Pedal Games - Chasing Tone and Fell in the Rabbit Hole

Discussion in 'The Stomp Box' started by Ducerro, Jan 27, 2020.

  1. chris m.

    chris m. Poster Extraordinaire

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    Look up pedal schematics at some of the do it yourself effects pedal websites. Most of the boutique pedals are based on classic original overdrive and distortion pedals,
    typically with a few adjustments to the EQ and maybe a few extra switches for additional adjustment. Wampler makes nice stuff along with many other makers, but IMO
    you can also get equally good sounding stuff at a much more affordable price point from large scale makers like Boss, MXR, Electroharmonix, and TrueTone. It's mostly economies of scale-
    the large scale makers have a lower cost per unit and so it's cheaper for you. The boutique makers just don't sell a high enough volume to be able to make a profit at a lower price.

    The Wampler is essentially an overdrive and a distortion. Similar concept to the TrueTone Jekyll/Hyde. I did a little poking around and believe the OD side is fundamentally based on a
    Tubescreamer circuit, but it probably has been adjusted a lot. Not sure what the distortion side is based on. You could probably buy something like a Boss SD1 and a RAT or Son
    of Hyde pedal and with the two of them together have a similar range of gain and EQ adjustment on tap.

    Go look at freestompboxes.org and from perusing the site you will realize that most boutique pedal offerings are just as I have described-- mods to classic, basic effects pedals.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2020
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  2. Si G X

    Si G X Tele-Afflicted

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    Yeah, I wouldn't even consider that.

    Musictoyz.com and Rogue Guitar Shop seem to be the two US dealers, if you can't get to either of those to try it out I would see what returns policies they have. I don't know about you or anyone else but I'm not dropping $250 on something without playing it myself.
     
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  3. chris m.

    chris m. Poster Extraordinaire

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    Okko Diablo is apparently a very well done mild to medium overdrive. Something like a Boss OD3 probably is all you need for dirt in order to not have your rig be
    the limiting factor in chasing the sound in your head.
     
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  4. TeleTex82

    TeleTex82 Friend of Leo's

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    For me pedals have always been a necessary evil. I'm much happier just plugging into an amp, but as one gets involved in different projects and plays different music the need for effects arises. I am a huge fan of pedals that can do more than one thing, whether that's something like Source Audio, Strymon, or Chase Bliss. Pedals like that give you the ability to switch things up without constantly adding or subtracting from your board. They have more of a learning curve than straight up pedals but the time you invest in them is definitely worth it. Lately, I've actually been drawn to multifx units like the Helix. The sounds you can get out of these things now are extremely good and organic sounding and to be able to adjust things on the fly and have different presets and cab/amp sims make them a very flexible and appealing option.
     
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  5. Skydog1010

    Skydog1010 Tele-Afflicted Platinum Supporter

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    A tone idea normally starts with me having heard something that interested me (normally my interest has to be very high to even listen because of all the years worth of material filed away in my mental sound library) - once the interest starts intensifying with me having heard it over and over or I have actively sought it out over and over, I will hunt about to see if the artist is sharing what chain they are running (and the settings), "Guitar World" "Five Watt" YouTube videos etc etc...using clones doesn't bother me in the least, especially if it saves me money. In the last quarter of 2019 I sold off 50% + of my FX pedals. I'm not one to run out and buy amps just to scratch a tone itch because that's how XYZ "gets" their sound. This is all subjective subject matter to me.

    Boss makes good stuff. As do many boutique pedal makers. I would never drop the coin for a Helix, so there ya go. My two cents worth.
     
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  6. Ducerro

    Ducerro Tele-Holic

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    I owe you a beer...

    I checked out Rogue Guitar Shop and took a look at their Okko offerings. The pedal GH uses in the video I posted isn't even offered anymore. But I knew that already. So I took a look at the newer version and there was a video of GH playing the pedal - so I clicked on it. As I was watching it I was somewhat surprised the light on the Okko wasn't on - and it's a pretty big light. Thinking to myself - well, maybe it is on and the video camera isn't picking it up. BUT a bit later in the video he swings around, his leg moves, and there is an audible "click". The camera pans back and the Okko's light is now on - bright orange and all. Uh oh! What if the Okko wasn't even on in the video I posted???

    So - back to the earlier video of GH playing the MIM Strat. Video starts and I'm enjoying the tone, rockin' my head, grooven' to the beat and at the 0:28 mark the camera pans back and... WHAT! The Okko ain't even on! Uggggghhhh! I'm chasing ghosts! GH plays sans Okko until the 2:08 mark when you hear the click once again and the video camera pulls back to show the Okko's bright orange light - and a definite change in tone. He sticks with the Okko for 34 seconds until the 2:42 mark when it comes off for the rest of the video!

    I think I just saved myself $250!!
     
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  7. tfarny

    tfarny Friend of Leo's

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    I would advise not trying to exactly copy a rig, for reasons of both budget and sanity. Never purchased a pedal? Get a used multieffects that looks user-friendly to you, and play around. The boss me80 is the easiest one I can think of. You'll learn a lot about sounds and effects, in the long run it might save a ton of money.
    If I personally did not own a single pedal already I would be looking at the higher-end multieffects units out now and just be done with it.
     
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  8. tele_pathic

    tele_pathic Friend of Leo's

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    Well, when watching that second video, what strikes me (besides the very tasty playing) is the mic’ing and the actual recording process. That’s what captures the snap of the strings and the excellent tone. AND just like anything else, the pros can make almost anything work for them. This guy could play a Squier affinity and it would sound good. LeBron could wear crocs, flip flops, converse, nothing, and still dunk over you. Tiger woods could beat you with clubs from walmart. When you get to that level, yes, some might be gear: that’s more what separates the pros from each other, but srsly, it’s the talent and the hands and the musical knowledge that makes this sound so darn good
     
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  9. bluesholyman

    bluesholyman Tele-Afflicted

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    No worries. I guess my point is, and one that has [more importantly] been also emphasized by That Pedal Show is to sort out the guitar and the amp first, then do the pedals.

    I made a huge mistake for a long time of trying to run mids-heavy pedals (TS types) into amps that were also strong in the mids. Had I picked a guitar and and amp I just loved, I would have spent a lot less time and money on my pedal education in chasing tone. I learned a lot, but could have figured all that out much quicker had I gone about it in a more sensible way...
     
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  10. rough eye

    rough eye Tele-Meister

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    my 2 cents, and kind of a different take, for what it's worth:

    play something really simple, a 2 or 3 note phrase, or even a single note.

    play it as many ways as possible. change pick angle, where you're hitting the string with the pick, hard/soft, how much of the tip of the pick is striking the string, how much flesh of your thumb scrapes across the string, your left hand vibrator, and pickup selector positions too.

    myself, i would never buy any pedal, amp or guitar off the internet without playing through it in person first. especially with pedals, that's a dangerous road to start going down.
     
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  11. Ducerro

    Ducerro Tele-Holic

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    Great advice!

    And you lost me here! ;) I'm not "near" anywhere.

    We usually tell our customers that Yoakum is 95 miles from everywhere. Well, at least we're centrally located! Just got back from a trip into town - Houston that is. Stopped at GC - didn't find nothin'. Back at home now and fixin' to order pedals online - they're in stock you know!

    The ONE item I bought in the last two years from the Houston GC was a Maxie FX mixer. Drove 95 miles to Houston and then 95 miles back, then drove 95 miles the next day to return it to GC, and 95 miles back! It wasn't the right one. As you can imagine it's FAR EASIER to just order it online and have it delivered. If it's not right then the "local" UPS or FedEX shop is only 45 miles away - so it's alot closer!

    I pretty much buy everything online now - guitars, amps, pedals, you name it - Amazon is my friend! I bought 7 guitars online last year and only one had to be returned. I also bought an amp last year online and I did have to send it back for an exchange (the first one was damaged in shipping), but the exchange went without a hitch and the second one was perfect.

    I did look at pedals today while I was in GC, but they didn't have the one I was after... Long drive for nothin' (kinda anyway - I needed to visit our accountant in Houston and the wife needed to return something to Chico's). We also got to eat at one of our favorite BBQ places for their AWESOME Chicken Fried Ribeye! So all in all it wasn't a total loss! :rolleyes:
     
  12. zeedoctour

    zeedoctour Tele-Meister

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    It's rare that the tone I am "chasing" is because someone else played it and I wanted it. I am always seeking "my tone" when I am just making stuff up. Every now and then I see/hear someone play that makes me go "hmmmm ... THAT is tasty" but I use that experience to expand my own chase/desire ... as inspiration for what I seek ... more than it makes me want to duplicate what they are doing. However, I freely admit that none of this guarantees anyone else will like my "tone". I consider it a success if *I* like it.
     
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  13. 3-Chord-Genius

    3-Chord-Genius Poster Extraordinaire

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    Oddly, I've discovered over the years that chasing another guitar player's tone by buying the stuff that he uses, normally doesn't work. I'm guessing because a lot of the sound has to do with the studio processing or something, I don't know. But I have been able to approximate the tones of famous guitarists using equipment that they do NOT use, again oddly. You know that lead tone on "comfortably numb" that everybody is trying to nail? I got it using a Stratocaster with the switch in the #2 position (the "in-between" bridge-middle sound that I hate) and rolling off the tone knob completely. This sounded exactly like David Gilmour's lead tone when I played it through an overdriven Mesa Boogie with a delay. However, this technique did not work with any other amplifier...
     
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  14. Ducerro

    Ducerro Tele-Holic

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    This thread and this "tone search" have helped me to uncover a multitude of things related to "tone" - so much so that I'm having to rethink most of what I thought about a specific tone. And the major take away - don't chase anothers tone. Find your own.

    An earlier reference to David Gilmore sent me down another rabbit hole where I found a rather creepy website called Gilmerish or something to that effect. On that site the "host" disects everything he can to come up with DG's tone. I'm telling you - it was way creepy! I don't want to go there!

    I have sounds in my head that many different players can play - Greg Hinder and David Gilmore are just two of those. I'm sure there are more. If I'm 100% honest, I'm pretty sure I'm just after a clean tube amp sound with little gain, a touch of overdrive, a bit of reverb, and a smidge of delay. I've already got all the equipment I need to do that - except for the overdrive. But I'm thinking a lowly Boss Blues Driver BD2 will get me there without popping for a boutique pedal.
     
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  15. Stardog75

    Stardog75 Tele-Meister

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    When I chase tone I buy a pedal if it plays well with my amp I keep it.i went through 6 overdrive pedals before I settled on 2 that I felt both sounded awesome with my amp.the same with all the other pedals i have except 1 that i ordered used based off of a you tube video otherwise i try them out and if it doesnt sound right i know right away and take it back
     
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  16. 3-Chord-Genius

    3-Chord-Genius Poster Extraordinaire

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    I've seen that Gilmourish website - it's borderline idol-worship. That guy spent a ton of money trying to be exactly someone else...
     
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  17. Thin white duke

    Thin white duke Tele-Afflicted

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    I've had so many pedals that i can say that i have in my mind the sound that i want so to me an original ts 808 or a Joyo clone doesn't make any difference so i go with the clone since i get the same sound, actually now i'm using the drives from the Boss Ms-3, same story, i get the sound that i want from that baby, same with modulations, delays and reverbs.

    The individual pedals that i buy are those very particular that hardly i can substitute with a clone, for example the Electro Harmonix Ring Thing, another excellent clone that i have is the Mooer Tender Octaver, usually the pitch shifters sound rubbish in multieffects so i buy individual pedals.

    Also i get bored of pedals so i like to change quite often but i have to say that i like the Boss Ms-3 so much that i don't feel the need to change it.
     
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  18. Twang Deluxe

    Twang Deluxe Tele-Meister

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    I agree with you. The GE-7 is great and I use it with a TC MojoMojo.


    IMHO Greg always sounds the same, no matter which guitar he uses.
     
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  19. Unison Bend

    Unison Bend TDPRI Member

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    Besides his fingers, that amp is the key to Gregor’s tone
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
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  20. johnnylaw

    johnnylaw Tele-Afflicted

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    I can only offer that much time spent in music stores playing as many different amps (with your guitar) as possible will really help tune your ear. Also, playing "live" in a band setting through as many different amps as possible also helps to tune your ear. A few years living through this process should help to point you towards the best possible amp for your needs, and that is where you money will be used to the greatest advantage.
    I love and use some pedals, but I also can get through gigs and jams without them because I'm crazy about my amps' performance.
    Cheers...
     
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