Question about Fender Vaporizer reverb

Sorry I have no experience with this model, but a quick google search for Vaporizer Reverb issue did find quite a few sites discussing this, including this forum.

Possible issues are PCB cracks, bad solder joints, the usual suspects except tubes as apparently the Vaporizer reverb is not tube driven.

 

The Vaporizer has tube-driven reverb when the vaporize mode is engaged. I'd have to look at the schematic to be sure, but I believe the recovery circuit is semi-conductor....


-tINY

 

The Vaporizer has a purely solid state driven and recovered spring reverb section.

Http://www.tdpri.com/threads/nad-fender-vaporizer-review-examination.461919/page-4

Counting 12A-7's and comparing that number to what functions and gain stages an amp has is a good indicator of what goes on....but the schematic doesn't lie.

 

According to the schematic from Fender, there is a tube gain stage inserted in the reverb circuit. The actual drive of the input of the pan is always an op-amp buffer with current feedback....

 

It is difficult to read this schematic that was contained in post #68 of that thread I linked, but the drive is in an IC and the recovery is in an IC. IT matters not what comes before that drive or after that recovery, the reverb is solid state. IN fact, if my old eyes are seeing correctly, the input gain stages are in IC's, too.

 

mrtiny, this statement....."The actual drive of the input of the pan is always an op-amp buffer with current feedback...."....is confusing to me. The only time there is an op amp in a reverb circuit is when the reverb circuit is not tube driven circuit, ime. That is, only solid state reverb circuits have op amps in them, ime.

 

I was underlining the tube stage in-line with the driver that's switched in when vaporize is engaged. If you are after the sound of a tube driver (driven hard) that triode will get the essential character even if the coupling is through an op-amp instead of a transformer.

Here's some mark-ups to look at. By strict definition, It's not a tube-driven reverb, but the Vaporize mode has a tube just in front of the buffer that drives the pan. And, that will give you the sound of a tube-driven reverb (mostly, if you're picky).

 

Thanks for the clear schematic, mrtiny. Looking at that, I am going to conclude that that is a hybrid amp. IT is so far from processing all of the signal in the tube domain that it cannot be called a tube amp, imho. The reverb is solid state....as is much of the tone processing gain stages.

 

Preamp tubes are only there for the overdrive character. It actually sounds like a clean fender tube amp. It won't respond the same to clean boost pedals as an amp with a valve in the first gain stage... but, it's got enough of the "tube sound" to be a nice combo.

So, if you just want the sound of a tube-driven reverb, you get it in vapor mode. If you have an existential need to run tube-only drive, it's disqualified.

 

I have been around a long time....for all of the time that engineers have been claiming that solid state was going to eliminate the need for tubes. I hear solid state whether it is a preamp stage or an effects stage. IF someone else can believe that is a tube amp sound, that is their perogative. I hear the difference.
Existential...."

1. 1 : of, relating to, or affirming existence <existential propositions>
   
   
2. 2 a : grounded in existence or the experience of existence : empirical b : having being in time and space"

I'll take that proudly. There is something that exists in properly done tube circuitry that does not exist in the everyday(inexpensive) solid state circuitry. That existence is 'palatable' in space and time. IT can be felt and heard. It can be experienced. I have done so. I have not experienced that in the solid state domain. ONE amp gets close..very close; but even it falls short when put to the true test. That amp cost about $2000 in today's money when it was marketed in the late '70's. These inexpensive SS amps and hybrids do not develop the necessary harmonic structures to do what tubes do....ime. They fall...and sound....flat, dull, and uninspiring musically, imho and ime. IF that works for someone, fine by me. IT doesn't work for me.

 

OPs topic is off the rails

 

A while back, a friend brought one to a gig, great Country player. We both tried it. I thought it pretty much sounded like a Solid State amp, overall ... flat, drab cleans and craptacular distortion. Plus, it wasn't substantially louder than my SF Princeton Reverb, which sounded considerably better to our ears. They look cool. Maybe build a tube amp into the cabinet?

I'm not against hybrid amps ... I'm on my second MusicMan, but to me, it sounds much "tuby-er" than the Vaporizer. I admit the latter amp has some "low-fi" potential, if that garage band tone is your thing. Different strokes, etc.

 

The stock speakers were crap. That seems to be the issue.

The Vaporize mode was supposed to sound like a flat-out champ.... I guess that's why the speakers were chosen. I'm looking to modify the vapor mode too, probably as a reverb boost.

For cleans, it sounds good with the Sig12 AlNiCo drivers from Weber. You aren't gonna get preamp saturation out of it, though.


-tINY

 

Hey Guys - could someone forward me fender vaporizer schematic? (I can provide my email address via pm) Thanks

 

Go to Post #9 and click on the attached files. The full schematic is in there with some highlighters on it. The heater winding circuit is partly cut-off, but it is only balance resistors, power indicator LED, and heaters.

 

Ok, this schematic was pretty hard to read but I've contacted fender and it took them like 5 minutes (!) to reply to me with the schematic so I am sharing the goodness