Seeking help from all of you automotive and car restoration folks out there

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Marn99, Feb 4, 2018.

  1. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Meister

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    So one of my projects in the works at the moment is to remake the original Duco and Lucite lacquers by DuPont used in Fender custom colors. I recently got this project started, and I set out to find the original formulas, starting with Fiesta Red, Duco number 2219-H, used on 1956 Thunderbird's. I reached out to DuPont to see if they have the original 50's and 60's formulas for the clear nitrocellulose lacquers, primers, pigment dispersion's, etc and they directed me to Axalta Coating Systems, who bought DuPont's paint division in 2013. So I reached out to Axalta and I got an email back saying that you can still get Fiesta Red, but not in nitrocellulose, and that they probably don't have the old formulas. Alas, my last hope is to get paint samples of original Duco lacquer sent to a lab and chemically analyzed. Yes, I am aware this is expensive, and yes, I am aware that stuff from Reranch would probably be just as good, but I am absolutely committed to making the perfect replica guitar, not only that, but I also think it would be super cool to reverse engineer a lacquer who's formula might very well be lost to history. So here is my current biggest challenge, I need samples of original lacquer (in the case of fiesta red, duco) to be sent in for analysis. So with that in mind, if anyone can help in any way make my dream of making vintage correct nitro a reality, that would be much appreciated. I would be willing to pay, and it could be anything so long as it is indeed Duco lacquer number 2219-H and the sample isn't badly contaminated. Perhaps it could be original flaked off paint from a 56 Thunderbird restoration project, old dried lacquer from the inside of a 50s Duco 2219-H can (so long as no other paint has ever been put in there), or the formula and directions for mixing the pigment dispersions into the clear lacquer, if you can help in any way, please message me!
     
    2blue2 likes this.
  2. dented

    dented Doctor of Teleocity Gold Supporter

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    Was the paint plant in Wilmington, Delaware originally? Maybe put an ad on Craigslist there. Just a thought.
     
  3. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Meister

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    Indeed the factory was there originally, that is a good idea, I am also planning on doing some asking around on some auto restoration forums as well.
     
  4. Ringo

    Ringo Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

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    2blue2 likes this.
  5. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Meister

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    They are, some like iron oxide and titanium white, are readily available, other pigments such as lead molybdate or lead chromate can still be found, albeit less readily, as there are exemptions for artists, museum conservators, etc. Incidentally, I have been watercolor painting for a long time and one of the classes I am taking in college right now is oil painting, so I know just the right sellers to go to for pigments.
     
  6. Dacious

    Dacious Poster Extraordinaire

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    There's companies already making and selling this product. Fender specified Duco, but all paint vendors had paint matched to vehicles and Fender used GM's colour charts. They just bought whosever paint was cheapest and available. Duco, Lucite or whatever the equivalent brand was from whoever.
     
  7. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Meister

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    Nobody is making the original formula though, they can't commercially sell it because it doesn't comply with things like VOC laws. Modern nitrocellulose also has things like advanced binders, different plasticizers, etc etc. I am trying to recreate the original formula as it was in the 50s and 60s.
     
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