No, you are not an astronaut, sorry

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by tap4154, Jul 27, 2021.

  1. teletail

    teletail Friend of Leo's

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    You can give a monkey a rope, it doesn't make him a cowboy.
     
  2. loopfinding

    loopfinding Friend of Leo's

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    i don't have time to post all the source material amount of stuff that exists, since there is so much of it. but here's a laundry list of a primer with cited info.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Amazon
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_tax

    not many companies with their own pages-long wikipedia articles for both of those, just sayin'. not everyone with notoriety is just cause of "haters" or whatever.
     
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  3. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    I worked at a company that had to make a major comeback. When I went there, we had trouble making payroll. Along the way, we ventured into businesses that many thought had all ready been pioneered, settled and decided. Each time we went to those markets, the critics said it was stupid and meant ruin for the company, each time, we made inroads. Finally, it was decided that we'd make a phone. A PHONE! What a stupid idea. We had to fight the telcos to build the phone we wanted to make and could only get one to agree with our terms. We still had to dumb it down to make it work on the existing data network and when it was released, they said it would flop and ruin the company. Then they said it didn't have enough features (note we had to dumb the phone down to fit the data networks because the telcos could never have imagined what was possible.)

    Conventional wisdom is for LOSERS. Common sense is for people who don't think for themselves.

    https://www.amazon.com/dp/0814408966/?tag=tdpri-20

    Read something like this and it will encourage a guy to rethink what he is absolutely sure of.

    My brother recently sold his company (a global company worth a bunch of dough) he has a diploma from high school and started his 'career' as a directory service operator at Pac Bell. One thing my brother had was a plan to escape poverty and to make enough money that no one could pose a real threat to him. He mapped out exactly what he wanted to achieve and he did it (really years ago.)

    With my two closest friends, we mapped out what we wanted to accomplish and while we have VERY different goals, each got there through work and using opportunities and staying focused.

    Mistakes get made, and they get made on a grand scale with lots of people watching. If you have been in a decision making role, think of the times that the choices that were made were difficult and had ramifications that were difficult.. Imagine that on the scale of Amazon or Virgin or Tesla.

    I'm all for hating the rich, but I also have to think that it took some pretty major courage to try the things these guys tried and to do something that regular guys would think were 'stupid' (like selling books, going in the car business, starting an airline in an era where airlines were going out of business.)

    Just because a guy gets rich doesn't necessarily mean he is evil. He just saw something and acted on it when other people couldn't see it or saw it as too risky. hate away!
     
  4. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    Why does it demean what 'real astronauts' did? if what these guys (Branson, Bezos, Musk) do leads us to be able to truly explore space, colonize planets, aid folks back here on earth by going on these missions to get our eyes back on space exploration and if it leads to the kinds of inroads we made with tech from our early exploration... it sure isn't harming the reputation of John Glenn or Gus Grissom.

    The fact that Bezos ship had no captain should inspire not bring derision. The fact that Bezos ship had a plan if the main rocket exploded should make Christa McAuliffe fans everywhere breathe a sigh of relief. It is only through the small steps (coming off a rocket ship in a cowboy hat) that we make the big leaps.
     
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  5. Whatizitman

    Whatizitman Poster Extraordinaire

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    It's not possible to become the richest being in the galaxy by earning it. It's chance. Period.

    But I agree that shaming Bezos for not giving away zillions to homeless is silly and self-serving. First of all, it's not like he cares. He's too rich to care. He doesn't have to. 2nd, it's inevitable human behavior to want to keep what you think is yours, whether you "earned" it or not. It's not a moral question. It can't be, since what constitutes rich, poor, compassionate, or hateful are all highly debatable and subjective. It just is what it is. It's not an excuse for turning our back on others. But nor is it necessarily moral justification to willingly go without. Everyone has to figure that out for themselves. And the sad reality is that wars have always been waged on that question, and there's no sign that will end anytime soon.

    I still think he's a douche. It's just that my opinion means zilch in the grand scheme of things.
     
  6. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    I love the tax one!

    I have a tax professional. I pay all the tax that the law requires me to pay. I don't pay taxes I am not required to pay. WHOSE responsibility is it to create the rules and enforce the tax laws? Are we truly self governing where we charge ourselves taxes that we do not have to pay or do we pay what we are required to pay.

    Personally, while I DO donate monies to causes I support, I do not pay extra tax when I am not compelled to. You may be different.
     
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  7. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    I do believe that the monkey that went to space DID get his astronaut wings.
     
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  8. tap4154

    tap4154 Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    We'll just have to agree to disagree. I think it does demean what the real astronauts do and did, and the commitment and the skills that they possessed. As I said I'm all for either of these guys doing anything they want, and I do see positive things coming from it, but to be shot up above the atmosphere for a few seconds then land and jump up and down to get your astronaut pin just seems a bit pathetic. They basically just rode an expensive amusement ride. There really was very little risk in both cases. While the Mercury astronauts were basically going along for the ride as well, there was a huge risk in everything they did. You can't even compare the two things.
     
  9. Whatizitman

    Whatizitman Poster Extraordinaire

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    Bezos didn't go up alone. He was at least kind enough to ask a former female astronaut!

    His brother also went. :rolleyes:

    A kid who won the lottery to allow his CEO dad to pay millions to be on Blue Origin went. The first winner ducked out due to "scheduling conflicts" :rolleyes: and Amazon put the kid in his place.

    First paying customer to space is a rich 18 year old kid.

    OK, that's where I draw the line on apathy for all this. Of all the chances to allow kids who will arguably NEVER get a a chance to do anything like this, much less be the first. No, this rich kid won a chance to pay to go.

    Screw that. Public/private "partnerships" my ars.

    Bezos is a douche. Period.
     
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  10. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    thought question, no response needed, just a thought: One person did not go. 'scheduling conflicts'.

    If they had died in their quest, would you still feel the same?

    When Christa McAuliffe got to ride on Challenger, there were many who did not see her as an astronaut and decried that space had become pedestrian and they could now send, well, teachers and it was no big deal, just a big joy ride with some made up experiments to make it seem like more than a publicity stunt.

    Then, it blew up. She, along with the rest of the crew, died. They never made it as far as Jeff Bezos, and CM did not complete her 3 year training course, but... they all got their wings.

    Our feelings are fascinating... and how sure we are of them being somehow tangible and real vs. just emotions.
     
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  11. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    Oh man, I'd totally take my brother if I had a space ship.

    Weren't some of Branson's folks paying customers too?

    I've flown first class a few times in my life, and business, and coach... I guess we could just make them all one class if that is what you want comrade....
     
  12. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    You know this exactly how?
     
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  13. Fretting out

    Fretting out Poster Extraordinaire

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    Ha! A billion years? We’ll be long extinct by that point, we’ve got another 2000 if we are LUCKY

    Doubt we will solve anything by then....

    There’s always the person that says they should spend their money on X,Y,Z...

    I say it’s their money they can spend it on what they want

    If you don’t like amazon don’t shop or work there
     
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  14. tap4154

    tap4154 Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    I saw Christine McAuliffe as an astronaut, and she did train as a payload specialist and was familiarized with the controls of the shuttle. She also took rides in the vomit comet to get used to weightlessness, because she was going to be up there much longer than a minute or two. She also had a mission, she had several experiments to conduct and was going to teach classes a couple times from space.
     
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  15. getbent

    getbent Telefied Silver Supporter

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    yeah, I wasn't saying YOU thought that.. just that at the time, many were dubious about her qualifications AND traininng... the metrics they used to disqualify the folks today are the ones that would have disqualified CM (she did train, but did not complete it)

    as for trips in the vomit comet, do we know that none of those folks have done that? I don't know that.
     
  16. tap4154

    tap4154 Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    From the Bezos flight comments afterwards, I don't think they did fly on the vomit comet. The comments I heard were things like they were explained what to expect, but when they actually felt it it seemed very natural. They also had not experienced high Gs before the flight. They were just told what it might be like.

    But I wouldn't have expected them to go through extensive training for a short amusement ride like that.
     
  17. bottlenecker

    bottlenecker Friend of Leo's

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    I don't believe wealth is created or destroyed. It moves in an economy like energy in the universe, but is not created.

    I also can't believe the world is meritocratic. Meritocracy is a fairy tale.

    So I must believe there are amounts of wealth that are impossible for a human to earn, regardless of their ability to acquire or posess.
     
  18. Blackmore Fan

    Blackmore Fan Tele-Afflicted

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    You have to start somewhere....and they have. They're more inspirational than anything NASA has offered us in quite awhile.
     
  19. bottlenecker

    bottlenecker Friend of Leo's

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  20. papa32203

    papa32203 Tele-Afflicted

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    Yeah, and you look around now and see what their money got them....and us.
    Don't worry: Bill and Melinda, Warren B., George S., Jack D, the Google guys, Mark Z, Jeff B., Elon, et. al are poised to straighten this whole mess out very soon. Every problem just takes enough money to fix it right up. It's always worked before...
     
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