Simple, Cheap Pickup Winder

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by R. Stratenstein, Jul 17, 2012.

  1. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Rob, typically electronic components have a bit of leeway, but in order to perform as needed, you're better off keeping within specs. In other words, the thing may start working at 2.2 volts, but you can't be sure. I don't know about your motor, but I was amazed that my 24V motor started revolving right at, or slightly under 1 volt. It would work if you remembered to crank up the voltage above 3 v as soon as you observed everything was running OK, and subsequent slow downs would only account for, what, under 100 turns or so, which is pretty small compared to 4000, 8000, 10,000 turns we're typically dealing with. That said, however, I kind of suspect you're a bit OCD like me, and just wouldn't feel right knowing that there is some error there.

    That said, there is another simple integrated circuit that can use a 9V battery to provide a steady 5 volts**, or for that matter, I think a couple of D size Duracells in a Radio Shack holder would provide you more than a years' service of 3 volts, either one of which would work fine. As pointed out earlier, just don't forget, and use worn out batteries, and end up halfway thru a wind, with a dead counter trigger. :( 5v DC wall wart is the solution to that concern.

    **of which I have a spare, and would be happy to send you. PM me if you want one. I wannt wean you off that mag switch.

    EDIT: Also, it occurred to me that since you've already got 3 volt power supply just sitting there in your Cub counter. . . .hmmmm? Again, somebody more knowledgable like GN or Jim might know how, or if, this can be tapped to run the Hall sensor in addition to the counter~~


    Absolutely right GN. I was just proving more of my electronic ignorance. Or maybe I'd just been reading about voltage pumps, a concept I still have yet to get my feeble brain around??
     
  2. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Yah, Glenn, your Lurkers License is about to expire :p--time to jump in with both feet.
     
  3. nosmo

    nosmo Friend of Leo's

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    If I had to guess I'd say:

    A switched-mode power supply (switching-mode power supply, SMPS, or switcher) is an electronic power supply that incorporates a switching regulator to convert electrical power efficiently. Like other power supplies, an SMPS transfers power from a source, like mains power, to a load, such as a personal computer, while converting voltage and current characteristics. An SMPS is usually employed to efficiently provide a regulated output voltage, typically at a level different from the input voltage.

    Unlike a linear power supply, the pass transistor of a switching-mode supply continually switches between low-dissipation, full-on and full-off states, and spends very little time in the high dissipation transitions (which minimizes wasted energy). Ideally, a switched-mode power supply dissipates no power. Voltage regulation is achieved by varying the ratio of on-to-off time. In contrast, a linear power supply regulates the output voltage by continually dissipating power in the pass transistor. This higher power conversion efficiency is an important advantage of a switched-mode power supply. Switched-mode power supplies may also be substantially smaller and lighter than a linear supply due to the smaller transformer size and weight.

    Switching regulators are used as replacements for the linear regulators when higher efficiency, smaller size or lighter weight are required. They are, however, more complicated; their switching currents can cause electrical noise problems if not carefully suppressed, and simple designs may have a poor power factor.

    Or maybe I'd read that on Wikipedia ;)
     
  4. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Gee Nosmo, I was getting impressed until I read that last line.

    So, anyway, what's the dif between a switching power supply and pulse-width modulation? Just guessing but the PWM switches only the pulse width (hence the name), while the SPS switches both the power on and off periods?
     
  5. nosmo

    nosmo Friend of Leo's

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    Since none of the electrickery experts are chiming in, I'd guess that the switching power supply is set to a certain output, whereas a PWM is user adjustable.

    Also I imagine the power supply converts ac to dc, and the PWM just controls the dc current.








    Made all that up myself :D
     
  6. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Yes, in theory, you could open the counter case, find a convenient place to solder a wire to tap into the + terminal of the counter's battery, and run that wire out and use it to power the Hall effect device.

    There's a "gotcha":

    This will decrease your battery life. Probably not enough to be significant, though. But, you'd want to add a switch and remember to turn off the sensor when you're not using the counter... otherwise you'll run down your battery by powering the sensor when you're not doing anything.

    Since the counter has a auto-shutdown circuit, you could also maybe find a place in the counter to tap into that so that the sensor shuts down when the counter shuts down. It would probably be a bit more difficult to find that spot!

    And it will, of course, void the warranty on your counter!
     
  7. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Yes, switching power supplies are generally fixed voltage devices.

    And yes a power supply converts ac to dc. But, a PWM controller doesn't so much control the current as it just turns the voltage on and off real fast!
     
  8. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Thanks, Jim. To me, it sounds like more trouble than it's worth. If you've got a wall wart, or a separate battery pack, sounds like the way to go.

    However, your comments did trigger something I remember reading in the data sheets for the Hall sensors--as far as I can tell, the opto-sensors won't latch into a continuously "on" condition, drawing power. The Hall Effect sensors do. If your winder happens to stop with the magnet within the sensing range of the sensor, it will stay in "on" mode, drawing some power from your power supply. So an on-off switch, especially if you're using batteries, and probably a simple LED pilot light circuit to remind you, wouldn't be a bad idea.


    Also, my counter (Older Cub 3R) does not have an auto shutdown circuit. It always displays the last count, or 0, if you've reset it. The only way to kill the display is to take out the batteries.
     
  9. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Yeah, that's one advantage to the winder I'm building: Everything (including the counter) is powered by one power supply. A single power switch shuts off everything.
     
  10. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Now I am impressed!:lol:


    So getting back to Glen's original question, if he uses a switching power supply, he'll still need some kind of speed/voltage/pulse width, whatever control to vary the speed of his winding motor, yes?
     
  11. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    That is a big advantage. If you use a big ole Red Jewel pilot light, and cover it with black Tolex. . . . .:D
     
  12. Glen Smith

    Glen Smith RIP

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    Rick, I have a PWM coming on a slow junk from China along with my other many winder goodies.
     
  13. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Yes!
     
  14. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    I wasn't going to... but, now I think I might! :D

    Or maybe I'll go tweed... :cool:
     
  15. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Excellent, Glen! Can't wait to see your iteration. If next years' Challenge goes the way it's rumored, every winder build thread will become an eagerly, if not desparately, sought resource come next May or thereabouts.

    Now yer taklin'. For my birthday last month, my family gave me the book "The Soul of Tone" which is the history of Fender Amps. I've just started the Blackface period, so naturally, I'm thinking black Tolex. However, for maximum vintage tone, of course you're right--tweed is the best way to go! :twisted:
     
  16. Rob DiStefano

    Rob DiStefano Doctor of Teleocity Vendor Member

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    my 120v a/c lathe, 15v d/c counter/sensor, and 120 a/c focused bobbin spotlight works off one switch, too - located on a power strip. :D
     
  17. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Yeah, Rob, but that's cheatin' :eek: Anyway, do you have a big ole red jewell pilot light and tweed covering on your lathe?:D
     
  18. nosmo

    nosmo Friend of Leo's

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    Hey Jim - I'm having trouble finding that thread ;)
     
  19. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    He's gonna perfect it in private, then spring it on us in a spectacular new thread! :D Jim's too smart to flub up publicly like the rest of us rubes!:oops:
     
  20. jimdkc

    jimdkc Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Actually... I've tested out all the electronics... but haven't started construction yet. Fact is... I don't really need any pickups right now! I will resurrect the thread when I start the build...

    Guess I have to source some tweed and big red jeweled pilot lamps...
     
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