Push Pull to S1 Help, Please

Tom_SpaceMan

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Howdy folks,

I'm trying to convert a diagram that I saw of a push pull pot to work with a Fender S1 switch. I was able to convert to a dpdt switch, but the S1 is witchcraft to me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Tom

Please see attached for the diagram, Courtesy of Fralin Pickups.

4-Way-Tele-Mod-With-Push-Pull.png
 

AAT65

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An S1 switch is just a 4PDT - like two of those DPDTs working together. Each “side” (group of 3 contacts) works the same - common in the middle, which connects to one side when the switch is up and the other side when it’s down. So just pick two of the groups and wire them up like a DPDT. Ignore the other terminals.
 

Tom_SpaceMan

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Sorry, I'm not quite sure I follow. I'm more of a visual guy, and can get hung up on text descriptions. Would I be wiring the ground diagonally (Pole 1 A to Pole 3 C in the diagram below) then continuing on with the diagram I posted above? Am I on the right track?




upload_2021-9-30_17-25-19.jpeg
 

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Tuxedo Poly

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I would use Poles 1 and 2 on the S1.
These images of the S1 and a push pull pot are labelled with similar contact numbers. It's easy to get confused as the S1 is operated in the down position and the pushpull in the up.
Fender_S1-bottom-view_mod.jpg


Push_pull_operation.jpg



Transposing the wiring from the Fralin diagram to the S1 should result in something like this.
Image16.jpg
 

Tom_SpaceMan

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Thank you so much!

This was exactly what I was looking for. The visuals go a long way in helping my brain make sense of what does what. I learned soldering and guitar wiring from copying diagrams, so it is nice to learn which components do what.

Cheers

Tom
 
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Tom_SpaceMan

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Follow up question. Would it be possible to wire that diagram in such a way that it would bypass the tone control when the S1/DPDT is engaged?
 

AAT65

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Sorry, I'm not quite sure I follow. I'm more of a visual guy, and can get hung up on text descriptions. Would I be wiring the ground diagonally (Pole 1 A to Pole 3 C in the diagram below) then continuing on with the diagram I posted above? Am I on the right track?




View attachment 904596
You were on the right track!
If you look at Pole 1 and Pole 3 you can wire those up just like a DPDT (ignoring poles 2 & 4 -- or use poles 2 & 4 while ignoring 1 & 3).

Follow up question. Would it be possible to wire that diagram in such a way that it would bypass the tone control when the S1/DPDT is engaged?
With the S1, yes: if you're using poles 1 & 3 for the pickup switching then use say pole 2 for the Tone circuit. Just disconnect the link from the volume pot to the tone pot (yellow in your original diagram) and instead link from volume to the B lug on pole 2 and from the A lug to the tone pot.
 

Tom_SpaceMan

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upload_2021-10-2_14-8-11.png

So if I'm following right, on this diagram above, I would be putting the yellow from the volume pot to Pole 3B and connecting the tone control pot to Pole 3A for it to be bypassed when the switch is engaged, right?



upload_2021-10-2_14-13-8.png
 

Tuxedo Poly

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Unsolder the yellow from the volume pot and connect to the B of pole 3. Connect a new wire from C on pole 3 to the volume pot lug which originally had the yellow from the tone pot.

upload_2021-10-2_14-13-8.png
 

Tom_SpaceMan

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Bumping this thread, sorry folks!

Finally was able to try the diagram but hit a snag with the tone disable. Tuxedo, your diagram worked to get me started. The issue I am having is that I have a TBX on the tone pot and have it wired like in the Fralin diagram, with no capacitor between the 2 pots.

I was able to figure out how to convert your diagram to a 3 way Jazzmaster style toggle, but cannot for the life of me figure out how to make the tone bypass work.

Any further help would be appreciated, folks!

Cheers
 

Tuxedo Poly

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This should work.
The switch output (white wire) is routed through the spare S1 pole and on to the modified TBX input. The TBX output is routed as original diagram (yellow wire).
Operating the S1 disconnects both the input and output of the TBX and routs the switch output directly to the S1 volume potentiometer.

Tele_3_Way_Series_Mod_TBX_Tone_Disable_S1.jpg
 
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Tom_SpaceMan

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The adventure continues, folks!

The S1 switch worked great.. until it failed. I bought 2 replacements for it, but I also bought 2 Push-Push pots as a backup to the backup!

My questions are:

1. Is there any difference in wiring a push-push pot as opposed to a push-pull? (Would I be able to use the original Fralin diagram with no modifications?)

2. Following on from that, is it possible to wire the tone disable to work with Push-Pull? (When the pot is engaged, both pickups are in series and the tone is disabled, as in Tuxedo's diagram)

Thanks again all! I've been a long time tinkerer with guitar pots, but 2 stage pots (Push-Pull, Push-Push, S1 etc.) are Greek to me.

Cheers

Tom
 

Tom_SpaceMan

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The pots in question ;

Musiclily Pro Brass Full Metric Sized A500K Push/Push Guitar Pots Audio Taper Potentiometers for Electric Guitar or Bass(Set of 2)
 




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