Please define "Made In America" for me.

Greggorios

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Link to the National Institute of Standards and Technology section on Made In USA:

he FTC Act, § 45a Labels on products, states that a product advertised or offered for sale with a ‘Made in USA’, “Made in America’, or equivalent label must have domestic origins that are consistent with orders and decision of the FTC. FTC has provided a policy statement requiring that ‘all or virtually all’ of a product be made in the United States to make the unqualified claim. Any product labeled with an unqualified ‘Made in the USA’ claim or similar must be able to have that claim substantiated.

What does ‘all or virtually all’ mean?

A product that is ‘all or virtually all’ made in the United States will be one in which all significant parts and processing that go into the product are of U.S. origin and the product contains negligible foreign content.



https://www.nist.gov/standardsgov/compliance-faqs-made-usa
 

Digiplay

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I was just going by my offense o meter as I saw various offended responses ignoring your question in favor of discussing the name of this continent!

But maybe you wanted a continental divide and took a sneaky route to get there?



There you go again :)


I am curious, do you have a problem with the USA being the USA, Canada being Canada, Mexico being Mexico, Germany being Germany, etc., but regardless, I truly respect your views, as well as others views, and if one does or does not think about this "Continental Divide" you assume I'm inferring, hey, this is America (uh-oh, there I go again telemnomics :) ), and you have as much right as anyone does to express your thoughts/opinions, which should not be confused with "The One and Only Truth" :)


In summary, the Title was a simple question, and I meant to cause NO division on this Thread :)


Let's get some more input guys!
 

telemnemonics

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There you go again :)


I am curious, do you have a problem with the USA being the USA, Canada being Canada, Mexico being Mexico, Germany being Germany, etc., but regardless, I truly respect your views, as well as others views, and if one does or does not think about this "Continental Divide" you assume I'm inferring, hey, this is America (uh-oh, there I go again telemnomics :) ), and you have as much right as anyone does to express your thoughts/opinions, which should not be confused with "The One and Only Truth" :)


In summary, the Title was a simple question, and I meant to cause NO division on this Thread :)


Let's get some more input guys!

We all knew what you meant, just got messy with 1/3 of the answers being off topic and on to continent pedantics.
 

nojazzhere

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Link to the National Institute of Standards and Technology section on Made In USA:

he FTC Act, § 45a Labels on products, states that a product advertised or offered for sale with a ‘Made in USA’, “Made in America’, or equivalent label must have domestic origins that are consistent with orders and decision of the FTC. FTC has provided a policy statement requiring that ‘all or virtually all’ of a product be made in the United States to make the unqualified claim. Any product labeled with an unqualified ‘Made in the USA’ claim or similar must be able to have that claim substantiated.

What does ‘all or virtually all’ mean?

A product that is ‘all or virtually all’ made in the United States will be one in which all significant parts and processing that go into the product are of U.S. origin and the product contains negligible foreign content.



https://www.nist.gov/standardsgov/compliance-faqs-made-usa
There you go....getting all "technical" and "official" on us. Where's the fun in offering legal documentation and "proof" about a subject, when we can spend, what?, over a hundred posts bickering back and forth?
I bet you don't even cheat on your taxes, huh????? ;)
 

Bryan A

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It really should be "Made in the USA".

America is a continent (not a country) on which Canada and Mexico also reside.

View attachment 910971

So products made in Canada or Mexico are also made in America.

When it comes to guitars it's not likely all parts are made in in the same country.

I suppose if the main components are made in the same country it's assembled in then I guess as close as we're going to get.

not sure exactly why you’d think that, but there’s only one nation known colloquially to the entire world as “America”, and it’s not Canada or Mexico. If their products are considered “made in America” because the CONTINENT they’re in has “America” in the name, then products made in Venezuela, Colombia, Brazil, etc etc would also be “made in America”
 

Rockinvet

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It’s a good subject though. Great thread OP. I always wanted to know about this just never really thought about it.
 

Greggorios

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There you go....getting all "technical" and "official" on us. Where's the fun in offering legal documentation and "proof" about a subject, when we can spend, what?, over a hundred posts bickering back and forth?
I bet you don't even cheat on your taxes, huh????? ;)

I wish I still made enough to even consider stretching the truth with Uncle Sam!
 

G.Rotten

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not sure exactly why you’d think that, but there’s only one nation known colloquially to the entire world as “America”, and it’s not Canada or Mexico. If their products are considered “made in America” because the CONTINENT they’re in has “America” in the name, then products made in Venezuela, Colombia, Brazil, etc etc would also be “made in America”

The question I answered initially was "Made in America? or Made in the USA?".

Although everyone knows "America" is generally accepted to mean The United States of America, technically any country within The Americas "could" say they were American. I'm not saying anyone wants to & I'm not suggesting anyone should stop doing things the way they are now.

I was simply answering a question as to which of those 2 options was more correct.
 
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Si G X

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It’s a good subject though. Great thread OP. I always wanted to know about this just never really thought about it.

It's certainly been interesting reading all the posts that's for sure. :D

I think of both Mexican and USA Fender's as 'made in America' I must admit.

If you asked me where Mexico was I would say 'It's in Central America' .. so maybe that's why I see it like that?

I guess it's just a perception thing, which is going to be different wherever you are.
 

G.Rotten

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It makes my heart happy to know that someone else (as well as a few others) GOT what I was asking (and I was not trying to start ANY trouble Rockinvet) :)

Thanks!
Jerry

Though I feel like I'm the reason we got off topic I understood what you were asking.

I think the only countries mass producing anything entirely from products from their own country are overseas. Most mass production in North America has become a world effort. I go back to what I said a few times in this thread. Imo if raw materials (rough cut wood) and various other parts (regardless of origin) are brought to one area to be machined/cut/sculpted..etc, finished & assembled, then the final product was "Made in that area".

In addition to the origin aspect there's also a question of "Made vs Assembled". If Fender had all the bodies & necks pre-made and finished overseas as well as the other parts, then Fender wouldn't qualify for the title of Maker at all. It's the working of raw/rough cut material that is the difference between Making & just Assembling.

If Nash bodies & necks are sourced from the U.S. and then the guitar is assembled in the U.S. then I would say it's a U.S. made guitar. I just wouldn't personally consider Nash a company that makes guitars.
 
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aging_rocker

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An interesting, if obviously somewhat 'touchy' debate.

Manufacturing is now a global enterprise, whether we like it or not, so we just have to move on and get over it.

I think that the labelling could get a bit out of hand if they had to say stuff like "Assembled in the USA from parts manufactured in <insert potentially lengthy list of countries which aren't the USA>" - hard to get all that on a little sticker...
 

Digiplay

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It's certainly been interesting reading all the posts that's for sure. :D

.........................................so maybe that's why I see it like that?

I guess it's just a perception thing, which is going to be different wherever you are.


That's EXACTLY what I tell my wife every time I get naked Si G X :)
 

G.Rotten

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An interesting, if obviously somewhat 'touchy' debate.

Manufacturing is now a global enterprise, whether we like it or not, so we just have to move on and get over it.

I think that the labelling could get a bit out of hand if they had to say stuff like "Assembled in the USA from parts manufactured in <insert potentially lengthy list of countries which aren't the USA>" - hard to get all that on a little sticker...
Agreed.

It should also be acknowledged that importing parts isn't always about the dollar. Sometimes some things are simply better coming from somewhere else.

There are many questions about Ash (Northern vs "Swamp"). It really the same species of tree that has different properties dependent on growing conditions. I'm in Canada and I'll take the lighter Southern Ash any day of the week.
 
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Si G X

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In addition to the origin aspect there's also a question of "Made vs Assembled". If Fender had all the bodies & necks pre-made and finished overseas as well as the other parts, then Fender wouldn't qualify for the title of Maker at all. It's the working of raw/rough cut material that is the difference between Making & just Assembling.

Outside of a legal difference, I don't think the difference between 'making' and 'assembling' is something that really exists.

A lot of making is 'assembling' that's how guitar pedals are made, they are assembled from a bunch of parts (not usually made in the USA) .... nobody is handcrafting resistors, jack sockets and transistors from raw materials in their workshop.. and most aren't even etching the PCB's any more.

I think it's a false distinction and a bit silly.
 

Rustbucket

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I thoroughly enjoyed my MIM Tele and Korean ASAT Special when I owned them. Both were great guitars, but neither really held a candle to either of my AV Teles or my USA ASAT. Now that I focus on quality > quantity, I’ll stick with my “assembled in USA” guitars, or whatever you want to call them.
 

G.Rotten

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Outside of a legal difference, I don't think the difference between 'making' and 'assembling' is something that really exists.

A lot of making is 'assembling' that's how guitar pedals are made, they are assembled from a bunch of parts (not usually made in the USA) .... nobody is handcrafting resistors, jack sockets and transistors from raw materials in their workshop.. and most aren't even etching the PCB's any more.

I think it's a false distinction and a bit silly.

Making/Building requires a different skill set and level of commitment to the job. Assembling is part of building. Building is not part of assembling.

So making/building a guitar means you've have, know how to use and did use woodworking tools, finishing tools & then also know how to assemble a guitar.

Distinctions are rarely important to those unaffected by them.

Two people are at a party and asked what they do.

Both use brushes and paint and are considered the best in their field.

One paints houses and greatly improves the enjoyment/quality of life for their clients. The other has paintings hung in some of the world's most respected galleries.

Both can say they are painters and be right but only one can say they are an artist and not mean it figuratively.

A Carpenter uses raw wood to build stairs and railings (for example) or a Cabinet Maker uses raw wood to make a Custom kitchen.

If I go to Home Depot buy and install premade railings, stairs and cabinets I'm not a Carpenter or a Cabinet Maker. I'm just handy.

I bet if I called myself a Carpenter or Cabinet Maker in front of the real deals, they would have something to say about it.
 
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Si G X

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Making/Building requires a different level of skill. Assembling is part of building. Building is not part of assembling.

So building a guitar means you've have and know how to use woodworking tools, finishing tools & then also know how to assemble a guitar.

"Assembling is part of building. Building is not part of assembling."

yet both are very much part of 'making' ... which is what we are talking about.

If you want to make a distinction between something that's been 'hand crafted' or whatever then fine.

but if something didn't exist before and now it does exist, then you 'made it' by definition.
 

yegbert

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What does it entail/mean if a Fender is Made In America?


Does every part of the guitar have to be manufactured in America?


Does the guitar have to be assembled in America?


Could some parts be made elsewhere, but as long as the guitar is assembled in America, does that fit the definition?


If so, and as I'm not sure if Nash uses all American made components, but regardless, if his guitars are assembled in the US, would a Nash guitar be considered Made In America?
Why does it matter? What will you do differently, having gained some confidence you know the answer?
 




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