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This makes me glad I swore off Gibsons back in 2008

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by euro, Sep 10, 2014.

  1. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    Why ask a question, then answer it with another question?
     
  2. studio1087

    studio1087 Telefied Silver Supporter

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    I love the satin Melody Makers and I have two satin 70's Tributes. I think that removing the satin/worn finishes is a bad move.

    If you sell things that are more expensive you make more margin. It's simple percentages. If you profit $15 for every $100 sold it helps to focus on higher priced items......I get that. The downside is alienating all the entry level buyers
     
  3. Sherpa

    Sherpa Tele-Holic

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    This is what happens when a manufacturer transitions from instrument maker to purveyor of lifestyle accoutrements. Henry J. is not in the business of making fine instruments as Gibson did in the past - he's looking to cash in on the brand cachet earned over the past five or six decades, and squeeze it dry by upping the unit value per item. The only way he can do this is by reinventing what a Gibson is all about.

    From a business standpoint, it's an interesting case study, and may or may not increase shareholder value. As a musician looking to Gibson as an instrument manufacturer, I find it sad and deplorable. These two positions are as irreconcilable as they are neither right nor wrong in themselves. All I know is that it'll be a long, long time before Gibson returns to its roots and original purpose, if it ever does.

    In the meantime, there are plenty of other choices on the market for the working musician, especially if potential resale value isn't as important to the buyer as the feel, quality and playability of the instrument.

    That being said, I have no respect whatsoever for Henry J., as he chose a company near and dear to my heart to play out his Harvard Business School-derived management and marketing theories. I wish he'd have chosen any industry-leading company in a different instead.
     
  4. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    I don't get that. What if the market is so much smaller on the more expensive things that while your margin is higher, your volume is much, much lower?

    I shouldn't doubt Henry J. I'm sure he's researched the market...

    [​IMG]
     
  5. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

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    I'm not fond of Henry either, but he did save the company back in the 80's. In my experience, a 1987 Les Paul is a superior musical instrument to a 1977 one. Sorry Kalamazoo. And Harvard Business School ain't so bad either.

    I like a lot of Gibson guitars.

    Hope they keep makin em for a good long time.
     
  6. Wrong-Note Rod

    Wrong-Note Rod Poster Extraordinaire

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    They're already incredibly expensive, especially the new Les Pauls are just stupid money.

    I'm glad I already got the Gibsons I need and dont have to buy a new one.
     
  7. Telepi

    Telepi Friend of Leo's

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    The only way to get Slash's tone is to buy a Slash Signature Gibson that costs $1,500 more than a Standard Gibson. Everyone knows that.

    I'm waiting for the Slash Version 5.2 with the Min-etune and AFD computer chip that plugs into the on board tone controls.
     
  8. Octave Doctor

    Octave Doctor Tele-Afflicted

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    Maybe since gibson doesn't make their own amps, maybe they should follow through and have somebody else make their guitars, especially since so many people just buy them for the name.
     
  9. TheRumRunner

    TheRumRunner Tele-Afflicted

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    Don't be a party pooper and bring facts into the game, this is a 10 pager for sure.:D

    DW
     
  10. Lobomov

    Lobomov Friend of Leo's

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    First impression is, that none of this will affect the Memphis plant ... :)
     
  11. Tele Fan

    Tele Fan Friend of Leo's

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    I don't know if this will end up being true or not, but I'm awfully glad I found a good used ES-335 and that my wife was my cheerleader for finally getting one (life long dream guitar).
     
  12. stankepanck

    stankepanck Tele-Holic

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    Same thing could be said about Fender and our precious Telecasters. Just sayin.
     
  13. studio1087

    studio1087 Telefied Silver Supporter

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    Selling cheap and trying to catch up on volume is difficult. Selling less at higher profits works well. My econ professors used to use the model of a car dealer.....assume a dealer has to earn $50,000 profit per month just to break even. If there are $2500 margin dollars when you sell a Cadillac and $250 margin dollars when you sell a Chevy think of the volume of business and the volume of inventory each dealer has to manage just to break even.

    If you had a guitar shop in a strip mall and if you needed to clear $7000 in profit every month just to break even, think of how tough it would be if you only sold $149 Squiers that each yielded $25 in profit. You would need to move pallets and pallets of guitars (volume sales baby!) just to break even. You would need to sell 280 cheap guitars every month to break even.

    Henry knows what he's doing from a business angle. I fear that this is what happens to a guitar factory when creativity and passion and support of the arts become secondary to the bottom line. They're a business and I get that but I have always appreciated that Gibson offered so many USA made guitars for less than $1000. I have 4 Melody Makers and 3 Specials (LP's & SG's) that each cost less than $1000 brand new. It sounds to me like $500 Melody Makers and $899 Specials are no longer a focus. They're going to focus on things that cost more and that makes me sad. I think that the $899 Gibson guitars were gateway guitars to the $2000 Gibson guitars. Customers have to start somewhere. They could be shooting themselves in the foot by removing the affordable guitars.

    You guys who bought the new (recent) Melody Maker with the wide head stock......keep 'em! Take good care of them.
     
  14. Lunchie

    Lunchie Poster Extraordinaire

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    And Martin, Marshall, Vox, Hiwatt, Ampeg and a bazillion other brands and products. Its not a bad thing, it just means they got it right 60 years ago. However, with amps I guess you can argue that with transistors and digital processing that the change needed to be made. But we still all drool over the Tweed Deluxe and Plexi :cool:.
     
  15. Telepathist

    Telepathist Tele-Afflicted

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    I can't imagine Gibson thriving by mostly selling guitars to the well heeled. Most folks of means didn't get that way by squandering their money.

    It sounds like a peculiar business model. I'm starting to join those that are skeptical of the story.


    ( ''""-.-"""-.
    !!!!=I===I=======(==) :
    ( ,,,,-..___.'
     
  16. Lowbassnotes

    Lowbassnotes Friend of Leo's

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    It'd be interesting to be a fly on the wall at one of their meeting where demographics is being discussed, what they think is going to sell well and their vision for the future.
     
  17. telecat33511

    telecat33511 Tele-Holic

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    I'm just glad I got out when I did and sold mine for $500 less than what I paid in great condition

    I'm going with these now
    LP Custom KILLERS
    Look great play fantastic sound great - AND
    you can take them to a gig
    OMEGA
    http://www.electraguitar.com/pages/wireless-guitar-system



     
  18. Lunchie

    Lunchie Poster Extraordinaire

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    Everyone sits down and the first thing out of Henrys mouth is 'What did PRS do today!?'
     
  19. DavidM1

    DavidM1 Tele-Holic

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    I'm sure Gibson will protect the demand for a good vintage style Les Paul by keeping it in the line at a premium. Sadly it will no longer be a Les Paul Standard but some vulgar tribute name.

    They are trying to do what Fender has already done with the American Standard and Deluxe, which is to update the design with new hardware, changed neck/ fretboard etc. The aim is to milk both markets and not simply make modern copies of old hits.

    I think the satin guitars were unusual for Gibson and might have been an experiment in terms of their business. Gibson has always aimed to claim the high end of the market and they are reinforcing this position for 2015.

    The sad thing is the satin guitars are very much 'players' instruments but the company probably felt that they were confusing the high end message.

    Another sad thing is the hardware 'upgrades' on standard models look like they might be duds. Fender tried a few dud upgrades too before settling on the ones with genuine benefit. This seems to be where Gibson is up to and the direction they are heading in.
     
  20. E5RSY

    E5RSY Doctor of Teleocity

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    ...or Reverend.
     
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