Barncaster
Doctor of Teleocity
tklaavo said:
Hey TK,
Well done! I used a bicycle reed switch on my ACW-1 and it worked fine. Does your counter need an external reset button or I it on the unit?
Rob
The low-tech pickup winding thread
- Thread starter tklaavo
- Start date
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Hey TK,
Well done! I used a bicycle reed switch on my ACW-1 and it worked fine. Does your counter need an external reset button or I it on the unit?
Rob
I made a base for the sewing machine and the wire guide:
(image removed)
Need a better bobbin holder, a housing for the counter and a reset button.
Then I took apart two Tokai tele pickups, which were 5 euros a piece. The neck pickup was too weak and the bridge too hot. The winding was out of balance, and I found out the neck pu had much weaker magnets too. I wanted to rebuild them using the flatware, bridge baseplate and neck pu cover.
The original magnets were bigger than my alnico 2 or 5 (they're 0.187" I think) , but I had 12 poles of alnico 3 at 0.195" diameter which were fine with some glue.
So i made a set of alnico 3 tele pickups. 10000 winds of AWG42 on the bridge, 8000 winds of AWG43 on the neck, about the maximum I could fit in there. I had some bad luck with the neck pu, had to wind it three times before I got it done. First I broke the wire in the middle, and the second time the bobbin didn't hold together.
Not yet too convinced with the end result.. The neck sounds quite dark, the bridge is ok, not too harsh, but lacks some overtones. Might work better on a brighter guitar? Or use 500K pots?
Before I assembled the bobbins, I measured them and traced the flatwork on a piece of plywood. I'm going to make routing and drilling templates for tele and strat flatwork, more on this later..
(image removed)
Need a better bobbin holder, a housing for the counter and a reset button.
Then I took apart two Tokai tele pickups, which were 5 euros a piece. The neck pickup was too weak and the bridge too hot. The winding was out of balance, and I found out the neck pu had much weaker magnets too. I wanted to rebuild them using the flatware, bridge baseplate and neck pu cover.
The original magnets were bigger than my alnico 2 or 5 (they're 0.187" I think) , but I had 12 poles of alnico 3 at 0.195" diameter which were fine with some glue.
So i made a set of alnico 3 tele pickups. 10000 winds of AWG42 on the bridge, 8000 winds of AWG43 on the neck, about the maximum I could fit in there. I had some bad luck with the neck pu, had to wind it three times before I got it done. First I broke the wire in the middle, and the second time the bobbin didn't hold together.
Not yet too convinced with the end result.. The neck sounds quite dark, the bridge is ok, not too harsh, but lacks some overtones. Might work better on a brighter guitar? Or use 500K pots?
Before I assembled the bobbins, I measured them and traced the flatwork on a piece of plywood. I'm going to make routing and drilling templates for tele and strat flatwork, more on this later..
Barncaster
Doctor of Teleocity
Hey TK,
I've been working a lot with ALNICO 5. At those wind levels with 42AWG, those pickups, if loaded with ALNICO 5 magnets would sparkle and jump. Give it a try.
Rob
I've been working a lot with ALNICO 5. At those wind levels with 42AWG, those pickups, if loaded with ALNICO 5 magnets would sparkle and jump. Give it a try.
Rob
Barncaster said:
Yeah, a5 has that brightness but now I played these a bit more and got some great tones and like them much more. All three positions have a distinct sound. With many pickups, the middle position is dominated by the neck pup, but with these it's all different.
I just want to try different magnets and all that, some of them will live and some will get recycled. These will live for some time at least..
Rob DiStefano
Doctor of Teleocity
i've worked with every flavor of alnico rod mags, and a5's are still the workhorse for single pups (bumhuckers, too). ditto's for winding with 42awg coil wire, any kinda insulation, don't matter.
Spent 30 euros for six Tokai strat pickups. That gives me 36 alnico 5 magnets and some strat flatware. They had staggered magnets, so now I have different sizes. Even got three white covers.
Decided to wind pups for my unfinished Duo-Sonic build.
This pic kind of sums up what this thread is all about:
See my wooden prototype bobbin holder and a wire tensioner inspired by Rob DS.. And the final turn count of the bridge pickup.
Put half and half A5 and A2 magnets on the bridge pup, A2's on the high strings, because I liked the sound of my first self-made tele bridge pup (which is still waiting for a proper grounding plate). The neck is all A5, about 7900 turns. They're 6.1k and 5.7k.
Still wasn't happy with the tension, so I made this:
Much better.. But now I'm out of 42AWG wire, so no winding for some time. Maybe I can find the time to play those guitars at last?
Decided to wind pups for my unfinished Duo-Sonic build.
This pic kind of sums up what this thread is all about:
See my wooden prototype bobbin holder and a wire tensioner inspired by Rob DS.. And the final turn count of the bridge pickup.
Put half and half A5 and A2 magnets on the bridge pup, A2's on the high strings, because I liked the sound of my first self-made tele bridge pup (which is still waiting for a proper grounding plate). The neck is all A5, about 7900 turns. They're 6.1k and 5.7k.
Still wasn't happy with the tension, so I made this:
Much better.. But now I'm out of 42AWG wire, so no winding for some time. Maybe I can find the time to play those guitars at last?
Resurrecting this thread..
I now have a mule / pony to test pickups. It's not pretty or good, but it almost works as needed:
It's made of scrap and trash mostly. The body is one of my early pinecaster attempts, which was never finished because of bad measurements, oversized neck pocket etc. I painted it matte black to test a cheap paint, which turned out great...
A cheap 6-saddle bridge, which sucks because it's not symmetrical - if the mounting screw locations are measured according to the centerline of the neck, the saddles are off.. a manufacturing fault probably.
Then a Squier strat neck I got for cheap, but had to strip the lacquer and fake "Fender custom shop" decals. Bad fret work, plastic nut. Added danish oil on it.
I made a plastic control plate, it split when drilling, had to glue it together. The switches are for 3 pickups on / off. Wires are screwed on the back:
(You can see I'm testing Keystones there)
So the cavities are through the body for "easy" pickup swapping. But the middle cavity is still too small for a strat pup. Gotta fix it some day.
Neck cavity accepts a humbucker (screwed to the body) if the pickguard is removed.
I've used it for testing when I rewound a Samarium Cobalt Noiseless bridge pup (LINK) and have done some neck humbucker experiments. Those should be going into my winter project guitar #1.
Then I've entered Barncaster territory! There's a lot of buzz going on about Barncaster's Firebird pickups. I want some of that tone too.
Got the bobbins and magnets, which need trimming:
Trimmed with that Dremel kinda tool.
(image removed)
Didn't use any cooling here, I think the vise works as a heat sink, as the piece wasn't hot at all after cutting (the cut-off piece was hot, but still magnetic)
These bobbins had strangely sharp corners, I rounded them with a file (the one on the right is original shape)
Installed magnets, put a piece of thin double-sided tape there.
They fit quite loosely inside this cover:
(image removed)
About 4500 winds on this one. Yes that's blue masking tape. Soldered two wires on the ends:
And another one with over 5000 winds:
I soldered the starts together, taped the coils into a tight package and they still fit in there.
I have no bottom plates for these. All other parts I found locally, but not those. The other one is my earlier version, which has a self-made steel plate back cover, it doubles as the magnet coupler... But it's not good, very difficult to make, screw holes are not in the right place etc etc.
Any suggestions where to buy those bottom plates?
I have tried that one with steel bottom in my mule at the neck position, it works fantastically and sounds good. It has less windings, about 6,2k DC resistance. The new one is 7,2k, could work on the bridge maybe. Not possible to test it yet though.
Thanks to Barncaster, its his research and informative posts that made me do this. These might end up into my winter project #3.
I now have a mule / pony to test pickups. It's not pretty or good, but it almost works as needed:
It's made of scrap and trash mostly. The body is one of my early pinecaster attempts, which was never finished because of bad measurements, oversized neck pocket etc. I painted it matte black to test a cheap paint, which turned out great...
A cheap 6-saddle bridge, which sucks because it's not symmetrical - if the mounting screw locations are measured according to the centerline of the neck, the saddles are off.. a manufacturing fault probably.
Then a Squier strat neck I got for cheap, but had to strip the lacquer and fake "Fender custom shop" decals. Bad fret work, plastic nut. Added danish oil on it.
I made a plastic control plate, it split when drilling, had to glue it together. The switches are for 3 pickups on / off. Wires are screwed on the back:
(You can see I'm testing Keystones there)
So the cavities are through the body for "easy" pickup swapping. But the middle cavity is still too small for a strat pup. Gotta fix it some day.
Neck cavity accepts a humbucker (screwed to the body) if the pickguard is removed.
I've used it for testing when I rewound a Samarium Cobalt Noiseless bridge pup (LINK) and have done some neck humbucker experiments. Those should be going into my winter project guitar #1.
Then I've entered Barncaster territory! There's a lot of buzz going on about Barncaster's Firebird pickups. I want some of that tone too.
Got the bobbins and magnets, which need trimming:
Trimmed with that Dremel kinda tool.
(image removed)
Didn't use any cooling here, I think the vise works as a heat sink, as the piece wasn't hot at all after cutting (the cut-off piece was hot, but still magnetic)
These bobbins had strangely sharp corners, I rounded them with a file (the one on the right is original shape)
Installed magnets, put a piece of thin double-sided tape there.
They fit quite loosely inside this cover:
(image removed)
About 4500 winds on this one. Yes that's blue masking tape. Soldered two wires on the ends:
And another one with over 5000 winds:
I soldered the starts together, taped the coils into a tight package and they still fit in there.
I have no bottom plates for these. All other parts I found locally, but not those. The other one is my earlier version, which has a self-made steel plate back cover, it doubles as the magnet coupler... But it's not good, very difficult to make, screw holes are not in the right place etc etc.
Any suggestions where to buy those bottom plates?
I have tried that one with steel bottom in my mule at the neck position, it works fantastically and sounds good. It has less windings, about 6,2k DC resistance. The new one is 7,2k, could work on the bridge maybe. Not possible to test it yet though.
Thanks to Barncaster, its his research and informative posts that made me do this. These might end up into my winter project #3.
Barncaster
Doctor of Teleocity
Hey TK,
Well done!!! I get my baseplates from Mojotone. For cheap coupling material, two thin steel washers will do as long as they are attracted to magnets, i.e., no stainless steel. For a home made baseplate, you could even use wood or plastic. When potting, use a rubber band to hold the whole assembly together tightly. As long as you pot it with a wax mixture with a fair amount of bees wax to paraffin ratio, and FILL the covers with it, the wax will hold the whole thing together quite well when cool. Bees wax is tenacious stuff made by tenacious little creatures! The cover must be grounded however so in the absence of a metal baseplate you would have to solder a very small lead to the inside of the cover and run it to ground. The problem with this approach is you should not play it at Kwerks house. It's too hot there and you could have a pickup wardrobe malfunction and expose your coils! ;-) For where you live, it should work fine.
This is a great effort TK. This configuration makes for a very nice sounding pickup. Keep working out those details and please post a sound clip if you can.
Rob
Well done!!! I get my baseplates from Mojotone. For cheap coupling material, two thin steel washers will do as long as they are attracted to magnets, i.e., no stainless steel. For a home made baseplate, you could even use wood or plastic. When potting, use a rubber band to hold the whole assembly together tightly. As long as you pot it with a wax mixture with a fair amount of bees wax to paraffin ratio, and FILL the covers with it, the wax will hold the whole thing together quite well when cool. Bees wax is tenacious stuff made by tenacious little creatures! The cover must be grounded however so in the absence of a metal baseplate you would have to solder a very small lead to the inside of the cover and run it to ground. The problem with this approach is you should not play it at Kwerks house. It's too hot there and you could have a pickup wardrobe malfunction and expose your coils! ;-) For where you live, it should work fine.
This is a great effort TK. This configuration makes for a very nice sounding pickup. Keep working out those details and please post a sound clip if you can.
Rob
Thanks Rob, I will investigate these things.
Mojotone has very high overseas shipping costs. I've wanted to order many things from them, but haven't yet enough stuff in the basket to justify it.
Sound clips will be produced when my winter projects are finished (= next summer ..?)
Mojotone has very high overseas shipping costs. I've wanted to order many things from them, but haven't yet enough stuff in the basket to justify it.
Sound clips will be produced when my winter projects are finished (= next summer ..?)
Barncaster
Doctor of Teleocity
Hey TK,
I just had another thought. You could perhaps solder the thin "L" shaped mounting tabs directly to the inside of the covers. It would take a hot iron but probably work. Then from the back of your pickup, all you would see would be your 2 washers embedded in wax. Might work!
Rob
I just had another thought. You could perhaps solder the thin "L" shaped mounting tabs directly to the inside of the covers. It would take a hot iron but probably work. Then from the back of your pickup, all you would see would be your 2 washers embedded in wax. Might work!
Rob
Mmmmmm, taking notes here 
The String King
Tele-Afflicted
Watch this space...
Barncaster
Doctor of Teleocity
Nice to hear that this thread inspires.. There's no need for a hi-tech winder to make a couple of pickups. Some things I've learned:
- it's very important to have the bobbin centered and flat, otherwise the wind will be uneven or you will run the wire off the bobbin
- be sure to mount the bobbin securely on the winder! You could make a holder where you can fix the bobbin with a screw through the middle hole that they usually have. I'm working on it.
- when using fiber flatwork and rod magnets, be sure they're tight, definitely use super glue. If they're loose, you will get warped bobbins because the tension of the coil will expand the bobbin at the ends. Has happened to me.
- the tensioner makes the job 100 times easier, don't even try without it..
- wind many different pickups and try them - it's not black magic. Different magnets, different amounts of wire, different magnet height...
I just ordered 10 sets of Tele neck & bridge flatwork!
- it's very important to have the bobbin centered and flat, otherwise the wind will be uneven or you will run the wire off the bobbin
- be sure to mount the bobbin securely on the winder! You could make a holder where you can fix the bobbin with a screw through the middle hole that they usually have. I'm working on it.
- when using fiber flatwork and rod magnets, be sure they're tight, definitely use super glue. If they're loose, you will get warped bobbins because the tension of the coil will expand the bobbin at the ends. Has happened to me.
- the tensioner makes the job 100 times easier, don't even try without it..
- wind many different pickups and try them - it's not black magic. Different magnets, different amounts of wire, different magnet height...
I just ordered 10 sets of Tele neck & bridge flatwork!
I think we are about to see the birth of a new winder here.
Yes, with a repurposed automotive Hall effect sensor**--Ford Escort, if I;m not mustaken. Let the coils fly!
**or is that a blower assembly? Or something else
Nice to hear that this thread inspires.. There's no need for a hi-tech winder to make a couple of pickups. Some things I've learned:
- it's very important to have the bobbin centered and flat, otherwise the wind will be uneven or you will run the wire off the bobbin
- be sure to mount the bobbin securely on the winder! You could make a holder where you can fix the bobbin with a screw through the middle hole that they usually have. I'm working on it.
- when using fiber flatwork and rod magnets, be sure they're tight, definitely use super glue. If they're loose, you will get warped bobbins because the tension of the coil will expand the bobbin at the ends. Has happened to me.
- the tensioner makes the job 100 times easier, don't even try without it..
- wind many different pickups and try them - it's not black magic. Different magnets, different amounts of wire, different magnet height...
I just ordered 10 sets of Tele neck & bridge flatwork!
Sounds like you've been badly bitten by the bug, TK--have fun!
as I mentioned on another winder's thread...
I know a guy who has made/rewound pickups on a record player turntable with good results.... no that's low tech winding on hi fi equipment..
it must have taken ages...
I know a guy who has made/rewound pickups on a record player turntable with good results.... no that's low tech winding on hi fi equipment..
it must have taken ages...
The String King
Tele-Afflicted
R. Stratenstein said:Yes, with a repurposed automotive Hall effect sensor**--Ford Escort, if I;m not mustaken. Let the coils fly!
**or is that a blower assembly? Or something else
Heater blower motor!
Stripped off the casing and turbines on Tuesday, ordered a few bits and drawn the design up... Hopefully going to get this done sub £50.Here's a very rough sketch, not worked out the wiring diagram on paper yet.
Don't want to hijack this thread! Maybe I'll start my own when I get some more done, still a bit shy of 'build threads'!
