1. Win a Broadcaster or one of 3 Teles! The annual Supporting Member Giveaway is on. To enter Click Here. To see all the prizes and full details Click Here. To view the thread about the giveaway Click Here.

Neck Movement Problem!

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by boneyguy, Dec 1, 2020.

  1. mfguitar

    mfguitar Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Age:
    60
    Posts:
    1,679
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Location:
    Buffalo
    Prior to going with the metal inserts (I like those) you could find the same size wood screw that have a solid shaft. This would reduce the play from the body and the screw. Were proper sized pilot holes drilled in the neck. You could be getting tight before the body is making a solid connection with the neck.
     
  2. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I had considered that but I just can't see the wood at that thickness deflecting...at least not enough to cause this issue...but I ain't no mechanical engineer so it could be happening...
     
    telemnemonics likes this.
  3. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I did the rough up as the very first thing and it made no difference.
     
  4. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    24,481
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    I’m still skeptical about the soft wood affording hard clamping pressure, but is there any chance the screws are bottomed out in the drilled neck holes so they feel tight yet are not clamping tight?
     
    kaludjerko, RogerC and boneyguy like this.
  5. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I'm going to go with the cheapest proposed solution first which is some violin rosin...I like that idea. And if it doesn't work I'll move onto another suggestion. Maybe the combo of rosin and side shims will give me what I want. Cheap and simple is good. I'd rather avoid more drilling into the finished body.
     
  6. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I wondered about that to and I thought I checked it but to be honest I can't remember how accurately I've checked that out with everything that's going through my head. Thanks for the reminder...I'll go do that now.
     
  7. lammie200

    lammie200 Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,826
    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Not rough enough? Try some kind of washer that bites into the surfaces or at least keeps them from sliding against each other. Fiber, brass, neoprene, etc.
     
  8. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    24,481
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Another cheap solution is to slap a neck plate on and see if you can get it tight enough.
    Could be as @Peegoo suggested you got some waxy lubing going on too.

    Seriously though, even alder Fender bodies display crushing of the wood at the corners of the neck plate. Sometimes ash gets a bit crushed but alder more commonly so and the softer the wood the less torque required to crush it.
    The plate you can see crushing at the corners, but here it would be harder to see.
     
  9. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    Well, this is embarrassing!! I thought I checked this out as one of my first solutions. Obviously I didn't look closely enough. Thanks to @telemnemonics for bringing that up. I think the answer is pretty clear from the photo.....!! At least this is a good place to start I would think. Doh!!

    DSCF1284.JPG
     
    John Nicholas and gregulator450 like this.
  10. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    See my last post...I think that's at the heart of the problem...thank you. I didn't want to try the neck plate for fear of marring the finish....
     
  11. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    Off to the drill press....I'll report back later.
     
    telemnemonics likes this.
  12. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    24,481
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Location:
    Maine
    Is that the bit you drilled the neck with?
    You have it shank down not flutes down.
    Are you thinking you did indeed not drill the screw holes in the neck deep enough so the screws bottom out threading into the neck before they clamp really tight to the body?

    I assume that’s where you’re going with it now....
     
  13. peterg

    peterg Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    118
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2013
    Location:
    Toronto
    I'd be worried about drilling and screwing through the fretboard. If you are using a screw with a length meant to be used with a neck plate then you are gaining a few millimeters of travel into the neck by not using a plate.
     
  14. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    13,448
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Is the finish in the pocket super slick and smooth by any chance?
    That body looks like cedar or fir...? Is it too soft to clamp well without a plate?

    You definitely shouldn't need metal threads in the wood of the neck to clamp tight enough if it's a maple neck....
    A little friction in the pocket could help. A sprinkle of Fine sand in the finish? Doesn't matter if the neck has the heel contact or not.

    OH! I just saw your last post! Screws too long! Just cut off 1/8", plenty of length there.

    I like the PNW first nations art theme!
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2020
    boneyguy likes this.
  15. gregulator450

    gregulator450 Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    2,161
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2014
    Location:
    The Dry Side
    I think he marked the neck holes depth with the shank of the drill bit, and it looks like he drilled the holes too shallow. Good call, @telemnemonics
     
    telemnemonics and boneyguy like this.
  16. Peegoo

    Peegoo Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    6,540
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2019
    Location:
    Between the Raindrops
    Years ago I built this guitar

    [​IMG]

    using soft red cedar for the body. I used a full-sized neck plate because I knew the wood was already soft to begin with. Turned out that even with moderate screw clamping pressure, the boy wood was compressing under the load. I remedied the problem by drilling out each screw hole through the body to 3/8" diameter and gluing in four 3/8" diameter spruce dowels, trimmed flush and re-drilled for the screws.

    [​IMG]

    The longitudinal grain of the dowels provided the necessary support between the neck and the neck plate, preventing the cedar from compressing. And the dowels are just the right size to remain concealed beneath the plate.
     
    peteycaster, SbS, RiversQC and 3 others like this.
  17. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I used that small bit to measure the depth of the holes in the neck.
     
    John Nicholas and telemnemonics like this.
  18. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    62
    Posts:
    12,915
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I didn't need to deepen the holes on the neck. I found some same diameter screws, same thread but shorter and it still doesn't work. One of the four smaller screws however won't bite into the neck but the longer version does....so....I guess because the longer one was bottoming out..?? I just can't get ahead with this thing. @$#%&!! This project has been more than a bit of a nightmare from beginning to end for me. Sheesh!

    So, not sure how to proceed from here. I like @Peegoo 's dowel fix but I can't do that now on this guitar. I think I'll get some rosin and fix that one hole that the smaller screw won't bite into and see where I'm at then. And probably try the side shims. If none of that is a 'no go' I'll probably have to move on to the threaded inserts I guess and hope for the best. :confused:

    I sure appreciate everyone's input....thanks guys!
     
    crazydave911 likes this.
  19. thankyouguitar

    thankyouguitar Tele-Meister

    Age:
    39
    Posts:
    234
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2020
    Location:
    Dearborn, MI
    I have threaded inserts in my main guitars and they are amazing. Also means it is so easy to remove the neck for travelling by plane. Could be the ticket, boneyguy. Guitar is beautiful by the way!
     
  20. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    59
    Posts:
    16,064
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Kimberton
    I thought the thread was over after Jakedog's piece of screen idea.
    It works.
    I've also seen used a little thingy that you can bodge up a stripped hole in wood...it's a thin piece of metal with holes punched into it and it looks like a tiny spice grater or a smaller version of the thing you use to rough up a bike tube before patching.
    A repair guy I knew used them whenever a shim was needed because he liked the added non-slip properties.
     
    crazydave911 likes this.
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.