Marshall versions of Fender

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by Little Ricky, Jun 12, 2021.

  1. Little Ricky

    Little Ricky Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

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    If the first Marshall was 5F6A inspired, what other Marshall amps came out of the narrow panel era?
    I think someone said in another thread that the 1974 was very close to a 5G9, even though Watkins Doninator is the usually claimed source for that one.
    Any others of the smaller Fenders receive the Marshall treatment, even if not by Marshall themselves?
    I mean using the Fender circuit but running it through closed cab, with the usual Marshall circuit tweaks, as seen in the JTM vs 59.
     
  2. hamerfan

    hamerfan Tele-Meister

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    Last edited: Jun 14, 2021
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  3. gridlock

    gridlock Poster Extraordinaire

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    My early 1973 handwired Marshall Artiste. Another Marshall attempt at Fender type tones. Real Spring Reverb, 2x12 Greenbacks, and what I’ve read, more of a Fender circuit. It sounded okay, but not as good as a vintage Fender or standard Marshall.

    I planned to send it off to have it converted to a Plexi but it was too nice to mod. Sold it for a JMP which is now also gone.

    70D3891D-37DB-4E7A-B3FB-E2BA3E341D8E.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2021
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  4. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    That Marshall Artiste is a hybrid amp with a solid state preamp topography….maybe more like a Music Man?????
     
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  5. gridlock

    gridlock Poster Extraordinaire

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    Wally, you are mistaken this time. You are referring an ‘80’s Marshall Artist model 4203.

    My amp ‘70’s “Artiste” (model 2040) and not an ‘80’s “Artist” without the “e” at the end of the name.

    Two very different model amps and from two different decades. The Artiste (my amp) was supposedly designed to complete with Fender amps.

    See the attachment below, describing my the same model 2040 amp, however mine had no mods. Hand-wired, all tube, no hybrid amp, and no Solid State components.

    AE6EDA16-24D2-42E5-B188-34B2C378F2AD.png
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2021
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  6. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Gridlock, I stand corrected. I went to EL34 World Schematics and jumped on the only schematic with the letters Artist in it…the JCM 800 hybrid. I just found the schematic for your amp…the ‘Artiste’ at Schematic Heaven, which is where I usually go first. Sure enough, it is quite different from other Marshall’s of its time. One channel is a direct take on the BF preamp. The other channel has what appears to this untrained eye to be a Baxandall type of tone stack, which I find interesting sometimes


    Note to all…my post #4 is an error, but I cannot edit it. I should have read gridlock’s post more carefully since he gave us the time and model of his amp.
     
  7. gridlock

    gridlock Poster Extraordinaire

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    Wally, I think that was the first time that I ever stumped you on an amplifier description. You are allowed a hall pass this one time.

    I came close to having this amp sent to Voodoo Amps and have it modded to a Plexi. It would have been pretty cool amp since it already looks like a Bluesbreaker.

    A decent sounding amp as is, that could still get Marshall tone with a good OD pedal.
     
  8. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Gridlock, I have never been around one of those amps…kind of rare. What happens with the sweep of the treble pot in that ‘simple’ channel?
     
  9. PCollen

    PCollen Friend of Leo's

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    There are several early Marshalls that were direct derivatives of the JTM45, just having minor component value or circuit topology changes (such as the split cathodes).
     
  10. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    imho, the BASIC topography of the 5F6A/JTM 45 is maintained well into the JCM 800 amps. Yes, they did split the cathodes at the input stage to get a brighter signal path if 2anted, but the topography is still there…two gain stage followed by a cathode follower driving the tone stack. This is the topography that was followed and adapted by Soldano…who was then copied by Mesa, Peavey, etc….when he built those amps with five stages prior to the tone stack.
     
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  11. PCollen

    PCollen Friend of Leo's

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    I think one would have to define the fine line that would be considered to be a major deviation. Not sure if the addition of a MV or effects loop would qualify. Maybe at the JCM900's with the solid state components and relay switching...I don't know. Never really gave it any thought before.
     
  12. TwangToInfinity

    TwangToInfinity Tele-Afflicted

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  13. gridlock

    gridlock Poster Extraordinaire

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  14. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    That Club and Country is a different animal from either a Fender or it’s contemporary ‘large’ Marshalls in that it has two gain stages prior to the tone stack without a cathode follower buffering the signal. There is a third gain stage that follows the reverb in that channel.The schematic shows the non-verb channel going through that third gain stage, too, which would make it hotter than the reverb channel IF that reverb eats gains as it does in a Fender amp.
     
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