when is something "good enough"?

gimmeatele

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In the last few months I have started recording all my practice sessions through my tascam, if I think something went well or badly I have a quick listen and will then save what was good and just record over the session the next day. It certainly takes the pressure off setting up to record a single track, and as the tascam is constantly on record it takes some if the stress of getting a one take wonder off the table
 

johnny k

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Im a bedroom player for the moment, getting back into playing.
Im learning Hideaway and i have it down as well as im going to have it for some time.

When i try and record it, every mistake is amplified in my headphones and i start again.
Giving up for the night after 20 takes, with only 1 thats about 85% there.

For all the non pro's, at what point do you move on?
At what point is something eating too much of your time?
it took me a 100 takes to play an intro on my band's record. At which point, the tech was just looping the part, and told me, when you think you got it rightn tell me. so i was just playing on my own while my friends were joking outside.

The final take was the best, but still not so good.
 

brindlepicker

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I’ve been watching a Nashville studio player’s postings of recording jobs and seeing him redo parts a couple times is a reminder that recordings are big process. Of course he’s trying to come up with the original part too.
We just hear the 4 minute end result of hours of work.
 

charlie chitlin

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Move on...to The Stumble ;)
Seriously...try to work on several songs at once.
When you burn out on one, move to the next.
It's temperamental.
Some folks (or even bands, which can develop their own temperament) are comfortable with working for hours to hone a single song, others need to cut it loose after awhile and work on others.
BTW...I love the way the last notes in the main melody are a B, followed by an A played over the B7.
Freddie King was so incredibly hip.
 

Marc Morfei

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Lot's of great advice so far. I'll add two things.
Do it over and over until you get it right, until the point where it's not getting any better. Then walk away and come back later, or just accept what you have.
Key fact: if you plan to create a whole mix, once you layer in all the other instruments the fine nuances of your guitar track get concealed.
 

Skyhook

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Im a bedroom player for the moment, getting back into playing.
Im learning Hideaway and i have it down as well as im going to have it for some time.

When i try and record it, every mistake is amplified in my headphones and i start again.
Giving up for the night after 20 takes, with only 1 thats about 85% there.

For all the non pro's, at what point do you move on?
At what point is something eating too much of your time?

I tried to record an 8-bar long bass-thing using both an unfamiliar technique and an unfamiliar instrument.
I failed... again and again and again. Nothing I've ever tried to record before had been this impossible,
and I was fast running out of night-time and had to get up for work in the morning.
So finally I gave up and decided to record the thing in 2-bar pieces, splice them together and then copy/paste
the resulting 8-bar thing to wherever it was needed(which for this song was almost everywhere).
Using this technique I finally got my result after an amount of takes exceeding 100.... Yeah.
So... I have my song but I'll always know I cheated to get it.
 

Skully

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I tried to record an 8-bar long bass-thing using both an unfamiliar technique and an unfamiliar instrument.
I failed... again and again and again. Nothing I've ever tried to record before had been this impossible,
and I was fast running out of night-time and had to get up for work in the morning.
So finally I gave up and decided to record the thing in 2-bar pieces, splice them together and then copy/paste
the resulting 8-bar thing to wherever it was needed(which for this song was almost everywhere).
Using this technique I finally got my result after an amount of takes exceeding 100.... Yeah.
So... I have my song but I'll always know I cheated to get it.
Your favorite musicians are likely guilty of doing the same kind of "cheating" on you favorite songs.
 

Skyhook

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Your favorite musicians are likely guilty of doing the same kind of "cheating" on you favorite songs.

Yes... reading about their studio work gave me the heinous idea in the first place. 😈
I'll also confess to having once corrected one flat note in a backing vocal using a pitch shifter manually on that one note.
I'll still not use autotune though as that's next-level-cheating.
 

charlie chitlin

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Im a bedroom player for the moment, getting back into playing.
Im learning Hideaway and i have it down as well as im going to have it for some time.

When i try and record it, every mistake is amplified in my headphones and i start again.
Giving up for the night after 20 takes, with only 1 thats about 85% there.

For all the non pro's, at what point do you move on?
At what point is something eating too much of your time?
Whose version are you working on?
 

wilson_smyth

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Thanks all.

Lots of great answers and info.

I gave it another shot and am leaving it at that for the moment, anything better is currently beyond my skill and ability but will give it another go in a few months.
Time to move onto something else.

Here's the result, warts and all for anyone who's interested.


 

Telenator

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A recording project is never finished. It's abandoned. JOHN COUGAR

It's rock n roll. It's not supposed to be THAT good.
TOM PETTY

you need to move on. Recording is a growing process. Put it away for a week, and then come back to the things that are right about it. Not wrong.
Live with the errors and know, that you will play it better in the future.
Build on your success and stop turning the recording process into a death March. Play along and celebrate the things you do well. The other stuff will fall into place.
This is supposed to be fun, right?
 

Skully

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A recording project is never finished. It's abandoned. JOHN COUGAR

It's rock n roll. It's not supposed to be THAT good.
TOM PETTY

you need to move on. Recording is a growing process. Put it away for a week, and then come back to the things that are right about it. Not wrong.
Live with the errors and know, that you will play it better in the future.
Build on your success and stop turning the recording process into a death March. Play along and celebrate the things you do well. The other stuff will fall into place.
This is supposed to be fun, right?

When you play live, you live with errors and try to be better next time. When you're recording, you live with your limitations and try to improve.

I find it the easiest when the recording is part of the writing process, because I'm excited by what I do and the discoveries I make. I feel my best songs are the ones that don't have completed recordings yet. They're completely written from beginning to end with (solo, solitary) performance-honed arrangements for voice and one guitar. I have a vision of what I want them to be, and I have trouble making the recordings equal that vision.
 
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studio

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If I get to work with the band in pre production, and it looks like some parts are going to be an issue, I've worked with musicians to either refine or rewrite the problem passages.

There are endearing, humanizing errors and there is just bad playing, and no one wants to hear the latter, in my experience. Even if you cut and paste together the best bits of the bad.
Yes sir, ^^ that solves a lot of issues ^^
 

telemnemonics

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Is this the dating after 30 thread?
Which factor are we grading again?
The other?
Or us?
Sometimes good enough isn't about ME!

Actually most shall we say "normal music" is better served by the lesser of our capacity done in a workmanlike manner without too much nit picking.
If the end result is problematic, how often is it because we didn't play our guitar part perfectly?
Sometimes it's disagreeing over the definitions of perfect or that sort of cooperative breakdown that is the problem.
A good recording isn't ruined by little guitar flubs as much as by creative conflicts or lack of passion due to repetition or an unhappy room.
Actually I'm just taking a shot in the dark based on my experience and sense of what makes a group performance/ recording vital and enticing to the listener.

Now I'm reversing my former opinion about my own expectations, here trying to address group expectations and final product content.
My needs which are obsessive and passion based, need to be tempered by the group.
I find the cooperative nature of non soloist music to be the bigger challenge compared to playing the guitar. Which is hard too but at least arguably within my control.

As for the OP nailing the old Mayall Clapton tune?
Maybe play it how you feel it?
 

klasaine

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Thanks all.

Lots of great answers and info.

I gave it another shot and am leaving it at that for the moment, anything better is currently beyond my skill and ability but will give it another go in a few months.
Time to move onto something else.

Here's the result, warts and all for anyone who's interested.



So let me ask you this.
What is it about this performance that needs improvement? What do you hear that you don't like?
*You're almost there man.
 

wilson_smyth

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So let me ask you this.
What is it about this performance that needs improvement? What do you hear that you don't like?
*You're almost there man.

I hear all the mistakes! The slidey bit is not great. The second last section of the solo is rough, the final slide is not good, the timing is a smidge off in some parts.
It's also annoying that I've mailed each of those parts in different takes, but never all in one take.
But I agree, it's not a bad attempt,

On reading some comments here, I agree with the idea that it's as good as I can make it at my current skill level and if I keep up the practice and hit it again in a few months it will sound a bit better.
 

johnny k

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You have to remember that the Jordanaires, backing up elvis with doo wop in the back, are sometimes a little bit off. The jordanaires, backing up ELVIS.
 

chulaivet1966

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Do it over and over until you get it right, until the point where it's not getting any better. Then walk away and come back later, or just accept what you have.
That's my take.

One needs to play it ad nauseum to employ some muscle memory over time.
Can't tell you how many times I've played Kid Charlemagne, Another Park/Another Sunday, Listen To The Music, etc. until it finally became comfortable for my 74 year old skill level.

Lately....I've been working on one for a month or so to get it right....Rio De Janeiro Blue by Randy Crawford. (just play along rhythm guitar)
I've played it a thousand times to get it smooth and tastefully played.
I fire up the video camera....hit record....the RED LIGHT is on, glaring at me....palms sweating and begin.
Where do I screw up damn near every time?....at the OUTRO VAMP which is only two chords!
I was so close as everything up to that point was just fine.
(Ken was a great help on this song and I will stick with it until I get an acceptable video of my effort)

Oh well....I'll keep plugging along...as I would encourage all others to do.

Carry on....
 
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Recce

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That's my take.

One needs to play it until it ad nauseum to employ some muscle memory over time.
Can't tell you how many times I've played Kid Charlemagne, Another Park/Another Sunday, Listen To The Music, etc. until it finally became comfortable for my 74 year old skill level.

Lately....I've been working on one for a month or so to get it right....Rio De Janeiro Blue by Randy Crawford. (just play along rhythm guitar)
I've played it a thousand times to get it smooth and tastefully played.
I fire up the video camera....hit record....the RED LIGHT is on, glaring at me....palms sweating and begin.
Where do I screw up damn near every time?....at the OUTRO VAMP which is only two chords!
I was so close as everything up to that point was just fine.
(Ken was a great help on this song and I will stick with it until I get an acceptable video of my effort)

Oh well....I'll keep plugging along...as I would encourage all others to do.

Carry on....
 

Recce

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I have been working on Long Cool Woman in a Black Dress for years and they are just faster and better than I am. But, I still have not given up.
 




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