sm57 not loud enough - cloudlifter?

[Kmaxbrady]

I recently started playing lead guitar in a cover band. Been playing for years but new to playing in a band.
Other than the drums everything is going direct, and we’re using in-ears.
I’m the only one with an amp that doesn’t have a line out (65 deluxe reverb)
I tried the line out from my tone king attenuator but it sounded pretty bad.

I’d like to mic my amp with an sm57 but it seems I have to crank the amp way too loud to get enough signal into the mic, which ruins the silent stage we’re going for.

Is a cloudlifter the right answer?
Or maybe a similar more affordable alternative?

 

[Kmaxbrady]

For more context, we use a Behringer XAir XR18

 

[Peegoo]

@Kmaxbrady

Try this: poke the mic into the back of the amp and set the mic's face in the speaker basket's cutout about 1/2" from the back of the speaker's paper cone.

Contrary to popular belief, you can mic a single speaker from the back of the cone with no phase issues.

If that does not work and you're a DIY kinda guy, make up one of these. This works surprisingly well and is ideal for "quiet" stages when amps are not dimed.

 

[Timbresmith1]

I recently started playing lead guitar in a cover band. Been playing for years but new to playing in a band.
Other than the drums everything is going direct, and we’re using in-ears.
I’m the only one with an amp that doesn’t have a line out (65 deluxe reverb)
I tried the line out from my tone king attenuator but it sounded pretty bad.

I’d like to mic my amp with an sm57 but it seems I have to crank the amp way too loud to get enough signal into the mic, which ruins the silent stage we’re going for.

Is a cloudlifter the right answer?
Or maybe a similar more affordable alternative?

A mic with higher sensitivity

 

[24 track]

what about a 50.00 mic tube preamp to boost the gain with out killing the stage volume

 

[sax4blues]

I run sound with XR18 and mic’d amps
Just to check, are you saying the input gain on the channel is set to maximum?

 

[Jon Snell]

Reposition your SM57. Point the mic 2/3rds between the cone edge and centre of your speaker and as close as you can get (within 2" of the cloth). Set your preamp gain 3Db below clipping.
The DIY line out is prone to earth loop hum and issues with phasing.
Increase the gain of your SM57 pre amp, to acheive the level you require.

 

[Fluddman]

At normal volume an SM57 should be fine - as others have mentioned sounds like you might not have the gain high enough on your XR18.

Are you deliberately playing really soft? Are you balanced with the drums?

If you are going for a silent stage you probably need a 'silent amp' solution. Not sure you can get a silent stage with real drums

 

[VintageSG]

An inline DI twixt speaker out and speaker may peel many carrots for you.
At the cheap end of the scale is the Behringer Ultra-G DI. It may be cheap, but don't let that fool you. The sound through front of house with its cab emulation switched on is really very good indeed. Been there, done that. One of my better purchases.
You can also run it at the end of your pedal chain if you have a character pedal ( Joyo AS for example ) and go ampless. Been there, done that ( rehearsal with a PA )
The H&K RedBox DI costs more, but it seems worth it. Many decent cab emulations whereas the Behringer has but one; albeit a rather good one.

Neither of the above act as load boxes. You'll need a load too or things will go phut!

Circling back to ampless, the basic pre that @24 track mentions imbues magic when used with the Behringer and ( say ) a Joyo character pedal. Your monitor sound may not be as sweet as you'd want, but front of house?, glorious. A valve boost/clipper pre with an active DI is sprinkles on your sonic ganache. Same goes if you use a Boss ME-80. DI it for sheen.

...Or just whack the gain up on your mic channel. I'm not familiar with your mixer. Mine's an older Behringer. Two of the best features on it are the excellent gain and 'one knob' compressor controls. Before I went DI I found that increasing the mic gain to the point of clipping on peaks, then backing back a hair and bringing a little compression in got 'the sound' with my SM57, then balance with channel level.

 

[runstendt]

I would probably buy a decent amp modeling pedal if you plan on staying with this band. Still, for the immediate future I would check the gain on the channel for the microphone. Unless the mic or cable is bad I can't think of another reason why you wouldn't get enough volume through the PA.

 

[Charlie Bernstein]

what about a 50.00 mic tube preamp to boost the gain with out killing the stage volume

View attachment 1400901

I use one to mic my guitar and vocals. Tons of uncolored boost. It sounds best dialed to noon and noon, like the picture. Sure is easy!

Lots of reviews suggest putting in a swankier tube, so mine now sports a Mallory 12AX7.

 

[Charlie Bernstein]

I would probably buy a decent amp modeling pedal if you plan on staying with this band. Still, for the immediate future I would check the gain on the channel for the microphone. Unless the mic or cable is bad I can't think of another reason why you wouldn't get enough volume through the PA.

Good idea.

 

[24 track]

I use one to mic my guitar and vocals. Tons of uncolored boost. It sounds best dialed to noon and noon, like the picture. Sure is easy!

Lots of reviews suggest putting in a swankier tube, so mine now sports a Mallory 12AX7.

My 2 pres. have red lions 12AX7
I had the same issue with my Electro Voice PL20's and RE 20s, I was thinking of the cloud lifters but these fit my bill , they are much cheaper and work great, so it all depends on what you need and what works for you.

 

[uriah1]

ya. that hanging sennheiser.

 

[P-Nutz]

ya. that hanging sennheiser.

These is what I use … a Sennheiser e609 and a Cabgrabber …

 

[Alamo]

Are you really that quiet or is there something wrong with your SM57? tried a different mic/cable?
the X-air18 has tons of gain on tap. is the sound guy doing his job properly?

 

[VintageSG]

My 2 pres. have red lions 12AX7

My two pres. have long plate ECC82/12AU7 in their driving seats.
There's still more gain than I can use and I find the controls to be less finicky with them.

Part of it -may- be that I scored a dozen NOS British and European examples in a close-out sale for ~£2 each, therefore...

I have found the sound in starved, or at least rather peckish, plate circuits to be more to my liking with a 12AU7.

 

[Charlie Bernstein]

My 2 pres. have red lions 12AX7
I had the same issue with my Electro Voice PL20's and RE 20s, I was thinking of the cloud lifters but these fit my bill , they are much cheaper and work great, so it all depends on what you need and what works for you.

Tasty. Nothing wrong with Red Lions. Or RE 20s!

 

[Papanate]

I use one to mic my guitar and vocals. Tons of uncolored boost. It sounds best dialed to noon and noon, like the picture. Sure is easy!

Lots of reviews suggest putting in a swankier tube, so mine now sports a Mallory 12AX7.

The Art Tube Pre uses a Starved Plated Design - the type of tube has negligible effect - and absolutely zero effect on the tone of the Pre.

 

[telekaster1999]

The cheap Klark Teknik lifter will work fine. 25db of gain for $25.