When clients won't listen

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Hexabuzz, Mar 11, 2017.

  1. mgreene

    mgreene Tele-Afflicted

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    All humorous anecdotes. IMO, there are a couple of points of human nature not mentioned. One is stupidity :lol: I have a saying: that so and so looks "business plausible". Which means that a person is in the position that they are in because they talk good and look the part but in fact are either too stupid or dont care enough to learn their job.

    The other one is that people are rigid - i.e., peoples' brains are only big enough to hold one idea at a time. In other words, the first idea presented to them (or their first impression) is the only thing they are able to consider.

    I could go on. I write technical work procedures and its a constant thing where someone has taken a shot at documenting a process and dosent want to see their prose changed in any way - even though it is out of order, doesnt make any sense, and has all the grammatical finesse of a third grader on a sugar high, typically including word conjunctions that aint not in the dictionary!:rolleyes:

    As someone said above, it usually isnt worth it to try to convince someone who is operating in pride. I've written hundreds of procedures, I used to say - I can guarantee you that your audience wont be able to use this without making (potentially dangerous) assumptions, I used to say.

    Fortunately in my industry, the procedures go for peer review and the reviewers' version of saying "this looks like it was written by a 10 year old who was playing angry birds while drinking beer and eating donuts" is to just make 10 pages of comments pointing out the incompetence of the process owner, for all to see. It is really amazing when they can never remember that I pointed out all the same errors at the beginning of the process - which I have carefully memorialized in an email trail, for CYA :D

    Hey - I just realized that this is a rant of my own :)
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2017
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  2. raito

    raito Poster Extraordinaire

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    That's pretty much true of any profession.

    I'm reminded of one of one 3D artist who ranted that executive management thought that there was a 'Make Art' button in the software that anyone could click.
     
  3. awasson

    awasson Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

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    We worked for a mining company many years ago where the management team was a group we had worked for many times. Their MO was to find a property or properties, build a company around it, generate interest and then find a larger investment group or take it over. They were a really goood group to work with and sometimes it took years for their projects to get off the ground but they always took care of us, even if we had to reduce our rates in lean times.

    In one instance the CEO/President called us to let us know the company had changed hands and that the new team weren't a particularly respectful group so if we didn't want to work for them, by all means quit and don't feel that there is any obligation.

    We chose to quit after a single call from the new CEO about an outstanding invoice we were waiting on payment for. The phone call began with him saying (quote verbatim): "I'm not going to pay you $xxx for pushing a ******* button". My reply was: "well, your not... you're paying me $xxx for knowing which ******* button to push". They paid their invoice, we sent them their files and moved on.
     
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  4. raito

    raito Poster Extraordinaire

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    The funny bit is that he scripted such a button (which really just loaded a model we already had).

    In that particular executive team, I'd have hired the wives instead of the executives in some cases. When the founder wanted to either attract investment or sell out, his wife said they would have to buy new dishes and golf clubs. The founder whined that he didn't want to play golf. One of the VPs, who though he was a hot salesman because he'd been successful selling in a particular country only because he came from there, and the culture was such that they wouldn't buy from a 'foreigner', admitted that he didn't know how to operate the alarm system in his own home. This is why he had to leave home only at certain times, when his wife could do it for him. Or the Marketing Director who required a $50K a year assistant. Of course she did -- the assistant did all the work. Then she ran off with the President of the Company (not the founder), who ditched his wife and 2 year old daughter and was never heard from again. Lovely place. I was fortunate to leave before being asked to develop video poker software for machines that paid out in phone cards (because paying out in money would be illegal).

    Loved the technology and my peers. The company was questionable. Ultimately, they sued their largest competitor to get bought (the founder didn't want to own a company that he had to work at). Everyone except 1 test guy and a sales guy lost their jobs. But on the founder's CV, it's listed as a successful exit.
     
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  5. tap4154

    tap4154 Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    When I open a website that has white font on black background, I close it immediately are look for the same info elsewhere with black on white text.

    A large national retailer I sub to just changed their invoices. They made invoice numbers double the number of characters, meaning folks are always getting them wrong, and the new font makes 6, 8, 9 all look very similar. Everyone in the stores notices how dumb it is, but are afraid to approach management about it.
     
  6. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    25 years in print prepress and design. Most of my prepress time was as a photo retoucher/color specialist. Now I do graphic design and photography for a trade show company. Having a creative job is challenging. So much is subjective.

    I HATE DESIGN BY COMMITTEE!!!

    The more people making comments muddies the water to the point where nothing is clear anymore. Conflicting comments given at different times by people of equal authority causing you to have to decide who to appease. And because much of it is subjective there often is no "right" answer.

    And my personal award for the comment I hate to hear the most:

    I don't know what it is, but it just doesn't feel right.

    :mad:

    YES! I rarely give my true critique because most of the time the person is just looking for an ego stroke. I want to be paid and get more work so I tell them I love it.
     
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  7. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    Are you sure you still do? Check back with us.
     
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  8. 1955

    1955 Poster Extraordinaire

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    How things got to looking like one big strip mall, I don't know, but you gotta give it to Pizza Hut for at least leaving an architectural legacy to spurn the peripheral Pajama Land with an unmistakeable onesie.
     
  9. unixfish

    unixfish Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    Yeah, I can relate. I get assigned project by that Mexican Guy, Senior Management. They have an idea that sounds great but is as stupid as [insert insult here]. I tell them it's won't work, they remind me who signs my paycheck. Sigh. Then I get flack when nobody gets use out of the final product, implemented to their vision.

    When I was consulting about 15 years ago, a client wanted their systems rewritten. We quoted moving the database from Access to MS SQL, converting processing to another language, and converting a whole load of Access screens to a web based front end. The client looked amazed - he says "Why will it take two weeks to make web pages? My nephew just made a web page and it only took a few hours." He shows us the page - "Jason's home page. Click here to see a picture of me. Click here to see a picture of my car. Click here to see who I am dating." Uh, yeah, that would only take an hour, what is your point? "Well, if you can do that in an hour, why will it take two weeks to make web pages to display all of our data?" At this point the salesman steps in before I say something snarky that gets us both in trouble...
     
  10. Formerblonde

    Formerblonde Tele-Meister

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    I was in the sign business years ago. Finally got out after clients felt they knew better than I did.

    Had a client who wanted a wrap for his vehicle but only wanted the name of his company... no phone number, address, or website. To make things worse, the background was so busy you couldn't pick the company name out. Reminded me of the colour blindness testing I did back in high school.

    If you're gonna spend the money for a vehicle wrap there should be an objective ....sheesh.

    FB
     
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  11. Jelly Roll Horton

    Jelly Roll Horton TDPRI Member

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    You will never win that argument. I retired from graphic design ten years ago after 37 years trying to educate my clients. Like you, I felt that with 30+ years of my experience they might expect that they are buying my knowledge. Nope. Almost any other profession I can think of, after you've put in your 10,000 hours you are considered an authority if not an expert in your field. I am now happily retired, and spend my time practicing guitar instead of tearing my hair out in frustration. I'm nowhere near 10,000 hours on guitar, but I am much happier with what I am doing with my life. I highly recommend this option over graphic design!
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2017
  12. Jelly Roll Horton

    Jelly Roll Horton TDPRI Member

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    I resigned a few clients for crap like this.
     
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  13. Jelly Roll Horton

    Jelly Roll Horton TDPRI Member

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    Never, ever use yellow type. Ever, anywhere. I don't care that research has shown yellow type on a black background is (supposedly) the easiest to read. Good design combines esthetic with communication.
     
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  14. BorderRadio

    BorderRadio Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

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    How about now?
     
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  15. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    Even with all the cr@p I still love being a graphic designer. I get to smoke weed and make pretty pictures all day; and get paid for it. Though I'm thinking about what will be my next career (at 54) I'll probably keep some freelance graphics and photography clients.
     
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  16. MDMachiavelli

    MDMachiavelli Tele-Afflicted

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    If it makes you feel any better, the next time I have a logo designed (which may be sooner rather than later), I will welcome all of the free help and professional experience and opinion you are willing to give.

    I would greatly appreciate the assistance of a professional, and take it as such. Meaning I would blindly listen to what you had to say because I know very little about the subject.
     
  17. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    You, sir, are my kind of client!
     
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  18. MDMachiavelli

    MDMachiavelli Tele-Afflicted

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    I think it was Socrates that said the key to real intelligence is realizing you don't know everything. I'm paraphrasing of course.
     
  19. MatchlessMan

    MatchlessMan Tele-Holic

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    That's not what he said to me.
     
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  20. MDMachiavelli

    MDMachiavelli Tele-Afflicted

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    Well you must be a couple of years older than me :D
     
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