Why do people pay more than they should for reissues?

Status
Not open for further replies.

BoomTexan

Tele-Meister
Joined
Sep 20, 2021
Posts
371
Age
19
Location
Houston
Supro in particular is horrible with this, but this applies to Fender with their Champ and Princeton reissues. Their new amps are FAR MORE EXPENSIVE than the vintage ones they're based on. I get it, the 1978 Princeton Amp isn't the exact same as a 2022 Princeton Reverb '68 Reissue, but they're the same price and one is handwired in the USA, and the other isn't!

Here's a 1959 Super 1606 for $600 shipped and with tax (but you could probably talk him down) https://reverb.com/item/60664966-supro-1606-1959-not-reissue

Here's a Super 1606 Reissue new. It is based on the version that was released like 3 years after the 1959 one, but I'll get to that soon. It's $750 BEFORE tax and shipping.

Here's the 1961 Super 606. This is the amp that the 1606 Reissue was actually based on (confusing names here). It's roughly the same price as the reissue, but it is vintage and absolutely gorgeous, and I'd buy this in a heartbeat over the 1606 Reissue.
 

monkeybanana

Tele-Afflicted
Joined
Aug 6, 2016
Posts
1,522
Location
mmhmm
If you try building an amp on your own it gets expensive fast. Sure they get the parts at a volume discount but it might make you appreciate the prices more. You can support a smaller builder but you will have to pay them even more. There is a lot of time involved both on the build and sourcing the right parts.

Vintage Champs and Princetons especially pre-CBS are getting pretty expensive. And a real '68 would fetch more than a '78.

It's pretty cool the options we have these days.
 

Telekarster

Poster Extraordinaire
Joined
Aug 14, 2019
Posts
6,576
Location
Earth
I suppose it depends. Vintage amps can be iffy vs. new made with warranty etc. I've passed on vintage amps many times for this reason. I'm not a tech so I'd have to have someone fix it if something went wrong, and that can get pricy really fast and coupled with what I've paid for the amp, I'd probably be in the hole vs. if I'd just bought new. And if one is a working musician, the last thing you want is to have your main amp crap out on stage cause a cap or OT just fried. Plus if it's a valuable vintage amp, I'm not sure I'd risk it anyway. While I dearly love the vintage ones, I'd rather have the new made FWIW ;)
 

InstantCoffeeBlue

Tele-Holic
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Posts
793
Age
37
Location
Milwaukee, WI
As far as the Fender 65 PRRI goes, people buy it because it's a good amp

Yup, good amp that's built to pro-grade standards (just ask the countless touring musicians and Nashville cats who play them every night), known quantity, warranty (if buying new). Not everyone is interested in the "romance" of old amps, and I say this as someone who owns and gigs vintage gear. It requires a similar mindset as daily-driving an older car. I mean, yeah, a Volvo 240 or even something domestic or a Honda from the 90s might be "cheaper" than a late model used Corolla but you better be willing to at the very least do basic wrenching on stuff like worn out suspension parts and be willing to scour a junkyard once in a while and probably have a relationship with a good indie mechanic in your back pocket for when (not if) something bigger breaks, and you better be paying attention to sounds and subtle signs because something will break and paying attention can be the difference between $ and $$$$$. That level of commitment isn't for everyone, and that's totally fine.
 

ReverendRevolver

Friend of Leo's
Joined
Feb 2, 2019
Posts
3,578
Location
Ohio (Nerk)
I'm sure there are typically many reasons people do this. What's already been mentioned certainly has merit, but also availability and ease of purchase. Last month I bought my first new (as in not used) guitar since the early 2000s. Because that was the only way I could get it.
Amps on the other hand, of the past 5, one was used. The 2 most recent were custom made by 2 different companies, a Supro BK12 before those, a used Peavey C30 that I didn't keep before that, and a Bugera V5i before that.
But tines have changed since I started playing in 1999.
Then you could pick up SF Fenders for dirt.

Now?
Not so much. But Fender current production stuff is available at the same cost (used) as oddball barely desirable vintage Fender (music master bass, champ 12, red knob stuff...). I'm talking HRdlx/Bdlx, Deville, "59basdman RI". Actual 90s to present production run stuff. Typically vintage reissue stuff goes for less used than vintage (which is also just a used amp for the most part, but easier to get fixed). So $$ and availability.

Fenders different from Supro and Ampeg, both of which you can absolutely luck into the vintage model or reissue for nearly identical prices.
With Ampeg, 100% I'd go vintage. Gemini? Reverb rocket? Sign me up, theyre great, and the reissues are almost as good. Supro? Depends on the model. I haven't sat in a store plugged into all the reissues or more than probably 6 vintage ones. They just don't come up thst often, which is my last idea.

Being able to test the amp helps sell the amp. Easier to find the reissue (availability) then order a used one on Reverb if you like it.

The shocking thing to me about Fender "tweed reissue " stuff is that you can get ANYTHING made for you for about $750 to $1300. 5e3, 5e5a, lp twin, 5f6a, champ, princeton, etc.
OR you can buy the one that says Fender on it for twice that ($2400 for 5e3, $1600 champ, etc ).

Everyone has reasons. I just want to own 1 of everything ;)
 

codamedia

Poster Extraordinaire
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Posts
6,160
Location
Western Canada
Not everyone is interested in the "romance" of old amps,

That is a very difficult notion for a forum full of vintage enthusiasts. I would also suggest that not everybody is buying amps as an investment... they are just toys for some, and tools for others.

I get it, the 1978 Princeton Amp isn't the exact same as a 2022 Princeton Reverb '68 Reissue, but they're the same price and one is handwired in the USA, and the other isn't!

The new RI is going to sound good and be trouble free for many years, the vintage amp may still require a fair amount of work/money to enjoy it. Buying vintage amps is a gamble, especially for those that don't know how to troubleshoot & fix stuff themselves.
 
Last edited:

BoomTexan

Tele-Meister
Joined
Sep 20, 2021
Posts
371
Age
19
Location
Houston
I should rephrase this. Two people has answered the question so far, their answer was that they have warranties, they're popular, and they're easier to purchase. The other answer was marketing.

I guess my post seemed to be calling out people that bought reissues, and I didn't start it intending to sound like that, but as i unearthed a vintage Supro and saw that a new one was the same cost I because pretty infuriated. It's a dirt cheap amp and shouldn't cost that much. Same goes for the 5F1 and 5E3 reissues. Fender is trying to sell you an amp for 1600 that I could make myself for 250 or buy from a boutique amp maker for 750.

I understand the Bassman reissues, Supro Thunderbolt reissues, and a lot of other valuable vintage amp reissues that are hard to build costing so much, but I just feel that the 5F1, 5E3, and 1606 reissues are horribly overpriced for what they are and what goes into making them.

Not blaming the people who buy them, blaming the companies for overpricing them.
 

nojazzhere

Doctor of Teleocity
Ad Free Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
Posts
19,033
Age
71
Location
Foat Wuth, Texas
I should rephrase this. Two people has answered the question so far, their answer was that they have warranties, they're popular, and they're easier to purchase. The other answer was marketing.

I guess my post seemed to be calling out people that bought reissues, and I didn't start it intending to sound like that, but as i unearthed a vintage Supro and saw that a new one was the same cost I because pretty infuriated. It's a dirt cheap amp and shouldn't cost that much. Same goes for the 5F1 and 5E3 reissues. Fender is trying to sell you an amp for 1600 that I could make myself for 250 or buy from a boutique amp maker for 750.

I understand the Bassman reissues, Supro Thunderbolt reissues, and a lot of other valuable vintage amp reissues that are hard to build costing so much, but I just feel that the 5F1, 5E3, and 1606 reissues are horribly overpriced for what they are and what goes into making them.

Not blaming the people who buy them, blaming the companies for overpricing them.
With all due respect, a short lesson in free-market economics may be needed. The MARKET determines general pricing. (of anything) A manufacturer has certain "set" costs in parts, labor and overhead. Those are largely the factors in what they "ask" for their product. If no one wants to BUY at that price point, the manufacturer either lowers the price, or makes a different product.....it's basically simple. The "market" determines if a price is reasonable or not. (not us on a discussion website.) ;););)
 

stormsedge

Poster Extraordinaire
Silver Supporter
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Posts
7,342
Location
E. Tennessee, USA
Two people has answered the question so far, their answer was that they have warranties, they're popular, and they're easier to purchase. The other answer was marketing.

Not blaming the people who buy them, blaming the companies for overpricing them.

Another category (and I fall into this one)...see it, want it, don't need it, but have the cash or a way to generate the cash---boom. Short version--GAS.

I attribute my Supro Statesman and matching 2x12 to ^^this^^...because despite its complete coolness, versatility and a relatively good price (bought used)...it is WAY more amp than I need. ((my Supro BK10 and Fender Excelsior were pure GAS too.))

Collect them all, trade with your friends.
 
Last edited:

teletail

Friend of Leo's
Joined
Aug 25, 2019
Posts
4,294
Age
73
Location
West By God Virginia
I should rephrase this. Two people has answered the question so far, their answer was that they have warranties, they're popular, and they're easier to purchase. The other answer was marketing.

I guess my post seemed to be calling out people that bought reissues, and I didn't start it intending to sound like that, but as i unearthed a vintage Supro and saw that a new one was the same cost I because pretty infuriated. It's a dirt cheap amp and shouldn't cost that much. Same goes for the 5F1 and 5E3 reissues. Fender is trying to sell you an amp for 1600 that I could make myself for 250 or buy from a boutique amp maker for 750.

I understand the Bassman reissues, Supro Thunderbolt reissues, and a lot of other valuable vintage amp reissues that are hard to build costing so much, but I just feel that the 5F1, 5E3, and 1606 reissues are horribly overpriced for what they are and what goes into making them.

Not blaming the people who buy them, blaming the companies for overpricing them.
Are you infuriated with restaurants that sell you a hamburger for $7.50 that you could make yourself for $1.00?
 

blowtorch

Telefied
Ad Free Member
Joined
May 2, 2003
Posts
42,150
Location
Wisco
there is always the factor of more money than common sense at play, also

me included, only relatively recently
I guess it's a nice, if somewhat disconcerting, problem to have
 

bottlenecker

Poster Extraordinaire
Joined
Dec 6, 2015
Posts
7,174
Location
Wisconsin
Supro in particular is horrible with this, but this applies to Fender with their Champ and Princeton reissues. Their new amps are FAR MORE EXPENSIVE than the vintage ones they're based on. I get it, the 1978 Princeton Amp isn't the exact same as a 2022 Princeton Reverb '68 Reissue, but they're the same price and one is handwired in the USA, and the other isn't!

Here's a 1959 Super 1606 for $600 shipped and with tax (but you could probably talk him down) https://reverb.com/item/60664966-supro-1606-1959-not-reissue

Here's a Super 1606 Reissue new. It is based on the version that was released like 3 years after the 1959 one, but I'll get to that soon. It's $750 BEFORE tax and shipping.

Here's the 1961 Super 606. This is the amp that the 1606 Reissue was actually based on (confusing names here). It's roughly the same price as the reissue, but it is vintage and absolutely gorgeous, and I'd buy this in a heartbeat over the 1606 Reissue.

One is currently being produced, while the other has a finite number in existence, so...
Shhhhh.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.




New Posts

Top