My issue with modern SS amps...

[Trenchant63]

I have analog SS amps (Evans, TM60) and haven’t played tube amps regularly for about 10 years. No reliability issues at all doing worship music weekly at two churches, daily practice and giving lessons. The only thing I’m not doing is cranking them way up on volume but I don’t need to do that in my playing situations. There wasn’t any reason driving me away from tubes, but when my tube amp took a hard fall and stopped working, I switched over to my SS amps and never looked back. They more than cover anything I need. Just like tube amps, you have to pay some more for quality.

 

[TheCheapGuitarist]

Almost every sub $300 tube amp is a "throwaway" amp. And there are 80's Peavey S.S. amps that are still chugging along.

 

[ducati]

Two modern SS amps with high headroom that I’ve played and liked are the aforementioned Orange Super Crush and a Henriksen Bud 10. Both seem to be made very well.

I wanted a SS amp for quick warmup/short sessions, which are hard on tube life. I ended up buying the Orange and it is always out and ready. I’ve enjoyed it.

The Orange is a neat amp—basically an all-discrete SS version of their Rockerverb. There’s a video with the designer where he explains his intent, it’s worth a watch. I haven’t opened it up, but most Orange gear is built decently well, and this one being a tune circuit implemented with SS components, should be just as repairable. As with all Orange amps, there’s a ton of gain on the gain channel, but you don’t have to use it. The clean channel sounds really great to my ears, and gets very loud if you dime the master. Maybe not JC120 loud, but it’s loud. I have the head/cab which I actually only bought bc it’s the version my local GC had New in the box—but I’m kinda glad I got the head, as I’d like to try some different cabs with it. With the Orange cab it sounds very ORANGE (duh), I’d like a little more open sound.

Because that one has a very characterful design goal, I think you’d have to try it to determine if it fit your needs. It’s not modeling a bunch of sounds, it is one sound.

The Henriksen was also great! Absolutely tiny for the massive sound it put out. Super high fidelity, I can see why jazzers like them. I’d say a lot less baked-in character vs the orange. I definitely would like to try one again.

 

[Jakedog]

Almost every sub $300 tube amp is a "throwaway" amp. And there are 80's Peavey S.S. amps that are still chugging along.

More like $600 these days. I mean hell, a Blues Jr. averages $800 and there’s a list as long as my arm of SS amps I’d buy long before I went to a gig with one of those.

 

[Mowgli]

re: size - component selection is limited by power handling, and that's determined by materials and physical dimensions. i don't see analog amps going smaller than 0603 anywhere anytime soon. most use a mix of 0805 and TH.

re: parts - true, it is hard to find some parts, because they are either something really specific (e.g. certain audio ICs), or they just have certain combinations of specs that don't exist on the market anymore, or the type of device is EOL, etc. but you can find workarounds, if the unit is worth something to someone.

re: equipment - working on an analog SS amp is not really any different than working on pedals, analog synths, etc. doesn't require any special equipment, or anything more than community college equivalent knowledge. plenty of people do it at home.

the real issue with SS is that the vast majority of the time it's just not worth it for a customer to spend 200 dollars to fix an amp that's worth 500 or less. as a secondary thing, it's a pain in the ass for a guy who works on tube amps as far as time put in vs customer's expectation of repair cost.

but if an SS amp becomes like a roland tr-808 or juno, then yeah, it's worth everyone's time and money to fix. nobody really bats an eye at a 2-300 dollar repair job on a vintage synth. there are some SS amps that prized and climbing - offhand thinking like a sunn beta lead or something like that - but it's not the norm (and doesn't seem like it will ever be, given what's happening with modeling amps).

Equipment: I am a fan of Robert Pease's book "Troubleshooting Analog Circuits." That being said, the equipment list he recommends, is far more extensive and expensive than most hobbyists wish to afford. Sure his book isn't aimed at the hobbyist per se but still if you are talking about analog SS repair, then the equipment costs Pease mentions adds up. Even tube amp hobbyists who may already have some of that gear may not want to invest more to service their SS gear.

Knowledge: When I was learning electronics back in college in the 70s and, then, early '80s it was mostly BJTs and Op Amps but the JFETS and MOSFETs were coming on strong. It's gotten more complex since I trained. Tube amp technology is challenging enough for most; I never learned it formally; I read old books and stuff online. The complexity of some solid state technology requires tube amp people to invest even more time to learn about things that will require a lot more time and equipment, per above. As such, even finding competent people to work on SS gear can be challenging and expensive (e.g. shipping). In contrast, basic tube amp gear can be fixed and modified at home in most cases with less knowledge needed.

Size: With modern sound reinforcement, stage monitors are being replaced by in ear monitoring and on stage large amps are being replaced by smaller and smaller amps going direct - hearing yourself in the mix per the sound guy. Playing the local bars and restaurants being notable exceptions. Regardless, smaller and smaller appears to be the trajectory of the future so size isn't the issue it used to be --- except for the amps driving the house mains. In other words, the future isn't going to require a lot of power in a lot of SS gear as things continue to be minaturized. This leads to other discussions ranging from "planned obsolescence to the disposable society to the upcoming silicon shortage."

Parts: harvesting parts from similar "dead" amps is the only solution for some amps. I once spoke with a guy in Ohio whose pro shop had a whole storage room of ancient SS gear held just for harvesting the unobtainium parts!

I'm not a pessimist on SS DIY-ism. I just think many hobbyists who have a small house bench and a limited amount of disposable income to devote to a hobby of any sort may not want to invest more time and money in expanding their electronics abilities to cover many more bases.

Tube amps will probably die off in the future but probably not in my lifetime. Given their utility at the present and their ability to be repaired at home I'm betting they will continue to find themselves attractive to many. Especially given the present trajectory of the electronics industry which seems to be chasing that "wanting to build a better (and smaller) mouse trap" mindset driven by MBA-led profit motives.

 

[bobio]

Enjoy

 

[Grodad]

There are a ton of good sounding SS amps out there these days, and thinking about another amp. However, I'm reluctant to drop hundreds of dollars on a good one, as the newer models seem to all be "throw away" models...cheap enough to purchase, but not economical to repair. OTOH, there are tube amps that have been around since the 50s and 60s that just keep on truckin' and sound every bit as killer today as they did when they were built. A component takes a dump, you replace it and rock on!
Of course, you don't get the plethora of sound a SS or modeling amp does, nor features like attenuation and such.
Is there an SS amp that has a great track record on longevity and few maintenance issues, or like everything else today, it's still a crap shoot?

It's 2023. Amps made in the 1950's and 1960's are now 60-70 years old. Do I need an amp to last that long? No, not really. But I don't want landfill.

That being said, my $100 Marshall MG solid state is now nearly 30 years old and my $100 Vox Pathfinder is probably 17 years old. Granted they haven't been gigged but cheap doesn't mean disposable of you look after your stuff.

I've never had a SS amp crape out on me, computers on the other hand.....

 

[Strat Jacket]

That being said, my $100 Marshall MG solid state is now nearly 30 years old and my $100 Vox Pathfinder is probably 17 years old. Granted they haven't been gigged but cheap doesn't mean disposable of you look after your stuff.

Well, the reason I'm looking at another SS amp in the first place is because my SS Fender Deluxe 90 (which also was never gigged and never left the house) took a dump on me after doing little other than being played a couple nights a week and sitting in the corner. Sure, it's probably 20 years old, but not a very good track record in my book. Just don't want to replay the situation again. In this instance, looking after my stuff had nothing to do with it taking a dive.

 

[El Tele Lobo]

Roland JC-120. Largely the same product since 1974.

Enjoy the hernia.

They have several smaller versions available now.

 

[Brent Hutto]

Well, the reason I'm looking at another SS amp in the first place is because my SS Fender Deluxe 90 (which also was never gigged and never left the house) took a dump on me after doing little other than being played a couple nights a week and sitting in the corner. Sure, it's probably 20 years old, but not a very good track record in my book. Just don't want to replay the situation again. In this instance, looking after my stuff had nothing to do with it taking a dive.

There has never been an electronic device made with zero chance of failure over a 20-year period. Never will be. If that's your standard of "good track record", prepare to be disappointed.

 

[naveed211]

Feel like we’re getting a number of threads on the fear of modern SS/modeling amps breaking down or not being reliable. How many people are actually encountering issues with them not being reliable?

As I stated in a similar thread, there are still modeling amps from the 90s going strong today. Does the tech still hold up? Like any computer or something digital from 20-25 years ago, maybe not, but they still function.

I don’t know. I guess I like gear too much to consider much of anything a “forever” piece of gear, I’ll want to try something else eventually. But if any gear can last 20-25 years and not be unreliable, that’s pretty dang great.

You’ll likely spend way more in tubes still over the course of the life of the amp if we’re talking tubes vs. SS/modeling (relative, but still, I had amps from the 60s with original tubes, and I had modern amps that ate tubes constantly).

 

[Strat Jacket]

There has never been an electronic device made with zero chance of failure over a 20-year period. Never will be. If that's your standard of "good track record", prepare to be disappointed.

I guess I already am!

 

[bobio]

There has never been an electronic device made with zero chance of failure over a 20-year period. Never will be. If that's your standard of "good track record", prepare to be disappointed.

To be more accurate, there has never been ANYTHING made with a zero chance of failure over a 20-year period. Never will be.

What is your point?

 

[ChicknPickn]

Some of the old Kustoms are great SS finds.

 

[hdvades]

.

 

[generic202]

Well, the reason I'm looking at another SS amp in the first place is because my SS Fender Deluxe 90 (which also was never gigged and never left the house) took a dump on me after doing little other than being played a couple nights a week and sitting in the corner. Sure, it's probably 20 years old, but not a very good track record in my book. Just don't want to replay the situation again. In this instance, looking after my stuff had nothing to do with it taking a dive.

Have you tried to get the amp repaired? They are probably due for a cap job (being 20yrs and they only last for so long) or at least pots and jacks need cleaning. Even if it's other component failure, they can still get repaired just like tube amps.

You've mentioned on your OP that 50/60s tube amps are still trucking along. Well, that's because most likely they've been repaired and maintained. Probably had at least the caps replaced and drifted resistors replaced, and so on. Your SS amp can still truck along as well. Just get it serviced.

 

[robesmithjr]

Hi All,

I just picked up a used TMDR for $695 on Craigslist. It is a huge step up from the Mustang 2 (original) and actually weighs less (23 pounds as opposed to 26).

I was looking for a tube amp, but need to play at a variety of volume levels. The TMDR allows me to do that.

I am not too worried about the TMDR becoming obsolete, unlike the Mustang, which relied on a Microsoft Silverlight application - Fuse, which Fender discontinued in 2020. Since there is only one model and all functions are accessible with traditional controls, I think it is a relatively safe bet. Amp sounds great (especially clean) takes pedals well. The attenuator and DI are very nice and opens up more uses for the amp.

 

[lammie200]

A lot of modern tube amps are just as difficult to repair as SS amps. Many of the main boards are printed circuit boards and the tube sockets are nearly embedded into them as well as the pots, switches, jacks, etc.

I like the Henriksen amps that I have because they are built well, they are light, and they sound great. Also the customer service is beyond compare. I have traded in older Henriksens for 35% off of new ones. Prices included return shipping and shipping out the new one, as well as a gig bag and no tax. I have heard that they will also give a decent credit for trading in old Polytone amps. Made in CO with Eminence speakers which are also made in the USA. Henriksen will also service their own amps for reasonable prices.

 

[Winky]

There has never been an electronic device made with zero chance of failure over a 20-year period. Never will be. If that's your standard of "good track record", prepare to be disappointed.

Spending money over the years to keep a classic tube amp working great is seen as investment. Spending less than that to repair or replace a SS amp is seen as an egregious waste, simply because the purchase price of the SS amp is lower. I mean, a dollar is a dollar.

 

[Refugee]

Are the new Peavy Bandits built like the old ones? My late 90’s ‘silver-stripe’ is a beast. It’s dropped off of table tops, tailgates and chairs. The only thing to break was the speaker coil came loose.

Great question. Not just the Bandits, but their pa gear is indestructible. From sub zero temps to 100+, drop it down a flight of stairs, plug it in and bam! Works like a charm.