Song Lyrics as Evidence in a Criminal Case

[redhouse_ca]

I read that a rapper is being charged with some crimes, I know nothing about the case and I don't really know his music (I love rap and hip hop, tho), and I don't care to know details.

BUT...

I got really worked up when I read that the prosecuting DA is using some of his song lyrics as evidence in the case. I am pretty much a free speech and free expression absolutest (aside for the legal exceptions - imminent threat, etc, that I think are sensible). So it seems crazy to me, under any circumstances, that an artists work can be used as evidence like this. If so, it's possible to imagine all sorts of bad things happening - could law enforcement get a warrant to search someone because of something they sang, etc.

Its possible I'm missing something here, but assuming the songs contain no imminent threat (which appears to be the case) am I wrong in some way about how I feel about this?

If you reply, please try and avoid any judgments about the case or the rapper. I'm just genuinely curious to learn how you all feel.



NOTE TO MODERATOR: I hope this is ok to post, I don't think its political, but I can delete of have deleted if it breaks a rule...

 

[GGardner]

For something a little off-topic but kind of a similar theme, Google: “Justin Barber Guns n Roses.”

 

[Killing Floor]

Didn’t this happen years ago? Or is this a new case?

 

[Flip G]

Twisted Sister has entered the chat.

 

[Peegoo]

Some hilarious shenanigans here:

When Felonies Become Form: The Secret History of Artists Who Use Lawbreaking as Their Medium

Artists have long gotten away with murder, sometimes literally. After Benvenuto Cellini killed his rival, the goldsmith Pompeo de Capitaneis, in 1534, Pope Paul III—a Cellini fan—reportedly pardone…

www.artnews.com

 

[redhouse_ca]

Didn’t this happen years ago? Or is this a new case?

New case.

 

[ISmellSmoke]

I shot a man in Reno just to watch him die...

 

[Sparky472]

I read that a rapper is being charged with some crimes, I know nothing about the case and I don't really know his music (I love rap and hip hop, tho), and I don't care to know details.

BUT...

I got really worked up when I read that the prosecuting DA is using some of his song lyrics as evidence in the case. I am pretty much a free speech and free expression absolutest (aside for the legal exceptions - imminent threat, etc, that I think are sensible). So it seems crazy to me, under any circumstances, that an artists work can be used as evidence like this. If so, it's possible to imagine all sorts of bad things happening - could law enforcement get a warrant to search someone because of something they sang, etc.

Its possible I'm missing something here, but assuming the songs contain no imminent threat (which appears to be the case) am I wrong in some way about how I feel about this?

If you reply, please try and avoid any judgments about the case or the rapper. I'm just genuinely curious to learn how you all feel.



NOTE TO MODERATOR: I hope this is ok to post, I don't think its political, but I can delete of have deleted if it breaks a rule...

I get where you’re coming from and generally agree. But if you don’t know anything about the case, then, well, you don’t know. If there were something in the lyrics that indicates knowledge of something only the murderer would know, wouldn’t that matter? I’m not saying that’s the case, just asking hypothetically. I know nothing about the case either.

 

[arlum]

This will probably be very unpopular but ....... I have little respect for any artist that records something they don't believe in or agree with. So ..... yes. I could see someone using the work of an artist as an example of their beliefs or their take on "right and wrong". Because of the average age of buyers of new music I have to place a responsibility for song content on the artist. New music influences those who will one day assume positions of power in this world. To knowingly create content that could subvert the tenets of right and wrong in the minds that own the future is a disservice to all mankind.

 

[Red Ryder]

Maxwell Edison majoring in medicine called her on the phone.

 

[Red Ryder]

I shot a man in Reno just to watch him die...

I shot the sheriff

 

[Harry Styron]

I shot a man in Reno just to watch him die...

Then why were you put in a prison in California?

 

[Manual Slim]

Didn’t this happen years ago? Or is this a new case?

There have been cases like this for years now.

 

[ISmellSmoke]

Then why were you put in a prison in California?

I don't know, man... I been everywhere, man ... Troubles I've had my share, man...

 

[Chester P Squier]

Then why were you put in a prison in California?

Cash's answer: "that's called poetic license."
According to Wikipedia

 

[colchar]

I read that a rapper is being charged with some crimes, I know nothing about the case and I don't really know his music (I love rap and hip hop, tho), and I don't care to know details.

BUT...

I got really worked up when I read that the prosecuting DA is using some of his song lyrics as evidence in the case. I am pretty much a free speech and free expression absolutest (aside for the legal exceptions - imminent threat, etc, that I think are sensible). So it seems crazy to me, under any circumstances, that an artists work can be used as evidence like this. If so, it's possible to imagine all sorts of bad things happening - could law enforcement get a warrant to search someone because of something they sang, etc.

Its possible I'm missing something here, but assuming the songs contain no imminent threat (which appears to be the case) am I wrong in some way about how I feel about this?

If you reply, please try and avoid any judgments about the case or the rapper. I'm just genuinely curious to learn how you all feel.



NOTE TO MODERATOR: I hope this is ok to post, I don't think its political, but I can delete of have deleted if it breaks a rule...

If the idiot sang about the crime, as some seem to do in that genre, then the lyrics are relevant. Why wouldn't they use them?

 

[Rick330man]

If someone admits to someone that they committed a crime that statement is admissible against him. If the lyrics to a song tell the story of how the songwriter committed a crime then they'd be admissible against that songwriter.

"I fought the law and the law won"...original.

"I fought the law and I won"...the Dead Kennedys.

 

[Jakedog]

I think if the lyrics can reasonably held to the standard of a confession, and the evidence of the case supports it, then fair game. They certainly shouldn’t be ruled out solely on the basis that they’re a song.

Case in point made earlier in this thread- “ I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die.”

Great lyric? Absolutely.

However, if there were evidence to prove that a man was shot dead in Reno, and Johnny was there the night it happened, and he didn’t have a solid alibi, and it was known he had a beef with the dude, I would fully expect that to be fully investigated. And if proved worth pursuing, would be prosecuted.

Art is not immunity, and shouldn’t be.

 

[PoorNoodle]

As a DA, why would you rely on lyrics as evidence? Don’t you having anything more conclusive? If lyrics are a reliable admission of guilt then why don’t the police request people to compose a song during interrogations to describe their deeds?

 

[smartsoul72]

As a DA, why would you rely on lyrics as evidence? Don’t you having anything more conclusive? If lyrics are a reliable admission of guilt then why don’t the police request people to compose a song during interrogations to describe their deeds?

So if I committed a murder and then I painted a picture of the crime which contained information that only someone who was there would know, that painting would be irrelevant in court? Or it would only be relevant if police required every crime suspect to paint a picture?
Maybe I’m missing something from the point you’re making