Nels Cline Gets Feelings Hurt by Fender
- Thread starter BorderRadio
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- fender jazzmaster nels cline
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Perhaps a slightly cynical view would be that Fender paid Nels in advance to get all bent out of shape - because now many more guitar-buying people are aware of this particular option than otherwise might be.
...and just checking...uh, nope, still don't care.
...and just checking...uh, nope, still don't care.
BorderRadio
Doctor of Teleocity
I briefly thought this right away, and immediately questioned the story's veracity. I don't know the guy but I wondered if he really cared that much. Posting a self-attributed quote on social media in this fashion seems a little calculated. I'm sure a savvy 63 year old Cline is well-rounded enough to see the humor in all this, and the benefits.
JuneauMike
Poster Extraordinaire
They have their own signature models because Fender decided to invest its resources into making them, I presume after some careful due diligence beforehand. I don't pretend to know Fender's market any more than you do. Suffice it to say if Fender wants to do a signature model of someone's guitar their justification will be grounded in solid market analysis. Or they lose their shirt and move on to the next business decision.
Not sure what "old folks" you are dismissing here but its a safe bet that Fender Custom Shop doesn't share your arrogance. Seems counter intuitive to build an upscale product line around a market that is young, dumb and broke. Price point matters and that's a recipe for starvation.
BorderRadio
Doctor of Teleocity
Whoa buddy, who you calling arrogant? I hang around here for a reason, I respect the old timers. I'm saying Nels ain't for everyone, but Fender would be wise to make a Nels-blessed Jazzmaster. I'm pretty sure by just being a Jazzmaster it's going to attract a younger market, though the Offset poll thread shows a healthy JM appreciation here at TDPRI.
Maybe this is what the backstory is about? Nels was interested in a sig model, no agreement could be made. Relationship soured.
Geeze, young dumb and broke? Kinda rude man...
Looks like an early G&L. Nice!
addendum
I found this:
http://www.tdpri.com/threads/freddy-fender-has-passed-away.59095/
and this post:
swoodaTele-Holic
748
Jan 15, 2004
New Orleans, LA
I played with Freddy from 1980 to 1983..... Freddy took his name from the Fender Telecaster he played in his early years. Leo Fender presented Freddy a G&L guitar when we were playing the Palamino club in North Hollywood around 1981....Via Condios Mi Amigo...
Lettin’ the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier than puttin’ it back.
Looks like Swooda hasn't posted in several years, but one of those cats on stage may have been him.
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JodanOrNoDan
Tele-Meister
Who said other countries don't make good guitars? Not me. I only play American made guitars. That does not make other guitars crap. I also only use British amps. That does not make Fender amps crap.
Fender in my head is a US brand. Should be manufactured here. Marshal is Brit. Should be manufactured there. The Japanese make great guitars(now). If I wanted an Ibenez it would be a made in Japan one.
I do not like that Fender manufactures stuff out of country built by people that work for pennies on the dollar then puts the Fender logo on it. That is what Squire is for. It doesn't make these guitars bad, it just makes them not Fender by my standards.
I should have left the Walmart thing out. It is way beyond the scope of this thread. All I will say in that vein is there is plenty of information about Walmart business practices and how getting something for practically nothing usually ends up being bad in the long run.
I bought my first new Fender in Germany as an E-1 private in the Army back in the mid 80's. To say I had no money was an understatement. I saved my pennies until I could buy a guitar that was made in the US. It was a month and a half's salary and the guitar did and still plays flawlessly. That is what I expect from Fender. If you buy a $400 guitar you are much more likely to forgive the small stuff and the focus of the company switches from quality to quantity. This is not what I like to see from an iconic brand.
Long story short, until Fender pulls its head out of its 4th point of contact I will not buy anything from them. They have made it clear to me they do not care, and I made it clear to them that I don't care that they don't care.
My next tele type guitar will be made by someone that cares about my opinion. When I find that person I will pay for quality.
Bellacaster
Tele-Afflicted
Okay. So you think that whomever in Fender's Custom Shop wasn't looking at images of his guitar when they crafted their overpriced gem? They weren't looking to hook some dentists that are rabid Wilco fans? I am not claiming that what Fender did was illegal, infringing on IP or TMs or whatever. I'm saying that they made a guitar that appears to be a replica of a famous artist's who is known for playing a bunch of Fender guitars. It seems like a bad idea on Fender's part to ruffle the feathers of someone who uses their products proudly, whose professional identity is wrapped up in the very guitar they appear to be reproducing.
Rory Gallagher's Strat is also worn and it's been replicated as a signature model by Fender. But it's been an urban myth that his sour sweat had a plot against that sunburst finish.
JuneauMike
Poster Extraordinaire
Ah, got it. Thanks for showing so much respect for the "old timers." I guess?
I don't know much about Fender signature guitars (and at the end of the day don't care much about that line) but the two examples you offered each had some unique characteristics or attributes that distinguished them from the stock guitar. Maybe that's a caveat with Fender Custom Shop, it needs to offer something unique. Nels guitar is a stock Jazzmaster as far as I know. Maybe the pups are upgraded, but I don't know even that.
Kinda business, man.
JodanOrNoDan
Tele-Meister
You said it the best with far less words than me.
Maybe it's my latent Midwestern dry humor, but I read Nels' post as more tongue in cheek than anything else. From what I've heard and read about him, he's a pretty chill guy, but who knows.
By calling it the "Watt" the guitar is clearly and very specifically based on Cline's Jazzmaster. That said, it looks like it's just a one-off and I would assume that anyone with enough cash can have FCS build a replica of their favorite guitarist's axe.
By calling it the "Watt" the guitar is clearly and very specifically based on Cline's Jazzmaster. That said, it looks like it's just a one-off and I would assume that anyone with enough cash can have FCS build a replica of their favorite guitarist's axe.
BorderRadio
Doctor of Teleocity
Old people=old folks=old timers, or at least I thought that's how it works. Let me rephrase that for you: it doesn't matter what old timers think of [Nels Cline]. Is it better for ya now?
The TVL Jazzmaster has a toggle switch for the rhythm circuit select, as opposed to a slide switch. That, and a B&B neck with matched headstock, custom color. Probably the most expensive MIM ever made. The O'Brien Strat has a big ol 10/56 boat neck, custom pickups, and a sustainer feature. That is pretty unique. Nels' "Watt" has the Mastery bridge (what Troy wanted on his), and SD Antiquity pickups. I think 250K pots. Not very unique, but certainly in line with the TVLs stock-ish setup. A Nels Cline JM could be simply a black JM with a nice tortoise shell guard and Antiquities and it would sell very well, but again, just speculation.
OK what business, exactly?
USian Pie
Tele-Holic
Fender put they 12" speaker in a 6g2 and called it a signature amplifier. Nels' guitar is well known among fans of Wilco, and while Cline likely shouldn't go after Fender, it's reasonable that he would want to call them out on it. Fender knew what they were doing.
JuneauMike
Poster Extraordinaire
Uh, the business of selling guitars to people with money in their pocket.Old people=old folks=old timers, or at least I thought that's how it works. Let me rephrase that for you: it doesn't matter what old timers think of [Nels Cline]. Is it better for ya now?
The TVL Jazzmaster has a toggle switch for the rhythm circuit select, as opposed to a slide switch. That, and a B&B neck with matched headstock, custom color. Probably the most expensive MIM ever made. The O'Brien Strat has a big ol 10/56 boat neck, custom pickups, and a sustainer feature. That is pretty unique. Nels' "Watt" has the Mastery bridge (what Troy wanted on his), and SD Antiquity pickups. I think 250K pots. Not very unique, but certainly in line with the TVLs stock-ish setup. A Nels Cline JM could be simply a black JM with a nice tortoise shell guard and Antiquities and it would sell very well, but again, just speculation.
OK what business, exactly?
JuneauMike
Poster Extraordinaire
It's also got Mike Watt's name scrawled in it in a couple of places, years of checking and abuse covering all of the body, some extra screws in the pickguard and a gouge out of the headstock and some stickers on it. I don't know Jazzmasters well, but someone commented on the 60s style logo on the headstock as well. Eh, I don't know.
The example that Fender is selling now looks heavily relic'd but doesn't look like a tribute to any specific guitar in particular.
ElJay370
Friend of Leo's
"I heard it goes for 8 grand. I think you could get a vintage one for less, no?"
This is the operative phrase here. I think Nels' post is more of a dig at Fender's marketing practices in general rather than him being somehow miffed that they might be cashing in on his (albeit limited) notoriety.
And you can absolutely find beat up 60's Jazzmasters for well under 8 grand. Even less if you're willing to overlook things like refets and changed tuners.
This is the operative phrase here. I think Nels' post is more of a dig at Fender's marketing practices in general rather than him being somehow miffed that they might be cashing in on his (albeit limited) notoriety.
And you can absolutely find beat up 60's Jazzmasters for well under 8 grand. Even less if you're willing to overlook things like refets and changed tuners.
