Telepathy: Anyone believe in it? Anyone actually use it?

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by ukepicker, Mar 8, 2019.

  1. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Well yeah I think that's just the nature of what we've been trying to explain or describe since fire or the wheel was nailed down.

    If we look at smell or taste, I'd say we have similar problems describing that, and it would be virtually impossible to describe a smell to someone without comparing it to other smells.
    Taste is a little easier because we have salty, sweet. sour, bitter etc, but again, if one doesn't know bitter one gets nothing from the comparison word.

    Comparisons are not descriptive, and there are lots of things we can only transmit to others verbally by comparing them to stuff known to both parties.

    Can anyone really describe the experience of a bitter taste without comparing it to things we have experienced and know to be called bitter?

    So while most of us have had this or that experience we couldn't attribute to a known and defined physical cause, none of us seem able to describe those experiences in terms that are universally understood.

    Sometimes though, two people who have had very similar experiences can discuss and note the parallels, even while not being able to paint a clear picture.

    The problem with this is that we have a long history of (presumably) nutters who agree they were abducted by aliens, or died and met God who had a long white beard and robe.

    IMO we will never all agree on the existence and nature of this area of the unexplainable.
     
    Dean James likes this.
  2. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    So here we have a story that cannot AFAIK be explained by any accepted science without resorting to speculations that the witness is lying to us.

    IMO that would be the failing of science.

    Just as it's not up to the patient to prove to the Doctor that they are experiencing something that is not normal, IMO it is not the responsibility of someone like Sparky2 to run experiments in order to prove a past experience that he cannot repeat.

    So scientists have two choices:
    State that there are things they cannot explain.
    State that because they cannot explain Sparky's experience it must be a hoax.

    There IMO science fails by concluding that scientists know all and could not have missed anything.
    If scientists know all there is to be known, why bother to keep funding them?

    Maybe it's not scientists as much as laypersons who insist that anything scientists have not yet figured out cannot possible exist.
     
    jman72 and t guitar floyd like this.
  3. Old Deaf Roadie

    Old Deaf Roadie Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    850
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2017
    Location:
    Oregon
    Exactly.
     
  4. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    49,807
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Location:
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    Samuel Beckett said we needed to "eff the ineffable".
     
    Blue Bill and telemnemonics like this.
  5. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    AFAIK Godot never arrived...
     
  6. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    49,807
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Location:
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    Smart playwright. Save it for the sequel.
     
  7. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Waiting for Godought to be worth at least a million episode series!


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  8. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    8,373
    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2014
    Location:
    UK
    You missed their third option... the one they would immediately apply.
     
    Tallthinman and JustABluesGuy like this.
  9. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    49,807
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Location:
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    Godot turned up on Lost.
     
  10. JustABluesGuy

    JustABluesGuy Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    2,944
    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2016
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    I’m sorry you don’t seem to get how this works. If a claimant wants others to beleive their claims, they need to provide evidence. You keep throwing out logical fallacies, bad analogies, and constant attempts to shift the burden of proof quite nonchalantly.

    I have nothing to prove since I am making NO claims. I am simply unconvinced of others various supernatural claims because no one has yet provided any compelling, repeatable evidence. It’s basic, remedial logic. It’s really not that complicated.

    Along with that list of cognitive biases @Guitarteach posted you might want to study up on logical fallacies as well.
     
    Tallthinman and notmyusualuserid like this.
  11. william tele

    william tele Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    19,065
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2009
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    My wife and I have the exact same ideas all the time. She'd call from work to tell me to thaw out burger for goulash and I'd tell her I already did...had the same idea.

    This ain't telepathy. It's obedience training.:)

    I have an open mind for things that have any basis for consideration. This includes zero verbal accounts of any supernatural...period. Gotta have some sort of starting point and books filled with words ain't gonna do it for me.

    To me an open mind doesn't mean just blindly accepting something you're told as truth.
     
  12. Dean James

    Dean James Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    383
    Joined:
    May 13, 2016
    Location:
    Podunk, New England
    I live in CT, & for a time pen–palled with a woman in CA. We were both members of a maillist & enjoyed each others point of view. We would get pretty off–topic, so took our conversations to private email. She felt she was a bit psychic.

    One morning I slipped on a nylon sleeping bag that had slid off the bed onto the floor. I crashed down at full speed, hitting the edge of the top of a hardwood dresser across my right eye. Kind of like hitting the dresser with a baseball bat, except the bat was me. Blood? Plenty. Hurt? You bet. Called an ambulance & off I went.

    I got a trapdoor fracture to the floor of my eye socket. They slipped in a thin plate of surgical plastic, to support the eyeball & its many small muscles. Everything turned out ok. I had a spectacular bruise in many shades of purple occupying the full half of my face for months afterward.

    Before I mentioned the accident & without prompting, my correspondent in CA said she had "seen" an ambulance backing into my driveway & asked what had happened.

    On another, more pleasant, occasion I mentioned plans to go for a hike at a state park. She said "You're going to see an egret." Not a common bird around here; I'd never seen one in many years of hiking. Sure enough, as I rounded a corner into view of the lake, there was a big old bright white egret flapping its wings as it took off.

    It seems to me telepathy & all that sort of thing are extreme examples of the faculty we call intuition. Intuition is simply a natural ability of the mind to notice & interpret facts that the conscious mind isn't directly aware of. We all have it, some just have more than others. Some people can't carry a tune, others have perfect pitch. Telepathy is like that, but more rare.

    How that explains knowing about a future egret sighting from three thousand miles away I'll leave to you.
     
  13. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    It's not that I don't understand how "this" works.
    Your mistake in identifying my mistake here is that I am not a claimant.
    I am not trying to convince you or anyone else of anything, and I have called no case to prove.
    Maybe @ukepicker called a case in asking for info.

    All I am here is a witness, answering questions.

    Those who insist we are nothing more than meat puppets with sparks in the bucket might "need to provide evidence", but of course the only evidence they provide is the claim that there is no confirmed evidence contrary to their opinion, an opinion for which they have no evidence of their own.

    I often wholeheartedly attack con artists obvious claims, when there is evidence that proves their con.

    Those who insist that they can read minds, predict the future, get you into heaven etc etc; would be claimants, and they ought to provide evidence.

    I really don't care what anyone believes, and am not even certain of what I believe.
    But a few of us here have had experiences that opened our minds to the unknown.
    We do not wish to convince you that these are proof of anything, we are making no claims, and we have no burden of proof.
    In a way it's too bad that witnesses sharing what they have experienced are treated as if they are offensive for what they report.
    Why anyone would expect Sparky to repeat waking up terrified at the same time as his daughter found her home open and ran for the police; is kind of odd.
    It was just his experience.

    In the west we have two institutions where proof is managed; science and the courts.
    Often all we have to work with in the courts is eyewitness testimony.
    Maybe it's time to do away with that system?
     
  14. JustABluesGuy

    JustABluesGuy Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    2,944
    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2016
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Sorry, I didn’t mean to offend you, buy not accepting supernatural claims you haven’t actually made. I was referring any and all such claims in general, not specific or only yours.

    Take care!
     
  15. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    I'm not sure what that third option is in your opinion?
    If it's on that cognitive bias chart, I'm not sure which one to choose.
    I'd be happy to consider it if I missed it.

    If it's for Sparky (or the scientists) to repeatedly hire somebody to leave his daughters home open (or burglarize it to ensure she freaks out, for the sake of consistency, since we are not testing her likelihood to freak out when she leaves the door unlocked), immediately call Sparky or the scientists so he will wake up, feign terror or force himself to be terrified, or maybe the scientists who woke him up during the experiment are to ask him if the experimental event has terrified him.
    Clearly that's not a repeatable scenario.

    Maybe scientists could simply attack the daughter, while at the same time Sparky is wired up with EKG or other test equipment to measure his reaction?
    That would clearly not be an equivalent, but is this what anybody is looking for?

    Really, nobody here said they could do what others here demand they prove they can do.
    We related things that happened.

    I'm not demanding you or anyone believe Sparky is telling the truth.
    But why such urgency to insist he couldn't have had that experience?
    Or me and what I related?

    We just answered with our own experiences.

    Do what you wish with our testimony.
     
  16. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    OK thanks, got it!
    Easy to say stuff here that sounds personal when it's more general.
     
  17. Tallthinman

    Tallthinman TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    98
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2014
    Location:
    Niagara Region, Canada

    Nope, I am pretty sure you still do not understand how 'this' works. Those who you describe as claiming we are nothing but "meat puppets with sparks in a bucket" do NOT need to provide evidence that we are not something more than that. There is ample scientific evidence of both the "meatness" and the "sparkness" of how our brains function. It is when someone claims that there is something more than this that a burden of proof becomes necessary, and so far that hasn't happened.
    In the same way, if Alice claims that our spirit/soul is made up the interaction between our neurons and the sub-sonic calls of whales it is her job to provide evidence for this, not the job of the scientific community to provide evidence she is wrong. And if Alice can provide this evidence, and it stands up to scientific scrutiny, the scientific community will accept it.
     
  18. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,866
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Is Alice here?

    Some of us related some experiences we had.
    How that saddles us with a burden of proof is a curio.

    I'm not demanding those who have had no such experiences prove that I didn't have any, or demanding others take my stories as fact.

    Again, we know that science hasn't seen anything that science hasn't seen, and the question seems to be: is there any stuff that science can't see?

    We got no answers but it's OK to relate our experiences!

    If I was claiming to know what was behind my experiences, and trying to convince others of what I had concluded, then there would be an acceptance of burden.

    And yes! Yes! There are lots of nutters and scammers trying to sell snake oil!

    It's true!
    It's really true!

    But none of them are here, we're just chatting about stuff.
    Lighten up guys!

    Unless somebody claims their tonewood makes them sound better...
     
  19. bblumentritt

    bblumentritt Tele-Afflicted Platinum Supporter

    Posts:
    1,784
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2012
    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    All who believe in Telepathy, tell me what I just ate for dinner. Or convey to me what you're thinking.
     
  20. Tallthinman

    Tallthinman TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    98
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2014
    Location:
    Niagara Region, Canada

    This is a direct quote from you...."Those who insist we are nothing more than meat puppets with sparks in the bucket might "need to provide evidence", but of course the only evidence they provide is the claim that there is no confirmed evidence contrary to their opinion, an opinion for which they have no evidence of their own."
    That statement is fundamentally wrong, and that is not how science works. If there is no evidence for a thing's existence then belief in that thing is unjustified, you do not need to find evidence showing there is no evidence for that thing.
    Now this all might be a misunderstanding about actual scientific position vs who you are referring to as 'those'. Man, pronouns can be tricky. :)
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.