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Rebuilding a '65 SG

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by tigger, Oct 21, 2017.

  1. maxvintage

    maxvintage Poster Extraordinaire

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    Cool thread, fun to watch. Looking forward to the resurrection

    Although a good professional player apparently had no problem making music with it?
     
  2. Torren61

    Torren61 Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

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    That hole is where the mojo escaped. It'll be back when you're finished and play it for a while.
     
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  3. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Holic

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    That's one old and rough looking pot. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Gibson used pots by Centralab.
     
  4. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    It would appear no. I found this photo from '74 which shows the headstock still stock with the crown inlay, so that was before Mr. Dowel got the guitar:
    [​IMG]

    Yes, this one is a replacement that I want to use to date the guitar. The other 3 pots are stock and dated 1963.
     
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  5. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    And it turns out the hole is original to the pot, it was probably a moddable pot, but I still don't know from when, but that photo would suggest the repair happened in the late 70's or early 80's.
     
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  6. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Chiseling out the neck pocket:
    [​IMG]

    Mostly done. Only damage done are the 4 drill bit imprints, I did not realize the pocket was that much shallower there : the bottom of the tenon is glued in place. I'd kind of like to remove it and glue it to the neck as it should be, but that might turn out to be too difficult as I'm risking both the tenon and the body base. Mr. Dowel was not just a repairman, he was an artist. Not sure if you can see it but there were 2 more dowels sort of angled through the sides of the neck and into the body. I have no idea how he could fit that in, I really don't.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Lupo

    Lupo Tele-Holic

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    I have to admit that I have not understood how the original tenon was. was it going all the way up to the "back" glue in the pick-up cavity? and how are you planning to glue your neck?
     
  8. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Yes, it was. I will draw up some detail plans and post them for review
     
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  9. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Does anyone know what the nut material is? It's sadly quite poorly cut or re-cut.
    [​IMG]

    By now I really hate Mr. Dowel. I am definitely seriously impressed by his craft, having managed to somehow put dowels through everything at strange angles, in a way that makes it unexplainable for me how did he actually manage to put the neck in without sawing the guitar in half in the first place:

    [​IMG]
    These are 4 dowels (fifth one on the other side) going through the neck. As far as I can see, the sideways one extended INTO the body of the guitar, I have no idea how that can be achieved. Perhaps it's only very shallow.
     
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  10. Torren61

    Torren61 Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

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    This is exactly like the mystery of how they built the pyramids... only different.
     
  11. Barncaster

    Barncaster Doctor of Teleocity

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    Considering the time period that the repairs were made, I would place the blame/ inspiration of this repair squarely on mushrooms.
     
  12. bender66

    bender66 Poster Extraordinaire

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    I'm going with either Mr Dowel was into black magic, voodoo, or a witchdoctor. There was probably a curse involved too so be careful.

    Can't wait to see this unfold honestly. I've recently had an epiphany with SG's.
     
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  13. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    In fact there was less magic involved and I'm glad we're again accepting basic mechanics. It turned out the side dowels do not go into the neck wood, they were just glued really well :)
     
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  14. Torren61

    Torren61 Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

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    Just like the pyramids...
     
  15. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Taking off the headstock veneer. It's glued with something that doesn't release with heat at all so a chisel it is.
    [​IMG]
    The inlay was cut through the veneer and slightly into the wood below, not too much though I believe. You can see wood putty where the main break was. I'm not too concerned since it will be hidden by the veneer, and the back is clean.
    [​IMG]

    I did solve the headstock angle question: it was neither 14 degrees nor full 17, but something like 16 from my measurements. It's because the headstock is glued ever so slightly off. I couldn't see it before I took the veneer off, but now you can with a straightedge. Not sure you can see it from the photograph, but you can also sort of make out the 1st headstock break on the left top side of the headstock side. The second break happened mostly in the same place. They probably didn't have access to sufficiently stable glues.
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Barncaster

    Barncaster Doctor of Teleocity

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    I love guitar repair forensics
     
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  17. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Inlay and overlay woes.

    I ordered DRDL tuners, Italian inlays, headstock overlay, and side dots from crazyparts.de. The headstock overlay is sadly off. It's too narrow in the center:
    [​IMG]
    That won't do and I'll try to send it back and replace with just the two inlays. I was stupid for trying to simplify it this way.


    Inlays: I destroyed some of the inlays while trying to get the fretboard off. Partly because I wasn't careful enough, but I also wanted to change them out. They are very thin and for some reason almost transparent. I have a suspicion that the fretboard was sanded down, bringing them to a really thin state. When I oiled the fretboard, the oil seemed to have seeped under, leaving them rather ugly brown.

    So I removed the first with a sharp chisel. They are quite interesting, I wonder how they did this. They have clearly been installed after the board
    was radiused (probably to cut down on material), and are curved. They also have a deeper outline and shallower center. You can actually see this through on the left un-removed inlay. I suppose this is a 60's change and wasn't like that earlier? I've never really seen it before.
    [​IMG]

    Old vs new inlay:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The material of the new ones is great. Looks just the same. However, they might be ever so slightly too small, and I will have trouble inlaying them into the radiused slots. I would say they are about as large as the originals, but the originals clearly shrunk:
    [​IMG]


    I suppose I can make it work, filling the gaps with rosewood dust and glue. (I don't actually have any so I'll probably order a bit of scrap rosewood for it.)
    I Imagine I'd need to route the routes flat though, and maybe just a tad deeper.

    To continue the complaints, the tortoiseshell side dots are a little smaller than the originals - I might actually try to retain the original ones but they might not be deep enough. And the tuners have the buttons mounted just a bit too far out. I suppose I can heat them in water and slowly push them in or something like that.
     
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  18. tigger

    tigger Tele-Meister

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    Drawing up plans for the filling. I think I'll need to route or chisel all or part of the tenon out so that I can replace it and have a good glueing surface. The neck stub is angled in the wrong way, so I will need to fill in wood on both the body and the neck. I think the existing dovetail joint should hold well enough.
    [​IMG]
     
  19. Torren61

    Torren61 Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

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    This thread is both agonizing and elegant at the same time. The frustration of ordering a part only to find it doesn't work for THIS guitar is something most of us have experienced. It's agonizing for me to see all the problems that keep jumping in your way but your solutions are elegant. I look forward to seeing updates with pictures. I'm hide glued to this thread. :)
     
  20. matmosphere

    matmosphere Tele-Afflicted

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    Have you considered adding some dowels when you glue in the neck, to strengthen the joint.

    :p
     
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