1. Win a Broadcaster or one of 3 Teles! The annual Supporting Member Giveaway is on. To enter Click Here. To see all the prizes and full details Click Here. To view the thread about the giveaway Click Here.

What was wrong with Punk?

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by offsideref, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. offsideref

    offsideref Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    292
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2019
    Location:
    Aberdour
    The relationship between rhythmic jumping up and down, the pogo, and really dancing, is exactly the same as the relationship between xxxx, xxxx, and having great sxx with a desirable partner. I hope one day you’ll discover this for yourself. And yes, granted, you can do all of the above to the music of the Dead Kennedys, if you really think it will enhance the experience for you.
     
    Fendereedo likes this.
  2. ping-ping-clicka

    ping-ping-clicka Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    4,875
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2019
    Location:
    left coast
    I would have to say if you were not there and didn't participate, well you don't know what your talking about.
    If you did it, lived it , played it, great. I 'm glad that you lived through china white ,meth, drinking, poverty and the brutal cops
    if you were fortunate enough not to encounter that part of the scene, good on you. 659001_2_m.jpg
     
    drlucky, offsideref and Zettemusik like this.
  3. Oxidao

    Oxidao Tele-Meister

    Age:
    57
    Posts:
    295
    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2013
    Location:
    PNA, Spain
    You scored in your second paragraph (but Bowie?).
    All of them you named has been influenced from that energetic attitude and stiff guitars, as well as themselves create a huge heritage to the next generation... Grunge?, and so on in cascade.

    So, IMO not less than 40% of actual Rock bands got some Punkish influence,
    and almost every other styles got it either occasionally.

    All right, they didn't take it out of that Cockney hat, they've heard the old good Rockers (*), The Kinks, The Who, The Stooges, The Velvet U ... ...
    It was just the definitive crysol where merged all that raw energy and exploded. Mass media and money did the rest for their prompt implosion. But that WAS real, and still is.
    Who killed Bambi?

    (*) "The great R'n Roll Swindle" album got me into Eddie Cochram and Jonathan Richman,
    and the film is worth an overlook. At least it was when I saw it in a cinema in Madrid in '82. Gotta say it was tolerated smoking (whatever) and drinking beer inside that particular cinema (Covadonga).
     
  4. Rick330man

    Rick330man Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,527
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2011
    Location:
    Florida Keys
    The problem with punk is that all too often is cited as an excuse for giving the talentless a way to legitimize their noise. Too many bands in the day put out music that just flat out sucked, and they'd quickly justify it as punk. Crappy music is crappy music regardless of the label you put on it.

    The Ramones were identified by producers as bubble gum with distortion, but their lyrics gave me a great laugh.

    The Jam were hands down my favorite band of the genre. Great music with equally great lyrics. Paul Weller's decision to shut things down while they were a the top of their game speaks to an integrity few others had (because they were too consumed with trying to make money).

    The Buzzcocks were another excellent band of the genre.

    I spent the summer of '81 riding the Madrid subway. Every night around midnight, a group of university students would hop on the train, congregate towards the back and sing the Jam's "Down in the Tube Station at Midnight" in their best broken english. When a band's music resonates like that with real people: that's as punk as it gets.

    By the way: I wholeheartedly agree that the Police and Squeeze were new wave offshoots of punk. Both were excellent bands.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
  5. Rick330man

    Rick330man Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,527
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2011
    Location:
    Florida Keys
    I agree with you 100% about the KinKs and the Who. Those two bands in particular really paved the way for the punk bands that came in the 70s.
     
  6. Zettemusik

    Zettemusik TDPRI Member Gold Supporter

    Age:
    51
    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2020
    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    The older I get, the more I appreciate it. I have always liked The Clash, nevertheless. Should I stay or should I go and London calling are memorable. Much better than unsufferable reggaeton and autotune. Also, as a crappy guitarist, after trying to sound like Mark Knopler and failing, some three finger chords are very gratifying :).
     
    offsideref likes this.
  7. offsideref

    offsideref Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    292
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2019
    Location:
    Aberdour
    All of that ^ is pretty cool. Thanks for sharing.
     
  8. Len058

    Len058 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    47
    Posts:
    99
    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2021
    Location:
    Leeuwarden Netherlands
    I was born in the seventies. Punk was growing into New-Wave. Bands like The Stranglers, the Clash, Toy Dolls and Nina Hagen were doing more than three chords. Listen to 'Rock the Casbah' , 'No more Heroes', 'The sabre dance' and 'Unbeschreiblich Weiblich' and you can't say they can't play or the music is simple.

    I listen to Jazz, Blues, Funk, Disco, Punk, Psychobilly, Hip-Hop, Techno, Rock, Folk and other music and I think they all have their place. The range of human emotions is expressed by different styles and genres. So is Punk wrong because you don't like the way you can or cannot dance to it? I can't do ballroom dancing, or breakdance or lots of things.

    I think you should try to go to one of the big European festivals. All genres come together and boundaries disappear.

    Maybe you're just getting older and the raging emotions of adolescence have gone. I don't listen to Metal anymore, is there something wrong with it? No, it's just not for me anymore.
     
  9. trev333

    trev333 Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    26,619
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Location:
    Coolum Beach,Australia
    great bassline...:D

     
    wag69, offsideref and Fearnot like this.
  10. Tonetele

    Tonetele Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    8,555
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Location:
    South Australia
    Music is an artform. Choose what type you like. I hate "heavy metal' even 70s stuff. others like jazz. I like country/country rock and songs from the 60s- 80s. It's all a matter of taste.
     
    Greggorios and offsideref like this.
  11. Fiesta Red

    Fiesta Red Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    6,593
    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Location:
    Texas
    You’re just saying that because it’s true!
     
    Fendereedo likes this.
  12. offsideref

    offsideref Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    292
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2019
    Location:
    Aberdour
    In a word: Yes.

    I regret using the expression “what’s wrong with” because it has too many deeply negative connotations for too many people. e.g. ‘Why are you lazing about instead of working? What’s wrong with you.’

    In the OP itself, I pointed out that in its most primitive 3-chord shouty stage, it was easy for kids - I was one - to get in front of an audience and “fake it til you make it”. I am all too aware that the standard of musicianship in bands other than me and my mates was much higher. Some punk bands were populated by virtuoso musicians. And lyricists.

    My contention is, and I think my entire OP was building up to this earth-shattering conclusion, is that it is simply not possible to dance to punk music, for a given definition of “dance”, which definition is clearly not a universal constant.

    Punk: it’s fine but you can’t really dance to it.
     
    Fendereedo likes this.
  13. offsideref

    offsideref Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    292
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2019
    Location:
    Aberdour
    getbent, getbent, you’re only as old as you feel. More’s the pity.
     
  14. Manual Slim

    Manual Slim Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,149
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Location:
    Up around the bend
    But there was dancing too. There still is.
     
    cyclopean likes this.
  15. Manual Slim

    Manual Slim Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,149
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Location:
    Up around the bend
    Good grief. “I hope one day you’ll discover this for yourself”? Heh. I don’t have any particular hopes for anyone’s future discoveries here but it really is silly to think that we can’t dance to punk rock. Clear the floor, buddy, we have some moves to make.
     
    cyclopean, offsideref and BorderRadio like this.
  16. ping-ping-clicka

    ping-ping-clicka Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    4,875
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2019
    Location:
    left coast
    and how do you know this to be true? that's exactly what people said about beatniks
    INFORMANT CONFIDENTAL.jpg
     
  17. MatsEriksson

    MatsEriksson Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,387
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2011
    Location:
    Sweden
    What was wrong with punk?

    idolizing, worshipping, adolation of incompetence.

    ;)
     
    ping-ping-clicka and offsideref like this.
  18. Manual Slim

    Manual Slim Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,149
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Location:
    Up around the bend
    What’s wrong with music, by golly?

    • I don’t like some of it
    • There aren’t any good shows in my town now
    • Greeting cards
     
    offsideref, Tele-beeb and BorderRadio like this.
  19. Killing Floor

    Killing Floor Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,661
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Death?
    New York Dolls?
    MC5?
    Ramones?

    Link Wray? If you’re looking hard enough.

    It’s as easy to say punk ended with the Sex Pistols as it is to say punk’s ship had sailed before the Pistols. But to me (and I’m sure I’m not alone) defining punk to a timeline instead of a social thread is a fool’s errand. I do fully consider the Pistols to be punk. And I fully understand they were somewhat packaged but remember McLaren didn’t create them, he just influenced and exploited them for his gain. So it becomes a very long reach to credit the later iteration of the Pistols with punk origins. This said, they were punk before Sid Vicious and before McLaren saw opportunity.

    Fair to say MC5 kicked everyone’s teeth in 3-4 years before most of “punk” was fully imbedded as a movement.

    And fair to say (as I always say it) none was as innovative or as musically aggressive in context as Link Wray.

    The music was/is just rock’n’roll but the scene was something very different.
     
  20. Killing Floor

    Killing Floor Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,661
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    That’s also a good position. I’d argue there is a pencil thin fine line between the Kinks and the UK Subs, for example ( and a few years!). The Subs just wanted to be rock stars. And easily could have been if they had smarter management early on.
    It’s not a music style, it’s a social construct.
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.