Song Lyrics as Evidence in a Criminal Case

[Trenchant63]

I am pretty much a free speech and free expression absolutest (aside for the legal exceptions - imminent threat, etc, that I think are sensible).

I think you’re a free speech rationalist vs. absolutist because you have some common sense exceptions (e.g. legal non-disclosure, threats to a person’s life, etc.)

 

[JIMMY JAZZMAN]

Really Elvis?!!! 1955 Baby Let’s Play House …

Trenchant63, I haven't heard that song in years, but was Elvis into young women at that time?

 

[Fiesta Red]

I was a teenager in the 80’s, but I loved music from the 40’s to the 60’s…a lot of blues, rock, jazz and country music that was from my parents’ (and grandparent’s) generation.

My dad did not like the British Invasion bands—especially The Rolling Stones.
I asked him why, and he cited their drug use as well as the drug references and violence in their lyrics. He also didn’t like their “vulgar lyrics.”

I pulled out his record collection.

Drugs/Alcohol:
George Jones
Hank Williams
Hank Williams Jr
Waylon
Willie
(And the boys)
Charlie Rich
Johnny Cash
Glen Campbell
Gary Stewart
Kris Kristofferson
Billy Joe Shaver
Roger Miller

Violent Lyrics:
Johnny Cash
Billy Joe Shaver
Waylon
Willie
Bobby Darin

Prison/Jail:
Chuck Berry
Johnny Cash
Willie Nelson

Vulgar Lyrics:
Johnny Cash (bleeped, but it was there)
Waylon’s “Get Naked With Me”
Chuck Berry’s two silver bells tied with a string

And the coup de grace:
He had a Spade Cooley album…you know, the guy who murdered his wife?

I said, “So it’s ok if they’re a drunk or a drug addict, and they cuss and sing about drinking or drugs or violence, or even actually commit a murder, as long as you like the music?”

He eventually acquiesced.

Unless the lyrics line up directly with the evidence of the case, I don’t see how this is allowable in court.

 

[pixeljammer]

Unless it isn’t. There was a case here in town several years ago that got world wide media attention. Local creepy bass player was found to have at least seven bodies in his house, parts of others, and a head in a bucket.

I though Buckethead played the guitar?

 

[redhouse_ca]

Yep, I get where you’re coming from. But—and again, I know zero about this particular case—let’s say someone is murdered, and let’s say he’s stabbed with a silver letter opener and the killer then draws a heart on the wall. Further we’ll say the police keep those details from the public. Then a month later some “artist” puts out a record in which he describes stabbing someone with a silver letter opener and then drawing a heart on the wall. That’s no longer art. It’s evidence. As speech, it’s protected, but that doesn’t mean it loses all evidentiary value.

I guess, right or wrong, I make a distinction between "leads" in an investigation and evidence in court. I know you are not saying your example is purely a lead, but it could be seen as such. LE should follow whatever hunches they have to find the criminal, and that's totally fair game. I don't think that should be enough alone to get a warrant, they should have more than that, but I guess it's relevant as evidence in a trial. It feels like a slippery slope, tho, cuz so much of the legal system is based on precedent. Back to my Velvets example, let's say someone in New York at the time was murdering people and LE found hairs of mink fur at all the sites. The velvets have a song, Venus in Furs, and I can imagine a lot of people would consider that persona unsavory. Should the police mate see if there is a lead or angle in the case in that? Yeah. Should they get a warrant to search Warhols factory (a big scene at the time), no way. Not just based on that.

 

[redhouse_ca]

I was a teenager in the 80’s, but I loved music from the 40’s to the 60’s…a lot of blues, rock, jazz and country music that was from my parents’ (and grandparent’s) generation.

My dad did not like the British Invasion bands—especially The Rolling Stones.
I asked him why, and he cited their drug use as well as the drug references and violence in their lyrics. He also didn’t like their “vulgar lyrics.”

I pulled out his record collection.

Drugs/Alcohol:
George Jones
Hank Williams
Hank Williams Jr
Waylon
Willie
(And the boys)
Charlie Rich
Johnny Cash
Glen Campbell
Gary Stewart
Kris Kristofferson
Billy Joe Shaver
Roger Miller

Violent Lyrics:
Johnny Cash
Billy Joe Shaver
Waylon
Willie
Bobby Darin

Prison/Jail:
Chuck Berry
Johnny Cash
Willie Nelson

Vulgar Lyrics:
Johnny Cash (bleeped, but it was there)
Waylon’s “Get Naked With Me”
Chuck Berry’s two silver bells tied with a string

And the coup de grace:
He had a Spade Cooley album…you know, the guy who murdered his wife?

I said, “So it’s ok if they’re a drunk or a drug addict, and they cuss and sing about drinking or drugs or violence, or even actually commit a murder, as long as you like the music?”

He eventually acquiesced.

Unless the lyrics line up directly with the evidence of the case, I don’t see how this is allowable in court.

Great story. Can't really complain about being raised with all that music, tho. Sounds like you got a pretty rounded musical education growing up!

 

[THX1123]

Perhaps to establish mens rea?

Every post, text, comment, tik tok, video, profile page is evidence...why wouldn't a song be?

 

[Red Ryder]

I love you baby with barbecue sauce and beans, I'm the cannibal man and you're the meal for me.

A line from my hit song "You're the Meal For Me."