Modern Speakers in a Tweed (59 reissue Ltd) Bassman?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by LKNJ, Oct 8, 2019.

  1. LKNJ

    LKNJ Tele-Meister

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    Has anyone tried more “modern” speakers in a 410 Bassman? I know most people who use these amps try their best to find the most period correct speaker. And I’m sure it’s a rewarding pursuit for the right player. But, to me these older speakers can be somewhat limiting. For example, if you try to use the amp as more of a pedal platform, higher gain stuff just doesn’t sound all that great.

    anyway, as an example, I’m a big fan of the Vintage 30 and by extension, have been very happy with the G10 Vintage speakers I have in a Vibrolux.

    Has anyone tried something off the beaten path in a Bassman and liked it?

    thanks!
     
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  2. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I would not hesitate to play some Eminence ALK1028 speakers in such an amp. Alnico, 30 watts. They will handle the amp’s output and are very good Alnico speakers. Bargains, too.
     
  3. RottenTheCat

    RottenTheCat Tele-Holic

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    Vintage 30s.... 12 inchers wont fit. G10Vintage, Ive got in my 5F4 Super. They do need break in to smooth out....
     
  4. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    If a person insisted on CELESTIONS, I like the G10 English built variant in the Fender Pro Sonics. Modern Chinese G10’s do not sound like older G10’s, ime. Fwiw, the Weber Blue Pup ceramic sounds exactly like the G10’s in the Pro Sonic. I have done the side by side A/B comparison.
     
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  5. LKNJ

    LKNJ Tele-Meister

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    wasn’t suggesting putting V30s into a Bassman, but the G10 Vintage is, according to Celestion, it’s little brother. And they do really sound similar. Love both speakers.

    I don’t know that the G10 Vintage would be a great choice for the Bassman - maybe a little too bass-heavy? actually, might be too heavy, period. You would be adding 8lbs if you swapped out all 4 speakers. It’s an already heavy amp.
     
  6. redchapterjubilee

    redchapterjubilee TDPRI Member

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    I have a weird LTD.

    [​IMG]

    I bought the chassis a few years ago and parked it in a head cabinet. I have a CRex and a Wizard in that 2x12. It breathes fire. I have a good deal more volume than that amp does in a stock cabinet with stock speakers. I really like what the Wizard does to the frequency output of that amp and the CRex helps to balance out the upper mid throw of the Wizard. Is there a comparable 10" speaker to the Wizard? Is a Ramrod more like a Greenback? I know there's hemp 10"ers.

    Anyhow, I've had success with British style speakers in that amp. Might be worth looking into.
     
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  7. dannyh

    dannyh Tele-Afflicted

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    My experience....I bought a used early 90s BMRI several years ago. A previous owner had replaced the stock blue frames with 4 Celestion G10 Vintage 10s. I found them to be rather piercing in that particular amp. Tried them in several other applications as well (since I already had them), never could really warm up to them. Maybe I’m just not a G10 guy...I’ve heard others sound great thru them.

    I went with 1028Ks in my Bassman. I’ve found I actually prefer them to the old blue frames. I love that amp with those speakers.

    YMMV of course. Best of luck.

    Edit-just remembered one other thing I should note, my amp had three g10s in it when I bought it. The top right speaker was still an Emi Alnico. Apparently a G10 wouldn’t fit behind the PT. Something to consider.
     
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  8. RottenTheCat

    RottenTheCat Tele-Holic

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    I find the g10 vintage sound good but they are bass-heavy and as such I can't use as much Bass or as much volume. that alters The Break-Up characteristics inherent in the amp a bit.
     
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  9. caspersvapors

    caspersvapors Tele-Meister

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    How do the 1028s compare to the blue frames?
     
  10. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    The blue frames are 20 watt ALP speakers with paper formers...more akin to the original P10R which was not enough for the Bassman, imho. fender went to P10Q 1960 for the 5F6A and probably should have gone to P10N...in 1957 when it came out. The original P10R was a 10 watt speaker, iirc. The Q was 12, and the N might have been 18-20 watts. the ALK is a 30 watt speaker with a Kapton former.
    If I had a low wattage amp I might like the ALP. As it is, the ALK at 30 watts gives one the ability to deal with pushed power...with good low end, clear sparkling high end, and smooth overdrive. They handle BF mid scoop well. They handle midrange well, and they deal with high gain well. I have owned Tweed Fenders with original Jensen’s, and I have owned tweeds in which Inhad to install speakers. In particular, two ‘59 Bandmasters were a good comparison. One had original Jensens while the other had a repro cab and ALK’s in it. Both circuits were serviced in the same manner, and the two amps acted very much alike. Being a ‘59, the one with original speakers had P10Qs.the earlier ones had P10R’s.
     
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  11. dannyh

    dannyh Tele-Afflicted

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    These things are always subjective, but to my ears the 1028Ks are smoother, a little warmer but still with plenty of top end, and sound better pushed. Not a ton of difference between the P’s and K’s, but enough for me. I like the blue frames, don’t get me wrong, but the 1028Ks have just become my favorite 10’s.
     
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  12. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    I gig a Bassman and if I were looking for new speakers, I'd be looking at neodymium.
     
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  13. Ringo

    Ringo Poster Extraordinaire

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    Not about new speakers but a good friend of mine has an original Tweed Bassman (not sure exactly what model) and it has 4 vintage 10" JBLs in the amp, he gigged with it a lot in the late 60s and early 70s, it sounds great.
     
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  14. caspersvapors

    caspersvapors Tele-Meister

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    Good to know. I had a pair of the blue frames at one point. I liked one alone in a Princeton, but paired up in a Vibrolux they were too bright and thin. Mine were also shrill and ratty pushes. But Ive always been interested in the 1028k, I think the dust cap is different material than the blue frame, so I am not surprised it sounds smoother overall.
     
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  15. LKNJ

    LKNJ Tele-Meister

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    just because of the weight reduction?
     
  16. LKNJ

    LKNJ Tele-Meister

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    yes, shape of the G10 Vintage’s frame makes it difficult to fit in certain spots. Had to really work at it to get to fit under the transformer cage of my Vibrolux.
     
  17. H. Mac

    H. Mac Friend of Leo's

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    Agreed. I’ve used Emi 1028s in a 5F4 Super clone, and in a cab powered by a 5F1 Champ, and a 5E3. They are excellent - clear, well-balanced, and don’t get overly boomy. A very impressive speaker.
     
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  18. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    Yup.
     
  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I bought a Super Champ that had a modern made in China 80th Anniv. G10 in it. It was unusable imho in that amp...bright and harsh. I traded for a MusicMan 410HD130 just to get the three EVI Force speakers that were in it. There was also a modern made in China G10 innit...same story...bright, harsh. At that time I had a Silvertone 6x10 cab sitting around into which someone had put some older English G10’s, and I had my Pro Sonic with the ‘custom’ G10s in it. Those English G10 speakers do not sound anything like the Chinese G10s I have heard. I like the older English G10 speaker. we all have our own ears, but there is no doubt in my mind that theEnglish G10’s are different from the Chinese....I have heard the difference side by side. Ime, the best thing about Chinese Celestions is that one has no trouble selling a speaker with that label on it. Chinese V30s are harsh and raspy when pushed ime. In the late ‘90’s or very early 2000’s I bought. Johnson 150 watt speaker out of curiosity...it cost me $19 wholesale. It was a very good speaker with full range response and no harshness when pushed. Imho, that is what a Chinese made speaker should cost...maybe $50 retail...and any speaker needs to lack that raspy edge when pushed. Ommv.
     
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  20. Axis29

    Axis29 Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    I have a Bassman Ri that I added two 1028ALK's to the existing Jensens. It's a nice mix. Still bright, but not as... and it seems to have gotten rid of the flub as well.

    I also have a '58 Twin, the same circuit, with bigger iron and four power tubes. I run it with a Celestion Creamback Neo and a Jensen 12-100. I love this mix. I love what the Celestion brings... I really love the reduction in weight! I have waxed poetic about this amp for a while now... let's just say that I love it and I love this speaker combo! But, I dunno that I'd call these speakers modern voiced, either. It does still sound just like a tweed amp.

    Fender recently released a couple of editions of the Joe Bonamassa HPTT, and used Celestions. Still sounds like a tweed amp. JB uses Celestions... I think Keef Richards does too?
     
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