Vintage vs. medium jumbo frets (from old thread)

[FenderNashville]

I really don't buy the "hard to bend" thing with vintage frets...

Let's take look at David Gilmour. He's the true master of pentatonic bends. Take a look and see what frets his famous black/black strat uses....

Vintage frets!

Hendrix and Paige used both, to my knowledge...depending on the guitar. The answer is both. It's preference, really. To say that vintage frets don't bend well....it sounds to be a problem with the person's playing to me.

Vintage frets to me, feel smooth. They feel less obtrusive...less like oversized speedbumps. I think they look better, too. Of course, this is only my opinion when it comes to fender guitars.

I'm not saying that bending isn't more optimized with medium jumbos, but I'm saying the difference that some here are making it out to be is pretty extreme IMO. It has more to do with the fretboard radius.

 

[gitlvr]

I used to love Jumbo frets. Played them for 20 years.
Then I started playing in my church. Playing in the church, the style is different, and there is frequent use of the capo. With jumbo frets, it's hard to get the capo right so that it doesn't pull the strings out of tune. So I'm switching to smaller frets, like what was on my Martin acoustic. Don't know if that's vintage or not, but it sure is much friendlier to the capo.

 

[Bartholomew3]

Have a 68 tele with original size frets plus a Les Paul - tele is set-up with .10, LP with .11

Never had a problem bending anything - it's about technique and having some skill doing bends and vibrato. So I don't buy the "hard to bend" thing either.

I also think they ship Fender with .09 so beginners can bend out of tune all day long - sell more guitars that way.

Most of the younger guys I see posting their slinky string and/or distorted mess videos are pretty lame but I guess we all had to start somewhere.

 

[James J LaRue]

I recently refretted mine with Jumbos...does play way easier in some ways, the old frets were not just "vintage" but heavily worn. But the vibe and sound seem to be different now. Not BAD, in fact in many way better, but i think I should have went a bit smaller. My thinking was that I could radius the frets to be slightly flatter than the board, keeping the board stock. So I got jumbos so there would be more fret material to sand down to be able to get the extra height toward the E strings for a flatter radius on the frets themselves...but I didn't end up filing it that way. I think for me, 6105 is about the biggest I'd want for Fender, maybe one size down from that I think the vintage spec is cool too, though probably would need to be replaced each fretjob. not enough material to file down once they get worn.

 

[Ricky D.]

Polished tall frets make for easier bending because your fingers don't touch wood. I muscle the strings too much to take advantage of that. I tend to play out of tune on tall frets.

Vintage frets and radius are just fine with me, learned on them in the 60's. I do like bendig the light strings now, 10's and 11's are easier than 13's.

 

[andrenighthound]

Does one get less fret buzz with smaller, (in height), frets?

I'm playing 8 string guitars and looking to get a new one, a carvin, and order it with the smallest frets they have in stainless and a 20" radius fretboard.

I don't have small frets on any guitars yet, but I think like the OP said that he thinks that bending is done easier on a flatter radius.

 

[Paul G.]

After my dalliance with G&L ASATs, I learned to appreciate somewhat bigger frets. It's not about bending (I bend and use vibrato on my acoustic with .013s and low frets all the time) but wider frets just feel less sharp and make playing smoother.

What I prefer is Gibson style "Medium Jumbos". These are no taller than vintage Fender style, but wider. I also found after refretting my current tele with these that the tone of the guitar changed for the better, it sounds "firmer" and a bit less wiry.

Of course YMMV and all that jazz.

P.

 

[Guitarmadcat]

I personally think it's to do with the type of hands/ fingers one has. I have personally met and shaken hands with Jimi Hendrix and David Gilmour (yea, bloody name-dropper, I know!) J.H's fingers were unusually long and D.Gs hands are enormous - he's a big guy anyway. My point being that these guitar heroes - to name but two - have more strength in their hands than the average player, therefore making playing on vintage frets a breeze.

Well, for what it's worth, that's my conclusion. For myself, it's 10s over jumbo frets.

 

[GigsbyBoyUK]

Frets are just about the only part of a guitar where I have no preferences. Neck back shape and size, fingerboard radius, scale length...all seem to matter to me, but I hardly notice frets at all. I can play and bend as well on little frets as I can big ones, and my hands are average size. Anyone else in the 'I don't get it' camp when it comes to frets?

 

[Telemach_1]

I personally think it's to do with the type of hands/ fingers one has. I have personally met and shaken hands with Jimi Hendrix and David Gilmour (yea, bloody name-dropper, I know!) J.H's fingers were unusually long and D.Gs hands are enormous - he's a big guy anyway. My point being that these guitar heroes - to name but two - have more strength in their hands than the average player, therefore making playing on vintage frets a breeze.

Well, for what it's worth, that's my conclusion. For myself, it's 10s over jumbo frets.

True, but I'd like to add a few more things.
It's also a question of how much s.o. sweats, how acidious s.o. 's hands are and what sort of lacquer the neck has been sprayed with.

I've been playing modern radius and moderately higher frets on my Fender guitars for the last few years. I'm a pro vintage fret guy for a number of bone hard reasons, but thing is that I got damn used to the modern features.
I purchased a 52 RI just recently and didn't think much of the frets because I expected to be a win win home play anyway since I've been playing this for the most time of my playing years.
Playing at home was perfectly smooth but after a few nights on stage I had to realize what I had almost forgotten. Under the lights and w. all that adrenaline the nitro laquer felt a lot more sticky than the poly coat. Together w. the lower frets you have considerably more of a sticky rubbing feel. It also took some time to adjust my timing and finger vibrato but it will probably take somewhat longer to adjust to my accuracy of pull down bendings. problem is that due to the radius the string to finger contact gets looser than pulling on a modern radius neck. In my case I happen to miss notes when the strings slip off my finger tips during the down bend motion.

I will give me some time to see if I can satisfactorily adapt back to the vintage frets. If not I'll have to put some moderately higher frets on it.

 

[Joe Baggadonitz]

Jimi Hendrix tuned down half a step to E-flat - bending strings was different for him. I'm not sure how much frets were a factor for him.
Professional guitar players like the ones mentioned play(ed) all the time. You play the same guitar night after night for months like those guys did, you get very familiar with your instrument. You stick with what you like.

 

[tothemax]

I just bought an import Tele with Jumbo frets expecting that it would play like butter... actually it does but... I found that if you are heavy handed you'll pull the open chords out of tune. I'm getting used to it now but you really need to use a light touch - as for buzzing that may be a setup issue.

I bought a package of the Stew-Mac jumbo fret wire to use on a partscaster Tele I have and am reconsidering because I tend to play hard. I may save these for a bass. As for note bending it's a dream it's more like playing a scalloped neck where you have pay more attention not to bend the note. I ordered the import Tele so I didn't have a chance to play it first - it was that good of a deal.

IMO...

 

[telex76]

I don't like the wider frets. Kind of like the taller.

 

[Jimmy R]

It's definitely a personal preference. All of those guys are going to smoke regardless of their guitar's specs. There are so many options out there. You just have to find what's right for you. As someone who started playing close to ten years ago, I've got to have modern frets. If I use vintage frets I feel that my fingertips make too much contact with the fingerboard. Some love that, I don't.

 

[tothemax]

I agree with Jimmy,

On my old Strat the maple FB looks like it went through a war. I'm thinking the medium jumbos may be the way to go.

 

[Ricky D.]

Does one get less fret buzz with smaller, (in height), frets?

I'm playing 8 string guitars and looking to get a new one, a carvin, and order it with the smallest frets they have in stainless and a 20" radius fretboard.

I don't have small frets on any guitars yet, but I think like the OP said that he thinks that bending is done easier on a flatter radius.

Fret size is irrelevant to fret buzz. Buzz is strictly a set-up issue: neck relief, nut slots, fret level, and saddle height.

Effort involved with bending is pretty much the same on any radius. The advantage for bending on a flatter fretboard is in reducing "fretting out" on big bends high on the board. Setting the action higher offsets that.

 

[Rod Parsons]

My Warmouth neck with 6105 frets feels like running my fingers up and down railroad ties. At first, when I got it, I thought the same thing, but I got used to it and have been playing it for most of 17 years.. BUT!!! My white blonde Squier CV 50, that I got last year has frets that are way, way, way better in my opinion. 100 times better for everything I do, period. Twice as fast, at least. To me no guitar I have ever touched came anywhere close to how good these CV frets feel to me. Are they close to vintage? They feel pretty 'vintage' to me. And they bend with fabulous ease and accuracy.... Bend smoother than the smoothest butter.. I wish the CV necks were a tad larger, though. I wish American guitars knew how to do frets like the Chinese...