played through my 1987X last night and had a thought

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by tamer_of_banthas, May 17, 2020.

  1. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    60
    Posts:
    20,525
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Friedman makes good interpretations of that Marshall starting point.
    Coming from old Marshalls I'm never quite satisfied with Vox, but YMMV.
    The Orange AD30 lineup has Voxy Marshally blends that are generally more heavy and less jangly.
    Dr Z makes every possible amp and there are tons on the used market, lifetime build quality,
    Back to Orange, they have so many models in your general area and are also plentiful used or new.

    Last maybe get the Marshall serviced?
    It's a modding amp really, even with the PCB it begs for upgrading.
    A tech can buy a turret board to make it into any 50w Marshall in history, can improve the loop etc, probably for less $$ than a whole new amp. That reissue Marshall was not a great build of that great basic amp, but it has the

    And if you find a proper Hiwatt nearby?
    Check that out, great amps but not really very Marshally IMO.
    Depending on exactly how you use the Marshall.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  2. trxx

    trxx Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    42
    Posts:
    1,086
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2019
    Location:
    Between reality and imagination
    I would start with getting that amp serviced by someone with a good reputation. Then if you still aren't happy with it...

    Hiwatts are cool, and there are clones out there that don't cost Hiwatt money. They have a different character than Marshalls, but they definitely do the crunch thing very well and definitely are not mushy. But I would think that your 1987x in good service shouldn't be mushy either. Have you always noticed it being that way? Also, speakers could be an issue. What are you using with that amp?
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  3. Bluey

    Bluey Tele-Meister

    Age:
    58
    Posts:
    413
    Joined:
    May 15, 2018
    Location:
    Australia
    If I was going the Hiwat/Marshall but not Marshall route & had the cash the Reeves 12 combo is supposed the be a non ear bursting gem. I've heard the Reeves Classic 18 "I think it was named" mic'd at a gig & it was insane in a good way. The dude was playing a Gretch White Falcon...fantastic tones.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  4. tah1962

    tah1962 Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,229
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2020
    Location:
    Heart of Illinois
    1+ I have a Suhr Badger 18 head (EL84 though) and it’s a killer amp. Very good cleans/edge of breakup and it has power scaling too so it’s great for home noodling. It will also growl if you want it to.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  5. tamer_of_banthas

    tamer_of_banthas Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    572
    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2019
    Location:
    The Void
    thanks telemnemonics. good post. do you know of any vendors who sell turret board upgrades and/or the improved FX Loop? thanks

     
  6. tamer_of_banthas

    tamer_of_banthas Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    572
    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2019
    Location:
    The Void
    no it's not too mushy right now at this point in time. was just throwing the comment out there so that anyone who might recommend an entirely new amplifier would have a fair idea of the sound i was after.
    and thanks for your reply btw

     
  7. Jerry_Mountains

    Jerry_Mountains Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    348
    Joined:
    May 10, 2014
    Location:
    The City of Mountains
    Check out the Blackstar Jared James Signature Combo Amp, its like 700 hundred bucks it have usb audio, the loop seems nice and from what I heard the bass is tight in a British way. I'm gasing for one.
     
    Cysquatch likes this.
  8. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    60
    Posts:
    20,525
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    For turret boards there is Metro amps with spendy mustard cap populated boards but maybe those are more plexi.
    Ebay has lots of sellers making populated Marshall turret boards but I'm not sure which have an improved loop.

    Maybe a tech builds the loop in true PTP off a turret board that is only the basic Marshall 1987 circuit.
    My old four input 50w Bass head had a hand wired loop added but then removed before I bought it, as unmods were getting popular.
    Of course finding a good tech who adds good FX loops to vintage four input Marshalls is the best way to go, I'm not that familiar with the PCB 1987x aside from purists complaining that it could have been better when it first appeared.

    I bought the PCB SLP reissue some years back and was disappointed, but it was loosely based on the '68 100w lead and I really wanted the more creamy sounding '67 circuit, so it was an unfair comparison.
    Same with the reissue of the JTM45/ Bluesbreaker, good amps but not good enough to purists.
    If your 87x needs service, a few hundred to upgrade and improve the loop seems like a good investment.

    Some rewiring like gutting RI tweed bassmans and Deluxe Reverbs makes less sense to me since the same amp is put back.
    I think the 1987x had better transformers (from the original vendors, Dagnall and Drake) than the Fender RI amps too so you're starting with closer to a vintage amp.
    Not that Bassman RI's are bad, but there seems to be less sense to gutting a PCB amp when the same old circuit was fine and not in need of fixing a mediocre detail like the FX loop.
    You might also be able to have a tech leave the main PCB and only change the FX loop portion of the circuit, but IDK for sure.
    I believe that amp already has hand wired pots and sockets so a turret board isn't that much labor to install.
     
    Tim S and tamer_of_banthas like this.
  9. gusfinley

    gusfinley Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,027
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2014
    Location:
    SLC, UT
    If you like the Marshall (when it is working correctly) but want lower volume, you can swap your EL34s for a pair of JJ 6V6 tubes and get it re-biased. This would make it a 20-ish Watt amp. Or perhaps an attenuator. I put a Pentode/Triode switch in mine to drop it to 20 watts. Still loud but it comes in handy. I also have a Post-Phase-Inverter-Master Volume installed.

    After 15 years your electrolytic caps need a service. Last time I played mine it was sounded not so great ( But also GREAT at the same time). I realized that I built this thing about 20 years ago and I will be reworking it this year to get it sound its best again.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  10. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    58
    Posts:
    15,058
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Kimberton
    I've come across many people who need to have a thought.
    I wonder if they should be given a Marshall.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  11. acVox

    acVox TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    39
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2020
    Location:
    Great Britain
    When I bought my first new Marshall , a 1959 model Super Lead back in 1997 I was shocked at the hiss and noise compared with the relative quiet of my vintage Marshall 50 watt head.

    I thought it was due to the aggressive gain difference between the two.

    I was told to check for neat wiring, and sent pic examples to compare.
    I noticed that the difference between the two amps was the tidy and
    carefully tucked in wiring along the side wall of the vintage chassis of my old amp.

    After doing the same on my new amp all the noise disappeared, it was really dramatic, and I was blown away that a few minutes of tidying up the loose and messy wiring could have such a profound affect.

    Even if all I've said is old news, I wish you the best with everything.
     
    Tim S and tamer_of_banthas like this.
  12. tamer_of_banthas

    tamer_of_banthas Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    572
    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2019
    Location:
    The Void
    good point acVox. it's really just a matter of finding an amplifier technician in my area that does not suck. i have been let down before. thanks for your post

     
  13. acVox

    acVox TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    39
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2020
    Location:
    Great Britain
    Its upsetting to hear that you have been let down, all the more so as your experience is not uncommon by those of us with vintage or high end valve amps.
    When I emailed the pics of my new Super Lead, with the hiss/noise issues to my tech, he immediately suggested the most likely issue based on his experience and the images I sent him, and after his safety briefing, I tidied up the wiring which took all of 5 mins. Job done, problem solved.

    A good tech will always look for the most obvious first and work from there.. This simple suggestion solved my problem, won my confidence in his ability and more importantly his professional integrity.
    He is certain to retain me for any future work I need on my amp's.

    If the opening gambit without a glance at my amp, was to reassure me that only a complete cap job and replacement of all valves Inc re bias was my only hope, at a significant cost I could have easily fallen for the technical jargon, be down £500. And no closer to a solution.

    There's a real benefit to the collective knowledge on the tdpri and although I'm new I feel welcome and enjoy contributing where I can.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  14. marshman

    marshman Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,069
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Location:
    SE PA
    I have a Rivera R30 1x12 combo...two channels, EL34s, punchy cleans and rich dirt. I don't use it much because even at 30 watts its' pretty loud for home use, but will play a typical bar gig un-miced if you need it to. The basic amp comes in 30, 55, and 100 watt variations, and as heads and combos. I can't comment on the fx loop, as I never used it, and it's fairly heavy for 30 watts. But, it feels well built, and comes with a bias testpoint for setting bias if you're inclined to play around with such things and know how to NOT get electrocuted. They're also available at reasonable cost on the used market.
     
    tamer_of_banthas likes this.
  15. Cysquatch

    Cysquatch Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    759
    Joined:
    May 2, 2019
    Location:
    Grovetown, GA
    I forgot about these, but that's a really good recommendation. I've not had any time with the combo, but I've had a few chances to fiddle with the little half stack they sold and that thing is very nice. Not what I would want personally, but that's just taste. It's objectively a great sounding amp.
     
    Jerry_Mountains likes this.
  16. acVox

    acVox TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    39
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2020
    Location:
    Great Britain
    Marshall have a tech department (can't believe I didn't think to mention this before). Calling them puts you in touch with the engineers that designed your amp, and they get enthusiastic hearing from those using their premium reissue amp's. (At least they did in my case).
    Its an option to be considered while your thinking these things over.
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.