Small Amp Options with LineOut for PA?

[dreamingtele]

Hi guys, can you recommend an amp (preferably tube, maybe around 15w) that has nice cleans, sounds great with pedals, small enough to carry, great for home use as well.

I play in church and there are no other options than using a line out for the PA. Mic'ing cant be done.

The one i play through is a Roland Cube 60. It is nice for what it is. Takes my pedals well, but I feel that its lacking in character. And i want to have decent amp for myself that i can take to church and use at home.

Ive also read through some threads here that the tube tone doesnt really go through the line out. Is ss better for that?

Another thing to note is that the sound guy is very guitar friendly and sometimes lets me stand out more than i want and making me adjust my playing style to blend well with the band. so i dont want to ruin that with a complicated setup.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Tronc the cube]

I think the small hughs and kettner(?) have a built in red box speaker emulator. IMO it's a better option then a line out. I use the stand alone box for gigging with all my amps and find it a no nonsense bit of kit.

 

[drmcclainphd]

Headphone output can be used as line level output. But be aware headphone volume is controlled by the volume control and line level is not. Due to this and impedance mismatch, headphone out to PA in can be prone to distortion. Keep your amp volume low and just use the PA for gain, and you'll be fine.

 

[SamClemons]

Just a note, running a line out means running one cable to a PA setup, running a microphone on and amp means running one cable to a PA setup. Is the PA guys objection purchasing a microphone or what?

 

[Abu Twangy]

Are you trying to get all your sound through the PA or are you using your amp as your guitar monitor? Sounds like your sound man is trying to keep everybody's volume balanced and controlled. He would like me to aim a low wattage guitar amp at me as a stage guitar monitor and control the volume from the board. Playing direct through an amp without using a PA for dispersion is a no-go unless I tilt the amp up toward me. Amp speakers can be annoyingly beamy some distance away from your amp.

I have to either mic or DI my amps when I play a concert with my band. When I mic I am prone to get bleed-through form the bass, drums and piano due to their proximetry. I wish I wasn't set up as close but 19 instruments takes up a lot of turf even on a big stage. DI'ing loses the speaker's contribution to your tone. And if your volume gets controlled off stage then it can be a hassle to get a good solo feel. I sometimes have found myself pounding out a solo--dynamics totally gone--because I can't hear the natural amp dynamics.

So I have used a variety of different amps over the years--a DI'ed or mic'ed Champ 600, tweed Bronco, Pro Jr, Blues Jr, Peavey Vypyrs and Vypyr VIPs, Hot Rod Deluxe DRRI and others. For my needs the only marginal amp was the Champ 600. It sounded great offstage but did not give me enough stage volume.

If you don't have to worry about other instruments leaking into your mic then micing is best. When I play a theater that has an acoustically lively stage and I hear complaints from the other side of the stage I DI.

 

[Tony474]

In my experience you're as well off with the Cube 60 as with anything else. However, the Tech 21 Trademark 60 is not only an excellent (and loud when needed) stand-alone amp but it is actually designed to be lined out into the PA, using an ordinary XLR mic cable. The smaller and lighter Trademark 30 does the same thing and has a very good reputation for sound but I have no personal experience of that one. Obviously from your point of view they need to be available in the Philippines.

I don't personally know of any valve (tube) amps with a voiced line out, but that doesn't mean there aren't any. But all the same, especially with pedals in front, I say you don't need tubes anyway to get a really good sound.

 

[Dr. Bill]

Tech21 Trademarks are made for precisely this sort of application.

 

[410DeVille]

(link removed)

 

[SPUDCASTER]

http://peavey.com/products/item.cfm/805/118341/

Available in a combo or head. 20W Micro Valve King.

 

[MojoMonster]

My Egnater Rebel 30 has a LowZ line out and from what I can ascertain, so does the Renegade 65 (IT has decided to block the Egnateramps site for me at work, so I can't check directly.

 

[haggardfan1]

Just a note, running a line out means running one cable to a PA setup, running a microphone on and amp means running one cable to a PA setup. Is the PA guys objection purchasing a microphone or what?

If the sound man wants complete control of your volume regardless of your amp settings, you just need a DI box. Run your guitar into the 1/4" input, 1/4"output to your amp, and the XLR goes to the board--you can crank your amp to kingdom come and it shouldn't affect the house mix. Cheaper than a new amp, too. Trouble is, you are sending a dry, sterile signal from your guitar to the house PA. I am using an identical setup at my church right now.

Theoretically, so far, sounds like you are better off with the setup you have. The Cube is a great amp, I know lots of guys that love them.

Why is it that miking your amp is not an option?

 

[1300 E Valencia]

Many D.I. boxes allow you to take a signal from the speaker out on the amp, then run a "through" cable to the speaker for stage monitoring, and a balanced cable to the P.A.

 

[Chicago Slim]

The Kustom V15 has an XLR Line Out, and sounds pretty good on it's own. However, it does not have effects. The SCXD has effects and uses a 1/4" Line Out. My buddy just did an outdoor show, where he was told that there would be a backline. There was only a PA. He had brought his two SCXD's as backup, used the Line Out, and it worked fine for both guitarists.

 

[rokdog49]

Vox Pathfinder 15 R. Not a tube amp but sure as heck sounds like one!

 

[dreamingtele]

Hi guys! To answer all querries,

1. Mic'ing is not an option since all the Mic's are already in use. And we have DI boxes for each instrument.

So from the Amp (Cube60), line out to the DI box, going through the house PA.

2. The reason why Id like tube is because I'll be using this as a personal amp as well, and would like to have a decent one to use.

If only the Pro-Junior has a line out. i wouldnt hesitate. I tried it side by side with the Blues Jr, and the Pro-Junior for me is the clear winner. It brought out the tone of my Baja and my Thinline partscaster. And using the Cube60 (Church Amp) its kind of dull sounding.

3. My setup is this:

My church amp at my back, then we have a separate monitor (Behringer Speakers), in my front (or side, depending if there's feedback), through the DI, to the house.

If you guys say that this setup is already okay, then i'll just buy the pro-junior and use it at home. But of course, Id wish I can use it for church.

*I'll take pictures of the amp setup when I visit the church.

 

[dreamingtele]

Vox Pathfinder 15 R. Not a tube amp but sure as heck sounds like one!

I wish I can still find one here in the Philippines. I havent seen one as new or used for sale in a year. I guess people have kept theirs as it is very nice sounding.

 

[davidchagrin]

Hi guys! To answer all querries,

1. Mic'ing is not an option since all the Mic's are already in use. And we have DI boxes for each instrument.

So from the Amp (Cube60), line out to the DI box, going through the house PA.

2. The reason why Id like tube is because I'll be using this as a personal amp as well, and would like to have a decent one to use.

If only the Pro-Junior has a line out. i wouldnt hesitate. I tried it side by side with the Blues Jr, and the Pro-Junior for me is the clear winner. It brought out the tone of my Baja and my Thinline partscaster. And using the Cube60 (Church Amp) its kind of dull sounding.

3. My setup is this:

My church amp at my back, then we have a separate monitor (Behringer Speakers), in my front (or side, depending if there's feedback), through the DI, to the house.

If you guys say that this setup is already okay, then i'll just buy the pro-junior and use it at home. But of course, Id wish I can use it for church.

*I'll take pictures of the amp setup when I visit the church.

Maybe you could buy the pro jr and a microphone to use for church?

 

[Wally]

dreamingtele, you didn't put any restriction on the answer....so....the best amp I can think of for your needs would be one of the Rivera/Jahns era amps...the Super Champ, the Princeton REverb II or the Deluxe REverb II. The SC is tiny for its sound...amazing amps, imho.
These amps were built from '82-85....all-tube, handwired...great BF Fender reverb cleans, great tweed sounds with the mid-boost, and great high gain sounds with the Lead function. Get a good speaker....and the amp goes to work.
They are not as cheap as other amps...but they aren't going down in value, ime. I got my two Super Champs 20 years ago for about 20% of what they are worth today. 18 watts, 24 pounds.....not much bigger than a tweed Champ, in fact...dimensions, that is. Soundwise??? Much bigger, ime.

 

[guitarmikey]

Super Champ X2, sounds great, almost "all tube" amp, at least clean channel seems like an all tube amp. Combo or head version, if you have a spare speaker cab

 

[Wally]

Super Champ X2, sounds great, almost "all tube" amp, at least clean channel seems like an all tube amp. Combo or head version, if you have a spare speaker cab

Just an observation....but that Super Champ X-anything is so far from being an all-tube amp that I am chuckling at the thought......whether you follow the schematic or your ears...it is not a tube amp. Sit it beside a real Super Champ and the difference is immediately noticable.