Posible amp trading: My Bassman 59 LTD for a Silver Face Twin Reverb

Discussion in 'Glowing Bottle Tube Amp Forum' started by El Marin, Nov 15, 2019.

  1. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,062
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    Hi

    Long story short.... I had a Reissue Twin Reverb really modded... Master, both chanels on phase (you can add one to the other) Vibrato on both channels, V30 speakers, No NFB... I loved it and gigged it for 20 years.
    Then I had to move from Madrid to London and sold it (first mistake)

    After some years in London (love that town) I came back to Madrid and called the band back. Something like this:



    So, I needed an amp... I found an used Bassman 59 LTD, my bandmate has a Bassman 59 Reissue (20 years hearing it in front of me) and sounds really good so I thought, let's go that way (second mistake)

    Well... I am happy with the bassman but not really... The 4x10" cabinet is too focused. If you are in front of it you can be arrashed by the sound, but if you move one step aside it is completely lost. Sometimes it sounds really bright and harsh. The TR was more open.

    My thoughts are on taming the brightness of the amp, changing the 4x12" baffle speaker for a 2x12" or doing the trade... I really don't care about wheight. I will use some wheels to move it or get a ZT amp for gigs

    I ALWAYS have a TS808 on and have an old Drive Master just for a push up when leads and solos

    What do you think?

    Would do you do the trade?

    How usable is the SFTR Master?

    Would you trade or mod the Bassman?

    Are SFTR very different to BFTR?

    Just for add information , theese are my guitars (and the amp):

    [​IMG]

    This is my pedals (just changed left one for a Slapback echo delay):

    [​IMG]
     
    telemnemonics likes this.
  2. dreamingtele

    dreamingtele Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,901
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2010
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    My dream amp is a 59 bassman. Ive tried and it was a dream, with that said, i can relate with it being focused, which my the soundman that time wanted it to be mic’ed and we had in ears for monitors. Is it really the nature of a 4x10 being too focused?

    i also played a Twin reverb amp and it does sound glorious clean, and all my pedals really sounded awesome. To me its the perfect clean beast.

    if I had a choice, id stick with the Twin if I just want cleans with some OD’s in front of it.

    but if im going to crank it, i would like to have a Bassman in my arsenal too. Although I havent heard a 2x12 bassman yet.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
    stevemc likes this.
  3. Dacious

    Dacious Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    7,121
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Location:
    Godzone
    SFTR and BFTR are similar except for individual speakers and differences that's irrespective of RI or original. Quite different to Bassmans. Each are their own amp.

    RI Bassmans have a good rep. Fitting 2 12s will give you a Marshall JTM45 sort of vibe depending on what you choose. New Greenbacks would probably be a good choice. They're a lot tougher but seem great overall speakers without being muddy.

    The Bassman has a woody sort of middy thing going on the Twin doesn't, being inherently scooped. Great reverb. Fluid tremolo.

    The MV on SF Twins is quite good and effective in retaining their sweet basic tone at even low volumes. It won't really give you breakup at any volume but you have dirt covered with your pedals.

    The Twin will give you unburstable cleans and as much bass as you want. At a point where the BM is starting to induce squawky speaker breakup and the alnicos are giving it up the Twin is just exciting Richter scales with not much distortion.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  4. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,062
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    Yeah, I have a Bassman and had a Twin Reverb... Never used the reverb and never played clean :lol:

    My thoughts are on the difference Silver to black faces... and the Master
     
  5. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    60
    Posts:
    17,873
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    SFTR master is not going to get you what you want, so you'll have to get it modded or live with the basic clean platform.
    I think I've had three MV Fender amps, none were a MV useful to me.
    I traded my RI Bassman for a BF Super Reverb, but at the time I liked the reverb, and ran it next to a Plexi 100 Marshall.
    Seems like my same model SF compared to BF finds that they differed only in condition/ speakers/ tubes.

    I also gigged another bassman RI and had no problem hearing myself with the amp near a wall to reflect sound.
    I was often told to turn down though...
     
  6. Mr Ridesglide

    Mr Ridesglide Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    1,919
    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2009
    Location:
    Bloomington, MN
    Vibrolux Reverb or a Vibroverb may get you where you want to be?
     
  7. allesz

    allesz Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    461
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Location:
    Italy - Bologna
    Hey Marin! Great guitars! The SG with tele bridge pu is pure evil. HOW does It plays? Really puzzled about this mix.

    Nice board too. Totally agree on adding some echo.

    It seems you don't like your amp. Let it go at the risk of just another (the last? :)) mistake.

    Tell us how it goes.
     
  8. tubelectron

    tubelectron Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    636
    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2010
    Location:
    France
    Buy all the Blackfaces you want, and discard those rubbish-trashy-muddy-lousy Silverface amps. I'll take them au poids de la feraille :D :

    [​IMG]

    -tbln
     
    Flaneur and Straydogger like this.
  9. Dacious

    Dacious Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    7,121
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Location:
    Godzone
    If you leave the MV dimed a good SFTR pretty much sounds like a BFTR. Sure - a real one with vintage correct speakers will sound 'different' to a RI or 135w UL. But it's in degrees. With a Tube screamer on in front you'd never know the difference. Presuming good repair and decent speakers in the Twin

    Good bias, good speakers and any Twin can be a great sounding amp.

    I'd question what it's going to get you if you don't use reverb or ever play clean.

    You sound like a candidate for a Tweed Bandmaster or Brown that you could use without pedals. Or maybe a Bluesbreaker Marshall esp.if weight is no issue.

    But your Bassman maybe with 212 probably suits you. Fender made a limited RI with 212 - people seemed to like them. Issue is you'd pref need to swap output transformer for 4 or 8 ohm unit for 2 speakers.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  10. zombiwoof

    zombiwoof Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,124
    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Location:
    Tujunga California
    There was a Custom Shop amp called the Bassbreaker (not the current ones) that had 2 V30 12's in it, it was only around for a while. Same amp as Bassman with the Celestions, supposedly sounded more like a Marshall.
    Al
     
  11. Sax-son

    Sax-son Tele-Meister

    Age:
    68
    Posts:
    284
    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2019
    Location:
    Three Rivers, CA
    I agree with that wholeheartedly. I have always thought that on a Twin in particular, the speakers are an important part of the equation. I am running my SFTR with Weber California paper caps and love the sound coming from those speakers. However, speakers are a personal choice and you should go with those that you like.
     
  12. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,062
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    Are you talking about this one?

    [​IMG]

    Yes, yes, "not the current ones", sorry....


    You mean this....

    [​IMG]


    Maybe I should try embeding two 12"s inside my Bassman... No need to change transformer, I think I could add a 4 Ohm 40 Watt load to mimic two 12"s
     
  13. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    58
    Posts:
    14,262
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Spring City, Pa
    I've never heard of anybody saying a 4x10 is too focused.
    I use them because they fill the room better than anything.
    12s are more beamy and 15s even more so.
    I feel like you're hearing something that is leading you to believe it's to focused.
    And when you mic, smaller speakers sound better. Win-win.
    But if a Twin is your jones...DO IT!
     
  14. zombiwoof

    zombiwoof Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,124
    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Location:
    Tujunga California
    Yeah, the second one is the original Bassbreaker. I never noticed they used 4 ohm V30's in that, I guess it makes sense if they are in parallel (for 2 ohms load, isn't that what the Bassman has?).
    Al
     
  15. Strato50

    Strato50 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    52
    Posts:
    1,540
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Location:
    Port Arthur TX
    Bassman all day. 4 tens are where it’s at. You can do a few mods to the bassman to make it do anything. I used one for a while. Ones I got my old super I sold it. But twins are great with the right speakers. But I leans towards the 4 tens. And that circuit.
     
  16. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,062
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    Well... Is what I see (hear) at the rehearsal studio... if I move a step aside I loose the amp. That thing didn't happened with my Old TR, thats why I think I may try 2x12" os go back to the TR

    Anyway, a friend of mine is doing me a favor and I am borrowing his SFTR this week and giving it a try side by side
     
  17. Rayf_Brogan

    Rayf_Brogan Tele-Meister

    Age:
    38
    Posts:
    391
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2017
    Location:
    Washington
    If you wanted to compare black face and silverface twins, this is a good video.



    That 71 Twin circuit is a little different than the MV, but the comparison is still solid imo. Silverfaces sound great clean, a little more scopped mids than a BF. At break up, a BF will shine, SF will start to fart and flub. However, the likely hood of reaching that point is minimal so both are good amps.

    Theres a 73 Twin on my Craigslist for $500 this morning. Needs a little work but nothing out of this world.
     
  18. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    11,896
    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Location:
    Snellman MN
    I've got a 1965 BFTR and a 1976 SFTR. Most days I like the SFTR better. Some of that is it's inefficient Radio Shack Utah speakers, which I figured I'd toss right away. The BFTR sounds a lot better plugged into those too but I prefer the SFTR. Out of about 20 amps right now it's my number one. And it's the least "cool" one.
    The MVs Fender used then never tripped my trigger, this one is no exeption, it stays on 10 pushed in. From time to time I'll try it but never change my mind on it.
    I have found some earlier SFTRs I don't like, the ones with lower plate voltage. But the later ones are on par with the blackfaces.
    Go later still and you get into the ultra linear 135 watt TRs. Those are generally not thought of too highly but have their fans.

    Any old TR probably need service, in fact you can bet on it. No big deal solder in a full set of electrolytics. On a silverface add a small trim pot to the balance pot so you can set bias. Easy peasy. It may need more but often that does it.
     
  19. Dacious

    Dacious Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    7,121
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Location:
    Godzone
    You
    The other thing you could try is swapping out two of the Legend ALP1028s for Ceramic 1075 Legends. They're a bit fuller sounding.

    Have you got all the leads +ve - +ve? If you have any reversed it can lead to a thinner tone.
     
  20. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,062
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    I will check that today
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.