Paul Weller RIPS into the Cure front man Robert Smith

[green_henry]

Am kinda shocked at the amount of older folks who never heard of The Jam.

The only song I remember getting any airplay was Town Called Malice, and if you didn't care for the song, the band name would not register.

 

[Geoff738]

Also, I don’t like musicians ripping other musicians. They know how hard it is.

Cheers,
Geoff

 

[scottser]

By any measure, Weller's work has been much more influential than the Cure. I don't see any way the Cure has been influential at all, they were never more than a second rate version of the Smiths.

The Cure had an international footprint that The Jam never had. They sold 30 million albums worldwide. Weller's bread and butter is the UK and Europe and his influence reflects this.

 

[scottser]

Sidebar : Supergrass is the second best Britpop band after Blur.

Listened to a “Best of” comp off of Spotify yesterday as I was tuck pointing a building and it was superb.

I had heard only one of the songs before. The rest was totally new and all really great .

Thanks E5RSY !

Now, go and check out a band called Pulp. Thank me later.

 

[soul-o]

Never heard of Paul Weller or The Jam before. I've heard of The Cure.

This is not something to be proud of if you think you have the slightest grasp of rock history. Sorry, but both bands were incredibly influential and impactful. The Cure obviously have a larger legacy and have continued to tour and make albums across the decades, but the Jam were a major UK act in the early 80s who had a dozen hits. If you haven’t heard of the Jam, you might want to keep that to yourself.

 

[hepular]

Four, actually. Which kind of prove my point.


Up through Pornography (1982), the Cure had a post-punk goth sound (Killing an Arab, Boys Don't Cry, etc). I actually like the singles from that era, they're a lot different than the stuff that came after because starting in 1984, they changed to the more pop oriented sound that made them famous. That same year the Smiths made their LP debut with the same basic mope-rock modus operandi, only Morrissey and Marr were much better at it and established a legacy that the Cure would never equal.

If you lived under a rock in the '90s, perhaps.

it's still a NARROW channel. but yeah, i did live under a rock, or more to the point, i wasn't paying attention to 'rock.' I MEAN if the Brit press was praising the Arctic Monkeys for their musicianship and songcraft when they first arrived, that tells me most of what I want to know about the era preceding them . . .

& you can't argue that the cure weren't influential because they became famous. [unless you take the classic Alan Bloom restriction of confining "influence" to the relationships that matter to you between artistic agents that matter to you]. The Cure are a bigger band than the smiths or anything paul weller's done . . . & for better or worse (sometimes a whole lotta worse) all you gotta do is go to any praise worship gig and it's gonna be a basic mash-up of joshua tree era u2 and mid 80s cure.

[& lastly, the Smiths are Johnny Marr's guitar parts. Morrissey's lyrics are whinery holden caulfieldesque bs with an english accent.

 

[SnidelyWhiplash]

Am kinda shocked at the amount of older folks who never heard of The Jam.

On the other hand, the Jam are a great band at the narrow road they traveled on but , if you want to play Apples and oranges and fairly/unfairly compare them to a contemporary of theirs - they fall very flat.

The Clash.

Not at all in the same category talent-wise.

In terms of musical importance/wide ranging musical abilities etc.

I could see you comparing the jam to all the clash up to/right before London calling but after that - nah .

World-beaters .

I mean the jam is never mentioned as a way to figure out whether you are a boomer or a Gen X if you’re right on the edge of those generations.

But the short hand always for how to figure out if you are a late Boomer or early Gen X?

Just ask the question - Beatles or Clash ?

Easy litmus test.

It was never The Jam or Beatles ?

The Jam were a totally British phenomenon. Never made a ripple in America. The Cure had more of an impact here.

 

[boris bubbanov]

Unkind, but not necessarily untrue.

Weller's been making fantastic music for decades (I'm willing to forgive him for the Style Council), I haven't heard a Cure song since the early '80s that wasn't garbage.

No, I wouldn't say the later Cure stuff is garbage, but I have stayed impressed with Paul's new work as time goes along, and Robert has kind of fizzled out these last decades.

And what is wrong with The Style Council? I know it isn't fashionable to like it - but that's too bad! :^) Oh, and btw, check out some of the Style Council album's portrait art - there's some androgyny there as well, so Paul may be overlooking some of his own past.

 

[boris bubbanov]

[& lastly, the Smiths are Johnny Marr's guitar parts. Morrissey's lyrics are whinery holden caulfieldesque bs with an english accent.

The Smiths are much closer to equal parts Marr/Joyce/O'Rourke/Morrissey than most folks want to admit. Neither Stephen nor Johnny have attained the same result since the band broke up. It is time for the public to see, Mike and Andy mattered a lot.

 

[David Barnett]

Am kinda shocked at the amount of older folks who never heard of The Jam.

They never quite cracked the USA. Weller's solo career even less so.

 

[micpoc]

all you gotta do is go to any praise worship gig and it's gonna be a basic mash-up of joshua tree era u2 and mid 80s cure.

Wow, is that true?!? Good thing I stay away...

 

[boris bubbanov]

They are both culture bearers and important icons in British music. Weller is known as 'the modfather' such was the importance of The Jam to the late 70s mod revival. The Cure created a genre all on their own though. I've seen both acts live and they are both fantastic and that's the meat. Everything else is just salad.

No, I don't think Robert created a genre unto himself. I've got a huge number of records from bands who all arrived at the scene at the same time, and people have a lousy habit of attributing all of this to just the one, best known band. It is similar to saying that the entire British Invasion was just the Fab Four. The Cure's claim is more that, when other bands came through on tour, I had to cajole people to coming to the shows with me. With The Cure, I was lucky sometimes not to have to give the last ticket to someone else and stay home (and save my ears - they are STUPID LOUD, in some venues).

 

[micpoc]

The Smiths are much closer to equal parts Marr/Joyce/O'Rourke/Morrissey than most folks want to admit. Neither Stephen nor Johnny have attained the same result since the band broke up. It is time for the public to see, Mike and Andy mattered a lot.

Well, Morrissey has been FAR more "successful" as a solo artist than The Smiths ever were as a group, but absolutely true on the rhythm section. This is one of my favorite isolated tracks...

 

[boris bubbanov]

Yeah, I should've clarified. I have no idea which records sold and which did not (I have/had them all). I'm thinking more as to what impact the musicians and the writing had on others. Paul influenced musicians and the UK public, and Robert influenced "artists" and the USA general public.

 

[AAT65]

Well, Morrissey has been FAR more "successful" as a solo artist than The Smiths ever were as a group, but absolutely true on the rhythm section. This is one of my favorite isolated tracks...

Even without the visual cue you would be pretty confidently able to identify that as a Precision Bass, wouldn’t you??
I agree that the Smiths’ rhythm section were very good indeed — but I think it was Johnny Marr’s guitar that lifted them out of the crowd musically, and Morrissey gurning with a bunch of flowers in his back pocket that made them superstars…

 

[ahiddentableau]

He never really made it in the States, but Weller is a senior statesman among British rock musicians. Even Noel Gallagher recognizes it.

+1. I think there's a lot of the whole "two peoples seperated by a common language" going on here. If you're from the UK the Jam were legitimately a huge band, but if you are from the other side of the ocean that was never really true. If you're an American (or Canadian, etc.) it's more likely that you've heard the Cure than the Jam.

I don't think there's much to distinguish them in terms of influence. The Jam/Weller on the britpop side, the Cure on the shoegaze and goth side. I like Blur and Supergrass way more than I like any goth stuff, but the shoegazer stuff is near and dear to my heart. I'd say that's pretty much a wash. But there's not much in the way of overlap there, which helps explain the anomisity.

 

[papa32203]

Re: this video- WTF?
I know- it's 1979, but.....WTF?

 

[papa32203]

When did Rod Stewart learn to play the piano?

 

[Killing Floor]

Yeah, they broke a lot of ground and do not get credited for their impact early on.

 

[papa32203]

Best thing about the Jam was/is clearly Bruce Foxton. Monster.