Where does "twang" end and "distortion" begin?

[Brent Hutto]

Sometimes when I'm listening to a guitar being played, I can't tell if I'm hearing "twang" or "distortion" or both. Does that even make sense?

I have always played on my Telecaster's neck pickup with a completely clean amp (i.e., on the "Clean" channel of my Katana with the Gain set more or less around noon and no boost/overdrive/distortion effects or compressors). A smooth, pristine sound suits the kinds of stuff I usually play.

But lately I've branched out into trying a little more gain on the amp (and/or activating something like a Blue Driver on the amp's Boosts effects) and I've also even played around a little bit with the bridge pickup. It's when I flip the switch to the bridge that my question arises.

It sounds to me like even with my normal squeaky-clean amp settings, chords strummed on the bridge can sound a lot like what I'm tempted to call "distortion". Single notes are twangy and bright, bordering on harsh but chords start getting their overtones all clashy and, well, kind of distorted.

So what am I hearing? Is the bridge pickup literally driving the amp hard enough to make it break up? Seems hard to believe, these are single coils into a what seems like a really high headroom SS amp. Or does the bridge pickup just generate enough overtones that my ears get fooled into hearing distortion?

I know this is a half-baked question. But it's something I can't figure out well enough to even ask about it in a sensible way.

 

[monkeybanana]

How about twangy distortion:

 

[Wallaby]

It's all very "IMO", but I think it's very possible. Especially if you notice "harsh" or "sparkly" or "edgy" sounds with singe notes.

I think this is especially true with PAF-style humbuckers, although that's not what you've mentioned.

I like to keep the overtones to keep it fat sounding, and reduce them with the tone control or a slight tweak of the volume when needed. It's nice to have all the options available with a turn of a knob. IMO, of course.

But it is possible usually to find a height the eliminates them as a "problem". Once I find it I usually start over from scratch because the overall sound is so anemic

Or does the bridge pickup just generate enough overtones that my ears get fooled into hearing distortion?

 

[Brent Hutto]

How about twangy distortion:

Thanks for those.

So take the "Chunk of Coal" guitar solo for instance. To me that sounds 90% twangy and 10% distorted (or whatever numbers we might want to put on it). Is that what people might call "gritty" rather than full-on "dirt"? Or am I hearing it wrong and there's a lot of distortion in there?

 

[Brent Hutto]

It's all very "IMO", but I think it's very possible. Especially if you notice "harsh" or "sparkly" or "edgy" sounds with singe notes.

I think this is especially true with PAF-style humbuckers, although that's not what you've mentioned.

I like to keep the overtones to keep it fat sounding, and reduce them with the tone control or a slight tweak of the volume when needed. It's nice to have all the options available with a turn of a knob. IMO, of course.

But it is possible usually to find a height the eliminates them as a "problem". Once I find it I usually start over from scratch because the overall sound is so anemic

I didn't mention the tone control but all that stuff I'm describing on the bridge pickup really responds to the tone control. If I just back off a little bit from having the Tone dimed it smooths out a lot.

You also mention keeping things fat sounding, that's what I'm kind of going for. I like a little of that twang or distortion or whatever so the notes on the upper strings don't sound so thin and plinky.

 

[Wallaby]

I have found another way is to thin it out a little by reducing the volume slightly, like from 10 to 9-1/2 or so, to right before the treble starts dropping out noticeably. I think it keeps more of the treble but thins out the upper mids, a little different than what the tone control does.

 

[robt57]

I like a little of that twang or distortion or whatever so the notes on the upper strings don't sound so thin and plinky.

Try some heavier ga strings yet? Don't forget your nut slots will need attention if up up ga. maybe piece just the B/E or G/B/E to a bit heavier ga. It is mostly the wound strings the slots need dressing for bigger ga. so unwound change quite possible with no slot climbing...

 

[Cosmic Cowboy]

What people call it..(a sound) are simply descriptions. They have no real value.

Its like saying "describe apple pie". Theres a bunch of things you might say in attempt to paint a picture of those sweet and crusty mouthfulls of apple pie, but words have no flavor or taste, or smell. Its just a bunch of word salad.

 

[Brent Hutto]

I take your point about trying to name sounds. Guess what I'm really trying to suss out is what part of the tone is coming from the guitar and its pickups versus the part that's a dirty amp or a dirt pedal.

Here's a clip of some playing that's kind of tempting me to try playing some stuff that isn't just clean and smooth (more words, I know!).



Mostly that lead guitar sounds like an amp or pedal that's breaking up, right?

 

[Wallaby]

From this article -

Michael Daves: Bluegrass’ Jekyll and Hyde

This NYC guitarist goes trad acoustic and buck-wild electric on his edgy new double album, Orchids and Violence, pushing the roots envelope and igniting a bonfire of vintage fretboards and modern fuzztones.

www.premierguitar.com

I'm guessing it's pedals.

 

[ABetterTelePlayer]

A good pair of HOT twang pickups (yes there are pickups for Tele that specialize in twang sound!) And basically any overdrive/distortion that has a blend knob. The Wampler Hot Wired is a great example! This combo is what country guitarists of the 90's did and defined that classic "twang Tele" lead sound.

And yeah, usually the middle setting on the pickup switch (not neck or bridge but both). Sometimes it could sound like a bridge pickup. I always recommend the Twisted Tele pickup set.

 

[G Stone496]

At the end of the instrument cable

 

[Brent Hutto]

From this article -

Michael Daves: Bluegrass’ Jekyll and Hyde

This NYC guitarist goes trad acoustic and buck-wild electric on his edgy new double album, Orchids and Violence, pushing the roots envelope and igniting a bonfire of vintage fretboards and modern fuzztones.

www.premierguitar.com

I'm guessing it's pedals.

In the interview he says he uses a fuzz pedal and a (borrowed) Klon Centaur. Now that's just like cheatin', am I right?

 

[Wallaby]

That song has a good groove with a good sound, I should cheat like that!

 

[Brent Hutto]

All kidding aside, Daves is some kind of combined mad scientist and virtuoso picker in one guy. I just adore that album.

It's funny, I was searching up recordings of plain old flatpicked acoustic guitar versions of 28th of January (which I learned from an old fiddle tune book) and once I heard his electric version it kind of spoilt the tune for me in any form other than wide-open electric tones...

 

[Wallaby]

I thought I read in there somewhere that he has a one-man-band kind of thing he does too with some kind of percussion contraption he operates with his feet. It sounded like more than just a stompin' board or the like.

I've been trying to find a video of that...

 

[Brent Hutto]

I thought I read in there somewhere that he has a one-man-band kind of thing he does too with some kind of percussion contraption he operates with his feet. It sounded like more than just a stompin' board or the like.

I've been trying to find a video of that...

I'd give a nickel to see that myself!

Last night I went bridge pickup, tone rolled off just a little (maybe 8/10?), slapback delay, turned the gain on my clean channel all the way up and ran through my simple version of 28th of January a few times. I was pretty pleased. Neither the playing, rhythm, tone or even all the actual notes were quite the same but it was a fun vibe. Very different from my usual slow, dreamy, atmospheric stuff.

I think what I was getting was mostly the bridge pickup barking but there was a tiny bit of amplifier crunch in there when I would finish on a strummed A chord.

 

[RhythmFender]

Somewhere at the corner of bedlam and mayhem

 

[Swirling Snow]

When you turn the gain up on a Katana, I don't think it qualifies as "squeaky clean" anymore.

FWI, technically, the difference between twang and distortion is one of them sounds good.

It seems very unlikely at this point in technology, but in the beginning a lot of the "good distortion" was coming from the mic pres and recording console. The more overtones a pickup makes, the more chances for distortion no matter what the signal chain. Remember, your guitar is just a controller and sounds pretty bad by itself. The amp is your musical instrument.

 

[Brent Hutto]

When you turn the gain up on a Katana, I don't think it qualifies as "squeaky clean" anymore.

FWI, technically, the difference between twang and distortion is one of them sounds good.

It seems very unlikely at this point in technology, but in the beginning a lot of the "good distortion" was coming from the mic pres and recording console. The more overtones a pickup makes, the more chances for distortion no matter what the signal chain. Remember, your guitar is just a controller and sounds pretty bad by itself. The amp is your musical instrument.

The one thing I'm doing differently this time around making the switch to electric guitar (unlike 15 years ago when I briefly tried and basically failed) is I've been thinking of my pedals+amp as the instrument. The image I always have in mind is a big old pipe organ where you can set different stops and use combinations of pipes to make a range of timbres and the keyboard is just how to intiate the whole sound-making process.

Back then I think my idea was, an electric guitar is like a really quiet and plinky sounding version of an acoustic guitar that you can make really, really loud with an amplifier. Or something like that. It didn't really work out!

But to your first point...

Last night I did some comparison playing each pickup (neck and bridge) into the Katana clean channel with the Gain down around 1/4 and then with it up at maybe 9/10. Even just playing single-note pentatonic patterns on the neck pickup there was a lot of what I think would be called distortion showing on on the higher Gain versus "squeaky clean" with Gain down low.

So for my purposes, my own personal lingo, I'm going to call "twang" the thing that my neck pickup has a little of and the bridge has a lot of and I'm going to call "distortion" the thing that's there with the Gain up and gone with the Gain down. That seems to clarify it in my mind.

Now let me ask one other newbie-ish question. When people talk about something like a Twin Reverb have high clean headroom, are they saying on a Twin as you turn up the Gain it stays "squeaky clean" much higher than most amps? Higher than the clean channel on my Katana?