Various Champ amps

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by schmee, Apr 7, 2019.

  1. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    Want a small tube amp. I've had normal Champs and that is not what I want. I want more clean and robust low end. Prefer to not go as far as a Princeton for cost and I dont need the power. So I'm considering various Vibro Champs, Super Champs etc. How do these hold up? I will likely mostly use it in the Duo so it doesn't need to hold up to a band. Are there any good clones out there? Who makes them?

    Red Knob Champ 12, I assume these are circuit board construction. Single 6L6 w/reverb but no vibrato.
    (this may fit well with what I want)
    SF Vibro Champ-Tube rectifier 1 x 6V6
    Champ ll- SS rectifier, no vibrato. 2 x 6V6

    Was the Champ 12 the only one 1 x 6L6?

    Any other suggestions for similar amps?
     
  2. Dismalhead

    Dismalhead Poster Extraordinaire

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    Get yourself a used Super Champ X2 or XD and swap the speaker for something cleaner. I put an Eminence Legend 1058 in mine.
     
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  3. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    I have considered that. Was thinking even smaller but it may be the best option..
     
  4. ReverendRevolver

    ReverendRevolver Tele-Holic

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    What champs have you used? SS ones a junk, the "champ 600" isn't as fendery as bf, sf, vibro, or tweed ones, the XD is different too.

    You want a 12" with one 6l6, that's a supro blues king, 15w. Closer to princeton than champ. Still more fendery than el84 amps.
     
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  5. Whoa Tele

    Whoa Tele Friend of Leo's

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    I owned a Goodsell Champton that I regret selling. It's a Champ/Princeton hybrid with a ten inch speaker in a champ sized cab. Mine had a tone knob but I don't think it comes stock on the new version. Really good clean headroom and mine had a Ragin Cajun as the stock speaker.
     
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  6. Whoa Tele

    Whoa Tele Friend of Leo's

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    I forgot to mention Jim At Lil Dawg makes great tweed clones as well and will beef up the transformer for more cleans.
     
  7. Snfoilhat

    Snfoilhat Tele-Afflicted

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    I recently built a very small single-ended amp based on the EL95 power tube. I estimate it puts out 2 watts. I have played it at two weekend practices since I finished it, in two different cabinets. Here's why I'm chiming in:

    Week one. Extra deep (11.25"), extra tall (22") open-back cabinet loaded with a pair of 10" Eminence 1058-alike speakers.

    Week two. Extra deep (11.25"), extra wide (23") open back cabinet loaded with one 12" Pyle Driver speaker.

    Totally different sounds from week to week. Remarkably powerful bass in the first cab. Very controlled, shelved bass in the second cab.

    This isn't to get into the debate around EQ, power supplies, big cathode-bypass caps. Not a flub vs tight issue. You probably know about that stuff and can make your own decisions.

    My point is same room, same amp, similar settings, and very nearly same cabinet dimensions (turn one on its side and they are quite similar), and two very different sounds that brought out very different characters in the amp. We naturally associate the sound of a production amp with the circuit, because the product line is mostly named and marketed around circuit differences. People gravitate to power output, tube type, and a raft of nuances that don't matter nearly as much as is commonly said.

    Man, speakers (plus cab) are everything! The problem is major amp companies don't design a product -- they design a product line. The low wattage amp gets the too-small cab, cheap speaker, and the limited feature set again and again. Because it is the student amp. Because your revenues are higher if you have three choices (or thirteen) all at different prices. The small company can build a fancy Champ or a souped-up Princeton, but still face double headwinds from consumer expectation ("This amp has fewer parts! Less wood! Why is it just as expensive as the Deluxe clone??") and no economies of scale.
     
  8. Greggorios

    Greggorios Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

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    Check out a "Gries 5". There's info on this forum and on their website: http://www.griesamps.com/ It's a great black face Champ circuit with a full tone stack. 5 watts, 12" speaker (Eminence SC GA 64) Beautiful cleans! The tone stack can also be blended out of the circuit for more of a tweed feel. Separate gain, bright and master volume. No affiliation with the company but I do own one and really love it. Perfect at home amp. (Dave Gries the builder is a great guy and a pleasure to work with. Highly recommended.)
     
  9. dougstrum

    dougstrum Tele-Holic

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    I like my champ 12, got it a long time ago. My brother had it for a good while
    Then I got it back:twisted:

    It's the only single ended 6L6 I know off.
    The basic channel V T B sounds great. I don't use the OD; it isn't great. Like wise other features on amp.

    Had a VibroChamp~ should've kept it:rolleyes:
    But Champ 12 is a nice small amp, and not to pricey. It is circuit board, never gave me any trouble, though I did replace input jack.
     
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  10. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    Yes, cabs and speakers make a huge difference. Cab depth especially. Think about why Bass cabs are so deep! it creates huge bass freqs. I like guitar cabs in the 10.5" deep range. Good lows, not boomy. 11.5 can work fine, by 12 too boomy usually.
     
  11. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    I've had SF Champs, I think 3 over the last 125 years. Not for me. Had a Super Champ XD, it wasnt bad, but not for me in a 5 piece blues band, but may be good for this Duo thing...
     
  12. max_twang

    max_twang Tele-Afflicted

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    If you're looking for 'more clean and robust low end' why not start by putting a more efficient speaker into a Champ?

    Another thought -- you could upgrade PT and OT from the standard Champ. Allen Amplification sells the parts...

    http://www.allenamps.com/trans.html
     
  13. Dismalhead

    Dismalhead Poster Extraordinaire

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    Just looked at it and it looks very cool. Not a bad price either.

    http://www.goodsellamps.com/goodsell-deluxe-amps/champton---5-watt-1x10.html
     
  14. ReverendRevolver

    ReverendRevolver Tele-Holic

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    So,

    Red Knob isn't a popular choice, mostly because of reputation, but it's not very diverse.

    SF champ from the 70s is what I think of when I hear "champ", but you may want to look for a non-champ running 6v6s or 6l6.

    The Ibanez ts15? Not super fendery, but I'd put it closer to fenders than other stuff.

    Supro Blues King 12 or a Princeton is what I'm after, instead of any champ.

    You say "duo", are you playing with a drummer and nobody else?

    If so, try something with a 15" speaker. Worked for me for ages. One of my few success stories.
    I'm currently quite bent on obtaining a BK, but if I didn't need a physically smallish, under 30lb amp right now, I'd be picking up a Fender Excelsior off reverb that already has a tone knob mod.
     
  15. androo

    androo Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

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    Maybe I missed it, but what's the duo? Where ya'll gonna be playing?
     
  16. Larmo63

    Larmo63 Tele-Afflicted

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  17. androo

    androo Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

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    It looks like you're in the NW...this looks like an amp I'd like to have one day...local custom maker here in Portland. I'd totally use this amp with a vocal/guitar duo at a winery gig.

    http://www.bensonamps.com/amps/nathanjunior
     
  18. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    Been there done that. Still too nasty for me. Great for lead, use it like a pedal! But I need nice clean musical chording and comping, not something that sounds like a megaphone!
     
  19. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    Just me + a looper and a lady singer. We do everything from Bonnie Raitt to Nora Jones...
     
  20. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire

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    Wow, $200? That's pretty cool. Wonder what it sounds like. I could build one but couldn't buy the parts for not for that $!

    Later: NEVER MIND! the $200 is a come on. They want $1600, haha No wonder no one has heard of them!
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2019
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