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Question about music

Discussion in 'Worship Service Players' started by Gary Mitchell, Aug 26, 2014.

  1. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    I might disagree with that notion without fully thinking it through yet.

    my initial thought was that of The Grateful Dead and their
    version of live improvisational jams that have captured
    the hearts of their fans.

    I see little difference in that free form expression of worship
    you were talking about. We will turn it off because we have
    been conditioned to turn it off.

    Our lack of commitment towards individual expression
    has hurt us in communication. Communication in all
    directions, lateral as well as heaven bound.

    Having that historical insight into what movement produce what
    artists and songs is a great place to start. Music fans
    of all ages can get behind learning history, and learning
    modern recent church exposures. Music becomes the
    secondary voice behind doctrines and styles of worship.

    I am not from the modern approaches of this at all.
    Give me a good rendition of How Great Thou Art,
    and I'm happy. But I can also see the usefulness of
    the more stylized, modern, marketing tactic.

    It's still all about numbers.
     
  2. Special Tom

    Special Tom Tele-Meister

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    Never been a fan of the Dead--I know, I know...but I can relate to what you're saying. I love the Allman bros, especially the Fillmore music. Yet there is a difference. Those jams were structured with rehearsed parts and the musicians had the freedom to express their inner selves during the jams. About 10 years ago I was involved with an evangelistic group that practiced songs, rehearsed parts--sounded good and tight. Then almost every "performance" turned in the direction of "free worship" in the Spirit. One of the singers had a shofar and when she blew it--things broke free. Since our focus was evangelistic--open air venues--there some in the crowd that "understood" what was taking place as the Spirit moved, but there were others that just had that bewildered look on their faces--what is going on??? And sometimes they just walked away. It's hard to reach someone like that. All forms of worship have their fans I guess. Anyway, I love hymns too.
     
  3. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    Ah yes, the fine line all musicians must ponder......
    especially those with a flair for in the moment performance.

    Not matter what, it's still a stage and we are still performing.
     
  4. seedlings

    seedlings TDPRI Member

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    It is a stage, and we are performing. Who is the audience? I am not. I AM is .

    CHAD
     
  5. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    Right, so why hold anything back?
     
  6. Jhengsman

    Jhengsman Tele-Holic

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    Understand my elders encourage me to dance while we play. That being said while we hold nothing back from the Great I Am that other communities are not like mine and as a praise "leader" you may become more of a distraction then an aide by not holding back. Everything we do is in relation to our specific local community needs.
     
  7. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    I live right in Los Angeles area.

    I know the different communities you talk of.

    I lost a friend who was a great guitar player and his
    comment on Christianity was that he didn't see a
    Santana or McLaughlin or The Hendrix factor in
    any church experience he had. That was the big let
    down for him in that he mostly saw the keeping it safe
    and less expressive side of church.


    I'm not criticizing, I know his view was skewed but
    it just goes to show, one man's ceiling........
     
  8. Gary Mitchell

    Gary Mitchell Former Member

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    WORSHIP LEADERS AND SONG WRITERS.....PLEASE STOP regurgitating what’s already been said in a hundred other worship songs. We don’t need another song that says the same thing as “How Great is Our God”, “Mighty to Save”, and “You Never Let Go”. Write something fresh.

    PLEASE STOP using the same chord progressions (i.e. A – E – F#m – D). Try something new and exciting. It’s okay to explore.

    PLEASE STOP writing about things you haven’t experienced personally. Write out of your own experiences with the Lord and out of deep convictions of your faith. If you don’t like to dance during worship, you probably shouldn’t write choruses that say, “Dance, dance, dance before the Lord!”

    PLEASE STOP writing songs with the goal of getting it on the top 25 list on CCLI. It’s an oxymoron to write “worship” songs with the motive of wanting the song to be popular and/or get radio play. If it’s truly a worship song, then it shouldn’t matter if anyone ever hears it. It’s your worship to the Lord.

    PLEASE STOP writing feel-good love songs that have no way of distinguishing themselves from secular love songs on the radio. If you’re writing about your love relationship with God, the creator of the universe, it should sound different than someone writing a song to his girlfriend.

    PLEASE STOP watering down the gospel in your songs. If your songs have deep theological truths and communicate the gospel clearly without compromise, expect them to be offensive to non-Christians (and even some Christians). Proclaim the Truth of God in a powerful, but creative way. That’s what we need more of, not touchy-feely/Jesus-is-my-boyfriend songs.

    PLEASE STOP trying to be the next Chris Tomlin, Matt Redman, Paul Baloche, John Mark McMillan, David Crowder Band, Kari Jobe, Hillsong, etc. You will be accountable to God for who He called YOU to be, not who he called Tomlin or Redman to be.

    Be yourself. Use the uniqueness God gave you. Use your own creativity. Write for God and God only, out of the place of intimacy with Jesus. Don’t let dollar signs or the spotlight blind you and fool you into thinking it’s okay to write worship songs to make your own name famous. God is NOT okay with that. Either do it all for Jesus or all for yourself. I agree with what this is saying. I have been in worship as you are most of you know maybe 30 years, there is just something missing. Not all the time but most of it just to much me me me and not him him him. I ask God to help me write a awesome worship song that would just amaze the church. God told me worship is of the heart, I don't have all those people hearts and not everyone is in the same place with me or God. I want you to sing from your heart. you can lead them in music but they have to have sing from their own heart and worship with their own words, what I mean to them.
     
  9. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Well said.
     
  10. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Gary, the other thing that I would add to your above manifesto, has to do with Worship vocals. Sing it like you actually feel it. If you don't feel it, then don't sing it.

    Why are there so many contemporary worship bands that feature such bland vocals. I didn't grow up in a church going family and I remember a saying my mom used to use on occasion. She would say that most of the people singing contemporary worship songs "wouldn't say $%!# if they had a mouth full". I guess that is a euphemism for someone who comes across as fake in a very prim and proper way. I know that not everyone is going to agree with this, but it is certainly true for me. Most contemporary worship vocals sound fake to me.

    Where in contemporary Christendom are your Freddie Mercury's, your Bon Scott's, your Otis Redding's, your Johnny Cash's, your Aretha Franklin's etc. etc. etc. You've really got to feel it to make it sound genuine when you sing it. Maybe that's the problem.
     
  11. rhoydotp

    rhoydotp Tele-Holic

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    Hundreds of songs have used the same progression, some we even call classics. It's not just the progression that matters, it's the groove, the melody, the lyrics, etc ... lots of things make an exciting music even with an old boring progression behind it.
     
  12. Jhengsman

    Jhengsman Tele-Holic

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    I will submit that they are everywhere. Most secular artist in today's pop music don't meet the standards of that prior generation and for everyone that does there are ten someones who looks right in the stage costume while their voice is being auto tuned. Of the artist listed as far as I know only Aretha Franklin had any gospel success although many of her generation and the present generation's secular music stars do.
     
  13. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    Secular or not, stop kidding yourself.
    The Music Business is Business even
    if the head of the organization wears
    a cross around his neck.

    Let's not confuse artists and their motives
    with being able to praise and worship
    however one sees fit.

    Churches are stifling places when compared to
    other arenas. Conformity and someone's sense
    of proper is the key.

    It's all relative though. other religions have a
    very different problem with music. Some don't allow
    it at all. Others don't understand it, while still
    others exploit it to their gain. It's used in rituals
    and in death ceremonies and even weddings or
    orgies.

    The musician himself or herself is under constant
    battle within. Trying to maintain a standard
    of excellence by studying all the new artists and
    then having to wear the robes of a 2,000 year
    old tradition while attempting to play with all
    your heart.

    Oye Vey!
     
  14. Gary Mitchell

    Gary Mitchell Former Member

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    In my heart I am dealing with it all the time. I feel sometimes I am doing nothing but helping create false worship and hope, for a people searching for God. Maybe I should step down, but then again I feel like I am quitting and hiding when I should stand up for what I believe is right in my heart. I have mention it but most of my team is very young some are in bible college . The pastor and I are the oldest we are both 63 and been in worship along time. But as a pastor he is very busy and seems not to pay a lot of attention. Its like don't rock the boat, there is one elder who plays acoustic. He feels a little like me, we talk about it sometimes. But that's about it just talk, he does get upset like me about the lack of reverence during practice.
     
  15. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Johnny Cash married into the Carter family which was pretty much the first name in old time Gospel music. He did a lot of Gospel music. If you get the chance, google Johnny Cash "Redemption". Every time I hear that song, it gives me goose bumps. We used to do a Black Crowes meets Johnny Cash version of it in a previous church. It was a ton of fun to play. Amps turned to 10, and effects chain consisted of a tuner into a Dallas Rangemaster Treble booster into the Marshall. Man I miss that.

    I know that everyone has their own preferences, and some music will move me while it will leave you totally cold. I get that. The current offerings in contemporary worship don't reach me at all, and I'm not aware of any contemporary Worship vocalist who has a memorable voice. The singer from Third Day is the closest I can think of as someone who has a voice you would know if you heard it on secular radio, but they are not strictly a worship band.
     
  16. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

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    We are all going to fall short of our expectancies
    when dealing with reverence. Maybe you need
    some down time. Maybe some alone time with
    The Creator instead of seeing yourself as an elder
    all the time is getting to you.

    I came out of a crazy church situation and crazy
    is not even scratching the surface. To think you don't
    make an impact on someone is short sighted. You are
    where you're at for some instance, reason, destiny,
    call it what you will.

    Maybe your job is to touch one person, period.
    You may never meet this person, or it may be
    someone you know very well and so you don't
    even notice how they notice you.

    Seeing an older gentleman with the younger set
    might just bring some integrity to the affair.

    Personally, i think it's not even about guitar,
    or music, or any of the other strange notions we
    humans love to wave in front of God's face.

    Like the palm branches on Passion Week, do we
    even realize what street we are paving? lol.

    I'm sure my time on a guitar forum is highly
    questionable, but here we are........
     
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