vet 10 does it really well. I really wanted to make that speaker work in this amp but it didn't have enough stage presence to make the amp really usable as a primary gigging amp, so I went with the Weber and am always glad I did whenever I play the amp out. I find most of the complaints about the Webers being "strident" or similar tend to be moot on stage.

You've got a Deluxe, though, so if the sweetness you're after comes from an inefficient, vintage-style speaker, who cares? How much more hassle is it really to carry a Deluxe to a gig than a Princeton? Both amps are in the "guitar in one hand, amp in the other" realm.

Yeah, I bet the "strident" thing of the 10150T would cut through any mix at a gig... this is why I was hesitant to give up on it.. I found myself getting a headache with it at home.

You're right re: Deluxe...

 

[eastendmartinguy]

I don’t find the 1028 breakup too early, but again, home volumes. I will say that it’s a very smooth, pleasing breakup.

The 1058 and Copperhead are close siblings, with the CH having more strident mids.

I'll check out the video! Which would you say sparkles more? In order... 1028, 1058, Copperhead?

My friend has the Copperhead in his '65 and it cuts nicely in a live situation

1058 seems more natural but wasn't sure if it has the sparkle

 

[darkwaters]

Mine currently has an alnico 10” that came from a mid 60s Gibson Skylark. Love it!

If something happens to it I’d get an Eminence 1028K.

 

[Hoodster]

I'll check out the video! Which would you say sparkles more? In order... 1028, 1058, Copperhead?

My friend has the Copperhead in his '65 and it cuts nicely in a live situation

1058 seems more natural but wasn't sure if it has the sparkle

Yes, that order for sparkle, with the two ceramic being pretty close and the alnico way ahead.

1028, 1058, Copperhead

I will also add that as much as I love the Fat Jimmy so far, it’s only been a couple of weeks so it could be honeymoon phase, but on the other hand it will probably get even better once it is broken in.

The 1028 I have played pretty much daily for a couple of years. It is a Mojotone branded 1028P, which is the same as the 1028K other than having a paper former. You can still special order them that way through Eminence. It’s what Fender used as their blue frame alnico in the late 90s in the Bassmans and Pro Juniors. I had been looking for one for years because I’d had an experience at a music store where I plugged a Lester straight into a tweed Pro Junior with the blue frame and turned it up about halfway, and it was honestly one of the greatest guitar tones I have ever heard.

 

[sudogeek]

The 1058 and Copperhead are close siblings, with the CH having more strident mids

The GA10 is a bit brighter and a typical Fender mid-scooped tone. The Copperhead has more mids and is, for what it’s worth, more “meaty.” Now I have the GA10 in the PR and the CH in an extension cabinet which I use as a second speaker for the PR (sort of a Vibrolux junior) or as the main speaker for my Quilter. Sounds great. I wouldn’t say strident but that speaker is well broken in.

 

[knavel]

C10 Jensen? Or Gold Celestion?

Brain freeze: I meant G10 not C10 (i.e., Celestion Gold)

 

[eastendmartinguy]

Brain freeze: I meant G10 not C10 (i.e., Celestion Gold)

Haha... ok, both would make sense... but the G10 is a little easier to find!

The GA10 is a bit brighter and a typical Fender mid-scooped tone. The Copperhead has more mids and is, for what it’s worth, more “meaty.” Now I have the GA10 in the PR and the CH in an extension cabinet which I use as a second speaker for the PR (sort of a Vibrolux junior) or as the main speaker for my Quilter. Sounds great. I wouldn’t say strident but that speaker is well broken in.

Cool... all good flavors. The GAs are very nice speakers but I find them to be kind of "dirty" speakers than their sensitivity would lead on..

I'm curious on the Copperhead vs. 1058..

I'll check out the video! Which would you say sparkles more? In order... 1028, 1058, Copperhead?

Yes, that order for sparkle, with the two ceramic being pretty close and the alnico way ahead.

1028, 1058, Copperhead

I will also add that as much as I love the Fat Jimmy so far, it’s only been a couple of weeks so it could be honeymoon phase, but on the other hand it will probably get even better once it is broken in.

The 1028 I have played pretty much daily for a couple of years. It is a Mojotone branded 1028P, which is the same as the 1028K other than having a paper former. You can still special order them that way through Eminence. It’s what Fender used as their blue frame alnico in the late 90s in the Bassmans and Pro Juniors. I had been looking for one for years because I’d had an experience at a music store where I plugged a Lester straight into a tweed Pro Junior with the blue frame and turned it up about halfway, and it was honestly one of the greatest guitar tones I have ever heard.

Cool. I have access to my friends Copperhead to test with my amp. I thought the Copperhead would out sparkle the 1058..

Totally understand the honeymoon phase! The FJ speakers are cool. I feel like they have one foot in the tweed sound? For some reason my ear has never been drawn to the WGS speakers that I've tried so far. Maybe my guitars, touch, etc... Nice folks though!

Wow on the 1028k... I've always heard those blue Alnicos were very special and sound a little better than the current 1028k build. I don't know much about what the paper former would do but that's cool you can still order that!

There's a CTS Alnico 10" for sale locally... also tempting.

 

[Deathray]

I have a 10” Celestion Gold in my ‘65 PRRI. Absolutely love it. It just sings! My other amps are gathering dust.

 

[telepraise]

A few years back when I was ready to get a Princeton (lugging a DRRI was overkill for what I was doing) I researched speaker threads and remember reading several times that the Celestion gold was a magical pairing with that amp. I ended up with a 12" special edition PRRI so my choices were a little different (and more $$). I found a cream alnico gave me incredible cleans and a break up tone that only Celestion can do. It also has a very open and well-dispersed sound for a small cabinet. I now know what all the fuss is about with Celestion speakers.

 

[knavel]

Haha... ok, both would make sense... but the G10 is a little easier to find!

Despite my error, it's fairly clear which speaker I meant particularly since I mentioned the weight issue. I am one of those people that are repelled by clever names like "Cannibus Rex", etc when it comes to speakers and, as with all of my non recording gear, if the company didn't exist in 1961,

I don't buy the product (and this date would go back further but I didn't want to cut out Mosrite). It's amazing to me how much about sound, speakers, pickups, amps, effects, etc people know today, how many zillions of specialist boutique products there are; yet at the same time there hardly any interesting music versus 1966 when even the worst song seemed to have musical value and people had a far greater sense of melody and harmony. The record collections of most everyone on this forum would agree in a de facto sense with my pigheadedness.

So, it's either Jensen or Celestion for me but the modern Jensens take work to get up to sonic speed; Celestion golds rock out of the box.

 

[King Fan]

I always say "which speaker" threads are like "which fiancée" threads. No one else has your needs or wants, but it's expensive and painful to keep switching.

The first thing to define is your efficiency / volume goals. Always central, but especially in a PR. Then you might as well look at 'available?' -- the Fat Jimmy 10 above gets pretty strong love in PRs, but only if you can find one. You can decide if you like vintage speakers with their fragile cones but mellow charms. And then you might as well discuss price. If you can afford 'em, that's great, but if you don't love the expensive speaker you get, you want to be ready to sell it on efficiently but without too much loss.

Back at the fiancée, a practical approach is to play the field before you get engaged. Decide what you can afford. Pick "too loud" or "too soft" (not a date thing, a speaker thing), and then buy some speakers dinner (that's a date thing).

I've tried eight 10" speakers (and some 12s in other cabs). The 10s I tried: WGS Veteran 10. Legend 1028P and 1028K. That Fat Jimmy. A *cheapo* Celestion. '70s CTS alnico 10. Weber 10A100T. Weber 10A125. Each got some love in threads like this. I liked five of 'em; in the end I married one. It wasn't the Legends, actually, but FWIW they became my 'gold standard' for comparison. But note, I'm a household player.