Why are solderless cable kits so expensive?

MatsEriksson

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BTW a staunch supporter of anything solderless and especially George L's solderless plug and cables. Mr tone hound Eric Johnson himself, in full bloom (ha!) A HoB concert, one of his 3 leads in his setup goes south and that's that familiar crackling noise when something goes in and out of earth/ground. After introductory number he swaps cables at his rigs, or remove the failing one and reconnects:



At 4:48 he strikes out with his arms in the air and shakes his head at the buzzing crackling noises....at 6:11 song ends and the pause is used to removing faulty cables and/or re-route his channels.

So much for solderless...:twisted: yeah they got that crackling sound of squarewaves that only George L's are capable of. Unmistakingly unique toanz...[sorry, couldn't resist] no one else does it like them! :D
 

MatsEriksson

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I recommend using a sharp knife instead of the provided wire cutter though.
Only this makes me think it's a no-go. PROVIDED CUTTER doesn't even cut it? You must find out another way to fix it ?!! FFS. And George L's ? They provide a plethora of tools that you can buy on their website. Give me a break.

The only thing solderless works, and soldering joints are forbidden/prohibited are on all airplanes or commercial aircraft. They must be clamped so the wires can still function if heat from fire cause the solder to float...being cramped by hardened steel clamps keeps them running for much longer, albeit it's a longer time before they'll fail. Eventually they will fail too, but then you can still manage signals through them...
 

VintageSG

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Have you bought chips recently? ;)
The dear stuff's cheaper than chips, these days.

When I were a lad, a bag of chips'n'bits was nine new pence. The winter of discontent brought inflation to silly figures, and overnight, they went up to fifteen new pence!
Since then, the prices have risen to astronomic levels!. One pound fifty! £1.50 for chips'n'bits!
Actually, fifty years of inflation later, that's not bad for a hot meal. Haddock though. Don't get me started on the rise in cost of a battered haddie, it cod end in tears. There's still a plaice in my heart for proper chippie chips.
 

tomasz

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Only this makes me think it's a no-go. PROVIDED CUTTER doesn't even cut it? You must find out another way to fix it ?!! FFS. And George L's ? They provide a plethora of tools that you can buy on their website. Give me a break.

Busted. Applying that logic, you wouldnt buy a car, because it comes with a factory windshield wiping fluid, that is not the best out there? Come on, it's still 18 euros for a decent kit of 10 plugs and a cable. If they wouldn't add that cutter, you wouldn't even bother raising that ;)
 

Nogoodnamesleft

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The only time I had an issue with a solderless cable was during sound check for a gig. One clean cut and a twist (George Ls 90 connector) to be back in business was an easy trade off and it never failed again.

Coming from an EE background where I’d had good solder technique drilled into me I was initially sceptical of the whole solderless thing. But I was proven wrong.

As someone else mentioned, cable density is nice with them too.
 

Si G X

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I've never used them, but I would guess the cost of designing, prototyping and manufacturing a solderless jack would be a fairly expensive operation, compared to any other 'off the shelf' jack.
 

somebodyelseuk

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When I were a lad, a bag of chips'n'bits was nine new pence. The winter of discontent brought inflation to silly figures, and overnight, they went up to fifteen new pence!
Since then, the prices have risen to astronomic levels!. One pound fifty! £1.50 for chips'n'bits!
Actually, fifty years of inflation later, that's not bad for a hot meal. Haddock though. Don't get me started on the rise in cost of a battered haddie, it cod end in tears. There's still a plaice in my heart for proper chippie chips.
Ah yes... by the time I understood the concept of money, we'd joined the Common Market (not the same as the EU (formed in 92)) and decimalisation, so "new pence" were just 'pence' to me, though I do remember shillings and half crowns (I think) still being legal tender.
My references for inflation... early '80s when 20 fags were about 78p, a gallon of petrol being about 1.50 when I started driving later in the 80s and guitar strings, which cost pretty much the same now as they did in 83, curiously.
Last time I went to the chippie, about a year ago, cost me near as f***it a fiver for sausage, chips and gravy. They look at you funny when you ask for the gravy over the chips, too, but that's Southerners for you.
 

MatsEriksson

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Busted. Applying that logic, you wouldnt buy a car, because it comes with a factory windshield wiping fluid, that is not the best out there? ;)
No not as long there are other cars cheaper that doesn't have to use factory windshield wiping fluid:

George L: You must buy extra stress relief jackets:

Skärmavbild 2021-11-25 kl. 18.31.33.png


Have anyone thought of the warranty of these cables? can't find any info on any site. They just go "you must have assembled them wrong" and they absolutely leave it at that. At that price one would expect them walk that extra mile...

My local music shop had lifetime warranty, and as such built in in price. They sold molded instrument guitar cables, at medium price, and they had their brand stamped on them. After 5 years, it was dead, took it with me, to the shop, they looked at their branding, threw it in their dust bin, and gave me a new one in a sealed package. still works today after 9 yers. No words exchanged. No questions asked. Many uses this technique although i would refrain from sending a cable back to Thomann after 5-6 years.

I did so with ONE EBS patch cable too, the other year but that was dead on arrival. 1 out of 10.

When do we see this warranty with the solderless guys? If there's a break INSIDE that cable (I even had a thick George L that had an invisible break inside it along it's 3 meter length) that is not caused by faulty assembly, well good luck with claiming warranty!

I'd better buy these small square patch cables, and buy a few extras. spares. Just like batteries or strings. Cost the same. And regarding patch cable that are an inch or two I hear no diff between George L's or anything else solderless.
 
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MatsEriksson

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If "quality" solderless came at two thirds of the price (i e more than half cheaper) of the cheapest "bad quality" Asian molded/sealed or soldered cables, there might have been some slight merit to it, but as long as it doesn't they're kind of moot, futile and silly. Why solderless are way more expensive than soldered/molded beats me. Big time.

 
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MatsEriksson

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And also I find it peculiar when people tells us they can hear diff between solder blobbed input plugs and solderless. The pedals do consists of lots of solder points and blobs inside the pedal (any, analog or digital) and a 2-3 solder blobs less in the chain would make significant impact on the sound? No way, Jose.

If so, why isn't there any pedal maker that makes the intestants on the circuit board totally free of solder and see how well these will fare?

:twisted:

I'll challenge anyone on a blind test any day.

If there should be any advantage to solderless it would be that, that everything inside a pedal is solder free. I've had many more hardwired input/output jacks on circuit boards go south, because of the solder points have cracked and slipped, and had to do a re-soldering with a firm blob of solder. It's the mechanical in-out wear that wreaks havoc on the points on the board. Especially Wah wah pedals. With their inane solution of having a square printed circuit board align up with the metal chassi of a wah pedal that isn't in a straight 90 degree angle.

By and large, these pedals does not ever pose a problem with solder joints cracking and losing contact:

Skärmavbild 2021-11-27 kl. 09.35.39.png


The input/output jacks are separated from the circuit board. Note how the walls of the wah pedals tapers out, and is not a 90 degree angle. But here you can mount jacks to follow that level, and has wires soldered to them that goes to the circuit board. But on these ones:

Skärmavbild 2021-11-27 kl. 09.37.38.png


The output/input jacks are 90 degree angled and mounted to the circuit board with maybe 6 solder joints, but attaching those to the walls that are NOT 90 degrees straight leaves them askewed whenever all washers and tighening rings have been applied. Which induces undue stress on the circuit board in one direction. After a year, you have to open them up, and re-solder, and re-flow, because they have slowly mechanically worn and cracked. The plastic ring, casing shows cracks in them too.

Add on top of this, if you use solderless cables too. Then, what's the point? You hear some crackling, and suspects it's the assembly of the solderless, but it's not, it's the one above, and you keep on troubleshooting on it, until hell freezes over. Of course, this has not to do with soldered or solderless patch-cables.

I've modded many modern wah pedals back to their pre-1990 design. They never came back for repair after that.
 

Cyberi4n

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All my cables are Solderless. Had them for years. No issues with signal loss over soldered patch leads, and I find it much easier to make cables quickly and on the fly - although that’s the only real benefit. I think I paid £40 each for both sets, which give me a total of 20 right-angle plugs. That was some years ago though, and they’ve lasted well since then. Each to their own eh

FD19320F-82F0-4E6C-80D5-D8ED073EF22B.jpeg
 

Matthias

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They’re (over) charging for convenience.

I use Rean soldered pancake connectors and Van Damme cables for patch leads. They’re solid and cheap enough to make spares at different sizes. There are some good YouTube videos on wiring cables.
 

Rich_S

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For the record, I ended up going with Rean plugs from Parts Express, pancakes for the side-jack pedals and short-bodied straight plugs for the back of the MS-3. I've been making cables for almost 50 years. Might as well take advantage of my skeels and not pay the premium for convenience.
 




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