Where to buy PCB ASSEMBLY DSP56725 for Fender Super Champ X2

Discussion in 'Amp Tech Center' started by TonySS, Oct 27, 2019.

  1. beninma

    beninma Friend of Leo's

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    You're still making some assumption that the problem has something to do with that chip.

    I am an engineer.. I looked at your PDF, it doesn't necessarily look like that chip has anything you can flash. It looks like implementing it requires supporting hardware on the logic board. That DSP chip on your board could be 100% functional.

    If Fender doesn't document a way to do a firmware upgrade it's possible you can't actually flash the firmware at all. They could have used something that can't be re-written.

    If it's flashable you can make an assumption and try that if you can get the code. But you might need special tools/hardware/software to flash the chip. Those could cost more than a new amp. Heck they could cost 10x or 100x what the amp cost. And it'd all be a waste if the assumption the problem had to do with that chip was wrong.
     
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  2. Digital Larry

    Digital Larry Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

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    IMO the most likely thing to go poot on such a beast is the power supply. It doesn't help anything as far as getting it repaired, and I may be wrong of course. On the flip side, SMT things which regularly get hot and cool off like CPUs and graphics chips on PC display cards put a lot of stress on solder joints which can fail mechanically. I'm not sure why anyone assumes that one would have to know how to program such a device to repair it.

    In any case, they don't appear to have been designed for servicing by whatever MTBF calculation vs. warranty thing the counters of beans decide should be in place.
     
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  3. Pasta Player

    Pasta Player Tele-Meister Ad Free Member

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    From OP post, I do assume that the amp is powering up - just no sound?
    And we're not certain that it is the "DSP card".

    And perhaps now becoming a matter of reading comprehension regarding this comment:
    You're still making some assumption that the problem has something to do with that chip”.

    No, I’m not. As previously stated here: “before I’d only suspect & remove / replace the chip, I would check all of the capacitors (and everything else before assuming that it was the chip itself).”

    “If Fender doesn't document a way to do a firmware upgrade it's possible you can't actually flash the firmware at all.

    Perhaps true. Perhaps not. But it seems rather odd that Fender would actually provide the Firmware (v1.2) for download by users, on the previously noted support page (https://fuse.fender.com/superchamp/support/ )… if it required costly special tools/hardware/software to implement. But I could easily be mistaken. *Seems that I remember Fender detailing the installation / re-installation of the firmware via Fender’s (free) FUSE™ software interface? (Windows and Mac compatible.)

    Once more, my primary point was this: before I’d simply trash the amp, I would check certain individual components populating that PCB and then maybe consider replacing failed items before considering the replacement of that chip… and then only if if it was the final and sole item in question. THEN I might consider a new chip and the possible Firmware install.

    Easily pre-determined whether or not the cost would be 10X to 100X the cost of the amp. Yet, should it be discovered (with a little basic testing) that a mere capacitor or two (for instance) needed to be replaced… well that’s many world’s away from the cost of a new amp.

    Look for signs of excess heat / burns, swollen or leaking capacitors, etc. Some things are very easily replaced and at a very little cost… DIY. If nothing faulty detected, well… one was already confronted with replacing the amp?

    SCX2pcb.png
     
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  4. archetype

    archetype Fiend of Leo's

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    The firmware is flashable via Fuse as long as the USB interface is working. They fail, occasionally, often from physical abuse.
     
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  5. FenderLover

    FenderLover Poster Extraordinaire

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    It's a little discouraging to see how many places you can still buy a brand new SCX2 knowing that a key part needed for replacement is already unavailable.
     
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  6. Telecaster88

    Telecaster88 Tele-Meister

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    I just bought one last month after a ton of overthinking, so this thread is a bit of a bummer.
     
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  7. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

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    I think Fender's big mistake is using that Digital card to control most everything. It controls the tone controls etc. If they had separated the selection of digital effects from the basic amp, then when the card goes out you would still have a basic amp that worked. I guess it's a "disposable technology amp". It's not a great platform to build an amp out of either due to limitations of trannys etc. Although it could be done. I considered it recently when thinking of buying "another " bad X2 on line that the board was out of. It was $130 ....... combo with speaker.
     
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  8. TonySS

    TonySS TDPRI Member

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    I got the chance to borrow a DSP board from a friend and try it in my amp and with that my amp works ok, so now I'm really sure that it is the DSP board that is the problem. With my faulty DSP board in place I still can connect with FUSE through USB and communicate with the board, but still no sound. As someone suggested it might be something simple like a bad capacitor but which one and they are all tiny surface mounted... It's sad that Fender doesn't sell spare parts. I'll see if I can bypass the DSP in someway or if time permits build a tube preamp stage and add to the existing power amp stage. In the meantime I'll use my old all tube Marshall Super Lead 100W!
     
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  9. Alter

    Alter Tele-Meister

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    The future of Tonemasters...
     
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  10. Pasta Player

    Pasta Player Tele-Meister Ad Free Member

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    If FUSE™ recognizes and comms with your “bad board” - but still no sound… might be as simple as a bad or cold solder joint (get out your magnifier and check all the solder connections / traces on that board).

    AND you might also try reloading the driver (Firmware) via FUSE™. (Maybe it has simply lost its' mind.)

    As previously mentioned… check for burn or any evidence of “big heat” all over the board. (Post good close-up pics of both sides of that board, if you’d like.) I count seven capacitors on the board from the image I posted before. (Same or similar board?)
    SCX2caps.png
    Anyway… visually inspect all those caps to see if any of them are swollen, leaking or puffy. They seem to be in pairs, except for C45 and it may be the same as C43 & 44… so you can compare all to their “twins” to see if any appear different, swollen, etc. Usually the their flat tops will appear domed, upon failure. Chances are, they're fine.

    See those two rows of 50 soldered dots under the two largest caps (and the 16 similar ones / lower left corner?) Might briefly touch them all with a soldering iron to "re-flow" their solder. (Yes, could be as simple as that.) BUT, try the firmware reload first.

    If all else fails and you’re going to end up converting the amp and have no use for that board… do please send it my way.;)
     
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  11. Pasta Player

    Pasta Player Tele-Meister Ad Free Member

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  12. Telecaster88

    Telecaster88 Tele-Meister

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    @Pasta Player, you're providing light in the darkness of despair!

    Hopefully my SCX2 outlives me, but if not I'm glad there are options besides the landfill.
     
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  13. Rowdyman

    Rowdyman Tele-Meister

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    Not trying to be negative, but I've been a tech for more years than I care to admit, and putting the board in an oven that is hot enough to 'reflow' solder is a bad idea.

    Good luck! RM
     
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  14. Andy B

    Andy B Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    You might check the board carefully for fuses. Quite often there are fusable links on these boards which look just like all the other SMD's. Fuse values are a single letter which denotes the value. I used to replace these all the time in dead digital cameras back when I was a factory authorized & trained Nikon technician.
     
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  15. Pasta Player

    Pasta Player Tele-Meister Ad Free Member

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    Oh ye of little faith.

    Yes I too laughingly dismissed the “EZ bake oven” approach at first. Sheer madness! And I would only suggest it here as a very last resort. *I did recommend attempted firmware reload and the close visual inspection & touching solder points (reflowing) on all the ribbon cable connection points. However should that not prove fruitful, I’d slap that puppy into the oven closely following the steps in this video:

    (Repair An LG Television Motherboard…) Some say 8 minutes, some say 10.

    Have done this successfully, 4 out of 4 times with PCBs from large flat panel TVs and a couple of times with errant computer cards and all are now still functioning. Bad idea?

    *Definitely allow ample cool down time before moving / jostling the baked board. I shut the oven off, open the door and leave it open and carefully move the cardboard and board to the stove top for 15-20 minutes to cool.

    [I did remove heatsinks, heatsink paste and any foam-type shrouding when present, then re-applied heat sink paste on computer boards. (Doesn’t apply here.) This seemed to have reduced the amount of reported “stink” from this somewhat bizarre ritual.)

    AND while this might not work for everyone (again, batting nearly two-thousand here so far) when confronted with throwing away and replacing a TV that originally cost me near Two Thousand Dollars… hell yes, I put that board in the oven and baked it. Wonder how much a new board and a Tech to install it would have cost me instead? (And now, the SCX2 boards are no longer available.) I’d probably bake it before I tried replacing that DSP chip.

    Try to reload the firmware and check everything else that one can, first (definitely including any fuses)… and then maybe bake that sucker - “with some fava beans and a nice Chianti”.



    YMMV and of course, proceed at your own risk. Ya might stink up yer house a bit, but if it works… you didn’t have to buy a new board… that is no longer available. And if it doesn’t work, well there’s always that possible conversion to undertake.

    Temps.png
     
  16. TonySS

    TonySS TDPRI Member

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    ...

    Thanks for inspiration! First I bought another used DSP board on eBay, but that didn't work either. When comparing my two faulty boards with a functional DSP board I noticed that the two small capacitors (10uF) to the left on your pic, C43 och C44 acted as shortcuts on the faulty boards. Happy to have found the problem (I thought...) I removed them, only to find that there seems to be some other problem shorting them out more or less (0 Ohms over C43 solder joints and about 5 Ohms over C44). It's a bit hard to follow the signal path, but I believe C43 and C44 are connected to pin 4 and 5 on the AKM4556 Codec. If the IC-codec is the problem I believe the trash bin is next step... but before that I hope to find a schematic over the DSP-board since it's not included in the Service Manual for the amp.

    It's sad that Fender doesn't sell spare parts! I think the amp sounds great when it's working...
     
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  17. ce24

    ce24 Poster Extraordinaire

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    Long live tubes and real fx! Death to computer amps.:D
     
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  18. Jon Snell

    Jon Snell Tele-Meister

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  19. muchxs

    muchxs Doctor of Teleocity

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    I don't generally shout this from the mountaintops but I used to have a cottage industry burning EPROMs for first wave digital video devices. This was in the studio a decade before the proliferation of HDTV.

    But.. I turned my back on it and never looked back.

    All analog all the time, baby!

    More recently I serviced a 16 panel solar system with 16 micro- inverters. The inverters would be simple devices except for the layer of digital crap that allows them to communicate with their controller. One little glitch, they may be working but they can't tell me anything.


    If I'm going to argue with computers I'm going to buy aftermarket high performance engine controls and catch up to modern automotive technology.

    I'm absolutely not sold on computers masquerading as guitar amps.
     
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  20. Jon Snell

    Jon Snell Tele-Meister

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    Just a simple observation.
    If Y2 is oscillating then U3 is probably OK, same applies for Y1 and U1.
    If not oscillating, check the 3v3 supply is present on pin76 and pin53, if it is, check the reset pulse on pin63 with an oscilloscope comparing the rise time with the supply rise time.
    Marshall Valve State use the same family of Symphony processors and have the same issues. A big mistake in my opinion to mix analogue with digital but then I am old school.
     
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