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Unique Wiring Diagram?

Discussion in 'Tele-Technical' started by Luke1026, Jan 26, 2021.

  1. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    I’m wanting to do a wiring mod to a T-Style but can’t seem to find an existing wiring diagram anywhere. I’m beginning to think it doesn’t exist.

    It would consist of a 5-way Blade Switch, 1 x 250k vol. pot, and 2 x 250k mini-pots. I’ve attached an image of the basic parts below. I have a control plate with the extra hole already. I’m hoping this is achievable without a DPDT or toggle switch.

    I’m looking to combine a 5-tone 5-way switch with a separate tone control for the neck and another separate tone control for the bridge. The 5 tones could be something like this:

    1. Neck
    2. Neck and Bridge
    3. Bridge
    4. Neck and Bridge series
    5. Neck and Bridge series/out of phase

    Not necessarily in that order or even those wiring particular mods – I’m open to other options as well.

    If anyone is aware of such a wiring diagram or knows how to wire this up, your help would be much appreciated.

    HD - Tele 5-Way 2-Tone Diagram.jpg
     
  2. SRHmusic

    SRHmusic Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

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    Usually to achieve phase or series/parallel switching a DPDT is used. A push-pull pot or two, for example, would allow that with the same holes you have and no toggles. Or, a super switch might do this given there are only two single coils. I'll have to think about that.

    What did you have in mind for the mini pots and tone control wiring when both pickups are on?
     
  3. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    I wouldn't mind if both tone pots were on for any wiring configuration that included both pickups at the same time. If that's not possible, I would prefer control over the bridge as it's usually the brighter or thinner sounding pickup.

    I have a 5-way Super Switch also if that's need for series/parallel but I'm open to other tone possibilities where a DPDT is not needed.
     
  4. Peegoo

    Peegoo Poster Extraordinaire

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    This diagram will get you there...but if you want discrete tone controls for each pickup, run the hot lead from each pickup to its own tone control, and then onward to the switch.

    Note that you have to have three wires from the neck pickup (an isolated ground lead connected to the metal cover). And remember to add the string ground.

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. Tuxedo Poly

    Tuxedo Poly Friend of Leo's

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    This gives the series out of phase.
    The superswitch is problematic, the standard 4 pole is difficult (impossible?) to fit in the Tele control rout. Slim versions are available from some parts suppliers.
    Tele_5-Way_Series_Series_OoP.jpg
     
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  6. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    Thanks for your responses. I'm familiar with the switch wiring in the examples above, the main problem I have is how to hook up two separate tone controls to these types of setups. I hadn't considered hooking up the hot lead to each tone pot - thanks Peegoo, I'll give that some thought.

    Also, I'm using G&L MFD pickups for this experiment so I don't have to deal with the third wire on the neck P'up. I have an unused 5-way super switch that I could put into service for this as well.
     
  7. itskohler

    itskohler TDPRI Member

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    Would looking at Strat wiring diagrams help with the wiring of the 2 tone pots?
     
  8. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    I've done that, the problem is the unique 5-tone Tele switch wiring that complicates how to hook up two tone pots so that they work.
     
  9. Deaf Eddie

    Deaf Eddie Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    I'm thinking that an individual tone for the neck pickup only would require a FIFTH pole, due to the fact you have to switch it to the other lead when the neck is out of phase.
     
  10. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    This is why I posted my question, so many of you here are much more familiar with control wiring than I. I'm trying to increase my understanding so that eventually I could figure these types of wiring issues myself.

    Thanks for all your input and ideas - keep them coming!
     
  11. Deaf Eddie

    Deaf Eddie Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    The lead to the volume is a solid line across the switch - hanging a tone control pot on that would be the same as the normal idea of running it off the volume.

    Here's a thought that APPROACHES what you want: you could use the unused pole in those diagrams to alternately select between two tone pots. I wouldn't be strictly the bridge pickup vs the neck pickup, but you would select which tone pot plays in which throws of the switch by changing the blue and purple jumpers on the 5-way. Here's one way (pardon my copyright infringement edit):

    upload_2021-1-26_14-0-12.png

    Wired as above, the neck, series, and parallel throws utilize the middle tone pot; the bridge and series/out of phase throws use the back tone pot. You can also use two different value caps, if desired. You don't get both tone pots in any throw; I can't figure out any way to get that...
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2021
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  12. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    Hey Deaf Eddie, thanks for laying out this approach. I was hoping to use different value caps as you suggest, such as 0.022uF on the first tone pot and 0.047uF on the back one. The fact that both pots won't work together at the same time in this setup is ok.

    The other option I was considering was wiring it up with a PTB control setup. The problem with this is finding 500k and 1Meg mini pots - one with a DPDT switch, which would allow the use of a standard 5-way. I don't think I will bother trying to find them so I will resign myself to just two separate tone controls - if that is achievable.

    It looks like using a 5-way Super Switch is unavoidable.
     
  13. grzz51

    grzz51 TDPRI Member

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    Just a bit curious here.......Leo made the first Tele then the first Strat about 70 years ago........ he numbered the switch positions #1 for the bridge then went toward the neck with the other #'s. Why do people keep getting it wrong? Asked by a nosy old fart who's been playing Fenders for about 57 years........LOL
     
  14. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    grzz51, I can't answer for everyone but I suppose it could be that intuitively many people see the neck position as the starting position, hence #1. Another reason could be that here in the West we read from left to right. I'm sure there could be other explanations as well.

    My numbering in the opening post was not intended to identify pickup positions, rather it was just to show the 5 tones I was considering.
     
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  15. Deaf Eddie

    Deaf Eddie Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Actually, your numbering scheme is simply how the LUGS on the switch are labeled. Works for me.

    I agree, almost all Tele players label the bridge as throw #1, because that's what Leo called it. But remember, Leo also called the Strat's vibrato bridge a tremolo, and the Vibrolux amp actually has tremolo, not vibrato. So...

    As for Strat guys, in my experience its about 65%/35% for bridge as #1 as opposed to neck as #1. I'm in the 35% that call the neck #1, because it's the "front" pickup and the bridge is the "back" pickup - that's from Gibson, but it seems pretty universally accepted. So, front to back = 1 to 5. Also, when I'm playing and look down at the guitar, I see the switch as left to right, neck to bridge; ergo 1 to 5...
     
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  16. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    I finally got to wiring up my ASAT according to the diagram kindly provided by Deaf Eddie. Everything works and sounds great! The only issue is that the volume doesn't turn off completely. When I turn it to 0 it sounds like it's between 2-3. I'm pretty sure I wired everything correctly and was quite certain the pot was good as well. Not sure what would cause this.

    Any ideas anyone?
     
  17. Deaf Eddie

    Deaf Eddie Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Check your grounds.
     
  18. johnDH

    johnDH Tele-Meister

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    Given a superswitch, and provided it can fit in the cavity, you can definitely do as you want. With two tones, id wire each one directly between the two main leads coming from their respective pickups, each with their own cap.

    Because you are having a series option, this will give you really interesting tones as you fade down the treble off one pickup, letting treble from the other come through strongly.
     
  19. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    Just finished testing all grounds for continuity and everything checked out.
     
  20. Luke1026

    Luke1026 Tele-Meister

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    The Super Switch does fit the cavity and I will at some point try the wiring option you suggested - Thanks johnDH.
     
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