We play it our own way...

[archtop_fjk]

I'm not asking anyone to sound like the original. Just that they learn the songs as recorded, meaning that they know the parts, the arrangement, and can play it competently. Not trying to mimic the sound. I would just like to hear the group sound like they're all playing the same song.

You bring up a good point about having an agreed-upon arrangement for all songs. For me it’s mainly (1) how do you start? (2) how do you end? Everything in between (verses, choruses, bridges) should be easy to follow if it’s a well known song like “Brown-eyed Girl”.

For example, a song like “Day Tripper” is easy to start because of the guitar riff, but the end can be tricky since it fades on the record. What do you do? End on a single E chord? Use the riff to end it? When do you end it?

Something I’ve been doing when playing live with a group to help end songs is to say something into the mic like “Here we go!” to indicate that we are ending the song. I got this from watching old concert footage of The Police where Sting would say “Here we go!” to end a song like “Roxanne” as they would be jamming for a while and needed a way to get out.

 

[Telenator]

Are they paying you to improvise. Take the money and jam . No need for rehearsals no need to change strings nothing but playing free form for some cash. We’re do I sign up

That's a great perspective. Too bad it's not that kind of band, or gig.
I love playing free form with others who know how to do it, and particularly for an audience that appreciates it.
The kind of music and gigs this group plays just aren't right for that approach.

 

[Telenator]

root and five gets paid.

Ba ha ha! I wish is was that simple. You know how it is. How would Wild Night sound without "that" bass line? Or Back on the Chain Gang? Or I Hate Myself for Loving You? Some tunes just need to be played as recorded.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

How do you get a potentially good band to see the light and stop wasting time?

I haven't read all the replies, but based on this...

They don't even have some of the chord progressions right and bark that they've been doing it this way for 20 years.

... I'd say they are not capable of being part a potentially good band.

 

[Lou Tencodpees]

I guess it all depends how far from the originals their "interpretations" stray. Key? Arrangement? I think a simple answer would be "I guess I'll learn 'your way' on the fly. Give me a heads up if you do the songs in a different key than the original".

 

[srblue5]

@Telenator I feel your pain.

I'm with you, I don't care if you stick to the original arrangement (although personally I don't like to copy arrangements/songs note-for-note) or do your own thing but everybody needs to be on the same page.

I am learning 40 songs for a band/gig that I have never played before on bass and had 4 weeks to do it. And the new drummer as of Monday, has 2 weeks to learn the material.
Everything was going fine until I went to rehearsal only to discover that they play many of the songs "their own way."
So many of the arrangements I've spent hours charting and learning are in need of a serious edit. That's a lot of time wasted.
What makes it worse, is that the group has no recordings of the way they play it, and we have a gig at a very nice, very popular place coming up in 2 weeks. They act as if I should already know their version and grudgingly want to work out the arrangements at rehearsal to play it their way. What a waste of time! If they had a recording I, and the drummer, would just show up prepared and there would be no stress.
I find this very challenging, stupid, wasteful, counter-productive, amateur, and lazy on their part. They don't even have some of the chord progressions right and bark that they've been doing it this way for 20 years. That doesn't make it right! Then we have to debate whether the chords and melodies are right instead of just listening to the original recording where ALL THE ANSWERS are! Oh no. Can't do that.

Once upon a time, I would have just bit the bullet and done my best. Based on what I'm reading in your post (and based on my own work over time around self-confidence and boundaries), I would have walked by now. Especially at the "bark" part. I will not tolerate anyone barking at me, especially if I've asked a legitimate question for clarification.

I also do not tolerate having my time wasted anymore. An ex-bandleader used to frequently spend hours at practices going through songs he said he was interested in playing for an upcoming gig, only to unilaterally decide at the last minute during the gig that he didn't want to play them (sometimes for the stupidest of reasons). He also seemed to enjoy changing keys at the last minute onstage (often without telling anyone before kicking off the song) and then mock me for messing up, sounding sloppy, or (at one of our last gigs) tuning my guitar down a tone because I didn't want to fumble with different chord fingerings. I stepped away from the band partly because of that level of time-wasting and disrespect.

If you are going to go ahead with this gig, I would be blunt with them about the situation. "You're expecting me to learn and play 40 songs I've never heard before and there does not seem to be a consensus or reference as to how you're going to play them. I'll do my best but what you get is what you get."

In similar project situations, if people are being lazy or not putting in sufficient effort, I'm fond of saying, "Garbage in = garbage out."

For similar reasons, I hate backing up singers who just want to do everything in a pretentious rubato way. Sorry not sorry -- I'm mainly a rhythm guitarist, I like a relatively predictable pulse/tempo, I don't have the ability to read someone's mind if they want to go that far off script.

 

[2HBStrat]

..

In my 50 years playing experience, "we play it our own way" means, "we're too lazy to learn it the right way first and just settle for whatever gets us through the next

...In my 50 years playing experience, "we play it our own way" means, "we're too lazy to learn it the right way first and just settle for whatever gets us through the next few bars."

Losers.

I feel your pain, and I have to deal with this in one of the bands I'm in.

Nobody in the band, except for me, actually works up songs from the recording. The BL gets the words and chords online. If the chords are wrong, and they often are, that's him doing the song, in his own words, "his way." The drummer might listen to the song(s) on the way to rehearsal but he doesn't even try to play the drum patterns that are on the record. He falls back on one of the two or three beats he knows. I don't think the lead guitarist listens to the songs at all, content to just jam on whatever song it is and not even try to play the parts that are on the record, not even the so-called 'signature' licks. It's really frustrating to me and the overall vibe of us just jamming to songs is, I think, affecting our ability to book gigs and hold a crowd.

 

[srblue5]

Everything was going fine until I went to rehearsal only to discover that they play many of the songs "their own way."
So many of the arrangements I've spent hours charting and learning are in need of a serious edit. That's a lot of time wasted.
What makes it worse, is that the group has no recordings of the way they play it, and we have a gig at a very nice, very popular place coming up in 2 weeks. They act as if I should already know their version and grudgingly want to work out the arrangements at rehearsal to play it their way. What a waste of time! If they had a recording I, and the drummer, would just show up prepared and there would be no stress.

Kind of off topic but this reminds me of a project I contributed guitar stems to earlier this year for a friend of a friend.

I was sent a basic scratch track and I went through it a few times, writing out the chord progression myself. However, the chord progression for what was marked as the chorus wasn't always consistent throughout the track and there was also a clash between one of the piano chords and the underlying bass note in the scratch track at certain points. It sounded like a mistake, as if the person who put together the basic track wasn't sure of themselves -- it didn't sound like intentional dissonance.

I sent a message to the guy to try to clarify the chord progression for the chorus and to clarify what the chord/note was supposed to be for that clashing part. The reply was: "They're just simple chords, bro."

I wish I had walked away at that point but I gamely stuck it out. Did my best to record guitar stems that fit, to navigate the uncertain chords and work around the clashing note(s). But when the song came out, most of what I contributed wasn't used (though I was still credited). The "producer" had obviously not completely written or finished the song when he sent it to me for my stems but a discussion/collaboration around my concerns with his basic track/progression or a heads up that "Sorry, I had to rewrite the song and your parts didn't fit" would have been nice. That was a lot of time wasted writing out the chord chart and working on my stems. I won't do that ever again. "They're just simple chords, bro? Cool, then you shouldn't have any difficulty with writing them out for me."

 

[scrapyardblue]

A seasoned Pro should be versatile enough to step in, analyze how the band is playing a given tune and blend in. If it's Country, get in the pocket with the drummer and build that tune together, paying attention of course to what and how the lead vocalist is steering the song. Yes, flubs will be made, but put them behind you and keep moving it forward.

Says the poster from Mistake Lake

And all along I thought music was supposed to be fun.

 

[2HBStrat]

I am learning 40 songs for a band/gig that I have never played before on bass and had 4 weeks to do it. And the new drummer as of Monday, has 2 weeks to learn the material.
Everything was going fine until I went to rehearsal only to discover that they play many of the songs "their own way."
So many of the arrangements I've spent hours charting and learning are in need of a serious edit. That's a lot of time wasted.
What makes it worse, is that the group has no recordings of the way they play it, and we have a gig at a very nice, very popular place coming up in 2 weeks. They act as if I should already know their version and grudgingly want to work out the arrangements at rehearsal to play it their way. What a waste of time! If they had a recording I, and the drummer, would just show up prepared and there would be no stress.
I find this very challenging, stupid, wasteful, counter-productive, amateur, and lazy on their part. They don't even have some of the chord progressions right and bark that they've been doing it this way for 20 years.....

If it's any consolation in today's world the way they are doing things would not be a hindrance to the success of the band. Once, in between "real" band gigs, I took a gig with a pretty bad band...great people but not a great band...they played chords wrong and left parts out of songs, etc., etc. However, when I joined them they were playing two nights a week at a local bar and when I quit they/we were playing four nights. The crowd loved them. IMO, in this particular situation, do your best to play the songs ":their" way and do your best to have a great gig.

 

[GGardner]

root and five gets paid.

bumper sticker

 

[Wally]

Hey, if this band changes the chords and the melody, imho they need to change the lyrics and copyright the material as their own.
I enjoy interesting interpretations of music, but the interpretations need to be done within the confines of basic chord arrangement and melody…imho.

 

[Wally]

Deleted duplicate.

 

[Blue Bill]

I tend to agree with the posts that suggest you just deal with the "we do it our way" routine. I guess it depends on a couple other things: First, do you like the other guys in the band? Are they fun and enthusiastic? Second, do you have other gigs you can jump into? For me, I'd rather be playing in a situation that's occasionally annoying, rather than sitting at home on the couch.

Best of luck, I hope it works out for you.

I suppose I should admit that I've been playing with a group, for a few years, that does it "our way"... Yeah it can be annoying. Even worse, our main singer has a girlfriend that insists on singing a few songs with us on most nights; she is not a good singer. But we play at his warehouse, which is a really great place, lots of room, we can play a loud as we want, drums, PA, amps etc., can be left set up, super convenient.

I've convinced myself the good outweighs the bad, and still enjoy it when we get together every week, plus a few gigs. I keep my eye out for other opportunities, but haven't found anything better, yet. YMMV.

 

[Chester Burnett]

I’m sure you could pull it off. I’d have recorded rehearsal on my phone and sucked it up. Some of the bands I’ve had the most fun in were kind of disorganized. I usually give bands a one-gig benefit of the doubt.

 

[2HBStrat]

Hey, if this band changes the chords and the melody, imho they need to change the lyrics and copyright the material as their own.
I enjoy interesting interpretations of music, but the interpretations need to be done within the confines of basic chord arrangement and melody…imho.

I swear that's how the song "Messy" by Lola Young was created. She was singing "Dreams" by Fleetwood Mac and was maybe jamming and decided to change the lyrics and a new song was born. It's almost the same song even down to some of the guitar licks.

 

[Harmonic]

What about playing with a capo? I've come to gigs and the singer says "we play this in C" Well it was recorded in A.

 

[getbent]

What about playing with a capo? I've come to gigs and the singer says "we play this in C" Well it was recorded in A.

I am dreaming of the day where I see a band and the bass player busts out the capo. I will buy a round for the house when I see it!

 

[Telenator]

I am dreaming of the day where I see a band and the bass player busts out the capo. I will buy a round for the house when I see it!

You laugh.
The group I was playing with before this one played a ton of originals and a slew of really cool, but totally obscure music and they used capos for more than half the songs. I almost went nuts transposing the tunes and then trying learn and remember them. It would have been a gig per month, maybe, and the winter off. Keeping up a set list like that is way too labor intensive for this old boy!

 

[getbent]

You laugh.
The group I was playing with before this one played a ton of originals and a slew of really cool, but totally obscure music and they used capos for more than half the songs. I almost went nuts transposing the tunes and then trying learn and remember them. It would have been a gig per month, maybe, and the winter off. Keeping up a set list like that is way too labor intensive for this old boy!

In every band I've been in, I have had to be 'song guy'.... In the old days, it was binders of songs... any 'capo' stuff, I'd just do all the different versions for the bass player etc... I have (sadly) usually been 'theory guy' too... essentially, most people are lazy, but if I didn't do the work, stuff would stay jacked up for a long time.

The only advantage was when some joker would want to do a song I'd hate and I'd just drag my feet until people forgot about it.... you can generally bet that someone's great idea isn't so great that they'll write it up and print it out and bring it (and put holes in it.)