Marshall Origin 50 or 20?

[Rufus]

Jakedog had a very timely recent thread, his "Incoming NAD", that I was very glad to read. Great review from a self professed "Marshall Guy".

I currently have a 1971 SF Super Reverb *(with the Normal channel Tweed-ified by TDPRI's own Wally ) and a late 50's Tweed Champ, so I have the blackface and tweed sounds covered. I have wanted an early Marshall sounding amp at a reasonable price to fill that middle void not covered by tweed or blackface.

I have been interested in the Origin amps but have held off...not knowing if they really will produce an early Marshall sound. With recommendations from real Marshall players, it sounds like they will at that reasonable pricepoint.

I am intending on purchasing the head version of this amp. I play at home, not professionally and I know the 50 watt will be very LOUD (but so will the 20, really. Hell, my 5W Champ can sometimes be very loud!). I have no problem playing the 45 watt Super Reverb at home...AND I have a great Weber MASS attenuator for when I want to lower the volume. I also have a small Blackstar Core ID for when I want to play at whisper volumes. (I have tried the 100 Watt Fender Mustang and Boss Katana amps, but I don't seem to get anything more than mediocre tones, unlike my vintage tube amps.)

I feel like the 50 watt version will be more useful since it has the ability to select 50/10/5 watts vs the 20/3/0.5 watts of the Origin 20. Either version will be LOUD at 50 or 20 watts, respectively.

Any thoughts on my reasoning?

I have 4x10" alnico CTS speakers in my Super Reverb and the Champ has the original 8".
I was thinking of building a 2x10" extension cab for the Champ...but now thinking about the Marshall amp.

Marshalls traditionally use 12", but I was wondering if/what 10" speakers would give me a decent Marshall tone? Celestion Greenback 10"? Webers?

Or should I stick to 1x12 or 2x12?"?

I have the cash to pay for the Origin, but at $14 a month for 36 months from Sweetwater, its almost silly not to use that. Some people pay more than that per week for 3 cups of coffee.

Thanks in advance for any advice...I can take it!

 

[RodeoTex]

I have the 20 head. I was very tempted to buy the 50, but for 3 reasons I didn't:
1) I'm a home player too, and I don't need it.
2) I didn't have a 50 watt cab.
3) the only attenuator knob amps I've ever used lose their character when choked down. (I could be very wrong, just might experience)

Jakedog earned my respect about amps with his thread about hating all amps.

I love my 20 BTW.

 

[Jakedog]

I believe... I could be wrong... I’ll have to look...

That at its lowest setting the 50 watter also attenuates to .5 watt, not 5 watts...

I think for a home player the 20 would be plenty. But if you don’t mind loud amps at home by all means go for the 50. Why not? Not everyone who plays at home needs to be quiet. If you can open up a full stack in your living room without bothering anybody, it would kind of be a shame not to.

 

[ReverendRevolver]

If your neighbors dont call the cops with the volume past 3, it's not a Marshall.


I've been tempted by the 20. It's not typical Marshall sound, it's a different type circuit with el34s. Tilt knobs neat.

The 50 just doesn't seem necessary to me. I already have an amp with more oomph than I need if I dial it that way, and I'm at a point in life where when I return to gigging, medium sized rooms are the better gigs around here.
Having said that, the low power on the 50 is comparable to the mid on the 20 in theory.

 

[Rufus]

I realize that coming to this website looking to be talked out of a purchase is like a meth-head going to a crackhouse for an AA meeting.

I was thinking that even if I didn't crank the 50, I may end up getting more use out of the 10 and 5 watt settings on the Origin50 than the 3 and 0.5 watt settings on the Origin 20.

I have had good success with my Weber MASS attenuator but I sometimes turn my SR up to "6" at home with no attenuation. Its pretty loud but tolerable...WHAT!?!?!

Since Guitar Center has reopened, I might see if the local stores have any in stock and go compare them.

 

[Jakedog]

If your neighbors dont call the cops with the volume past 3, it's not a Marshall.


I've been tempted by the 20. It's not typical Marshall sound, it's a different type circuit with el34s. Tilt knobs neat.

The 50 just doesn't seem necessary to me. I already have an amp with more oomph than I need if I dial it that way, and I'm at a point in life where when I return to gigging, medium sized rooms are the better gigs around here.
Having said that, the low power on the 50 is comparable to the mid on the 20 in theory.

I’m confused by this post...

I’d say it’s a very typical Marshall sound.

Not like anything from the 800 era forward. But from the JMP era backward there’s a whole lot of Marshall you can get out of these amps. I think the thing they’re most like are the 60’s JTM amps. They’re not a 60’s JTM, but that’s what they’re most like.

I’ve owned a lot of Marshalls. All but one ran on EL34 power tubes...

 

[Mad Kiwi]

Ive commented many times here on my Origin 20 combo. So apologies if it is doubling up, however it seems appropriate to the OP's questions.

Last night my Fender 68 PRRI arrived. I spent 8.00pm till 11.30pm and 1 hour pre work playing it and my Origin 20.

Aside from the Princeton, it TOTALLY reinforced how awesome the Origin 20 is. The 5 watt mode is perfect for home. I was playing it with gain maxed and boosted (pulled out) with volume on 3-4 with my 4 1/2 year old daughter sound alseep 2 bedrooms away down the hall. Admittedly she is a sound sleeper and my wife over the years has gotten tolerant of it.

10 Watts is great for when they are in the lounge with the hall door closed and 20w pretty damn loud, easily giggable I would think.

I also pondered the 10" speaker deal. I found at moderate talking over the amp levels, maybe 2 with gain at full, the bass response was a bit light but at 3-4+ volume the bass comes in perfectly. Same as the Princeton so I think that might be a physics thing. (Fletcher Munson or whatever...)

I have never played the 50 but I can say I am very pleased with the 20.

For reference I gig an Ac30 CCH with 1x12 and 2x12, a Crate Vintage 50 etc.

I find the Origin 20 power scaling to be the best I have used, the tone change is minimal if at all (physics aside) and as such tend to use it more than my vox Ac4-12 or Fender Pro Junior.

 

[Rufus]

Ive commented many times here on my Origin 20 combo. So apologies if it is doubling up, however it seems appropriate to the OP's questions.

Last night my Fender 68 PRRI arrived. I spent 8.00pm till 11.30pm and 1 hour pre work playing it and my Origin 20.

Aside from the Princeton, it TOTALLY reinforced how awesome the Origin 20 is. The 5 watt mode is perfect for home. I was playing it with gain maxed and boosted (pulled out) with volume on 3-4 with my 4 1/2 year old daughter sound alseep 2 bedrooms away down the hall. Admittedly she is a sound sleeper and my wife over the years has gotten tolerant of it.

10 Watts is great for when they are in the lounge with the hall door closed and 20w pretty damn loud, easily giggable I would think.

I also pondered the 10" speaker deal. I found at moderate talking over the amp levels, maybe 2 with gain at full, the bass response was a bit light but at 3-4+ volume the bass comes in perfectly. Same as the Princeton so I think that might be a physics thing. (Fletcher Munson or whatever...)

I have never played the 50 but I can say I am very pleased with the 20.

For reference I gig an Ac30 CCH with 1x12 and 2x12, a Crate Vintage 50 etc.

I find the Origin 20 power scaling to be the best I have used, the tone change is minimal if at all (physics aside) and as such tend to use it more than my vox Ac4-12 or Fender Pro Junior.

Thanks for the response.
I'm a bit confused, though...the websites list the Origin 20 at a switchable 20/3/0.5 amps, with the Origin 50 having 50/10/5 amps.
Did you mean the 3 watt and 0.5 watt settings, when you wrote 5 watts and 10 watts? Or are the websites incorrect?
What does your amp literature actually say?

 

[Rufus]

Just to confuse the issue...the Marshall Studio Vintage 20 looks and sounds very interesting.
Okay, so its 2 1/2 times the price of an Origin...but gets rave reviews as a smaller 20/5 watt that does the Plexi thing in spades...clean as well as crunch

It would be nice to play these and compare but I'm betting my local Guitar Center(s) won't have them in stock.
Gonna have to make a couple of phone calls

 

[PoorNoodle]

If you’re on a budget I would go for the Origin. If not I would go for the SV20h at about twice the price. The Origin is similar to a Plexi. The SV20H IS a Plexi.

Regarding speakers and cabs. Greenbacks are probably the way to go for Marshall growl. Creambacks are also good. I would go either 2x10 or 1x12. Or 4x12!

I have a Marshall SV20h and couldn’t be happier. It needs an attenuator though to rock, since no master volume. If you need a master volume I would suggest the SC20H instead.

 

[Mad Kiwi]

Thanks for the response.
I'm a bit confused, though...the websites list the Origin 20 at a switchable 20/3/0.5 amps, with the Origin 50 having 50/10/5 amps.
Did you mean the 3 watt and 0.5 watt settings, when you wrote 5 watts and 10 watts? Or are the websites incorrect?
What does your amp literature actually say?

That could be my mistake, I always thought it was 5/10/20. But the switch says low/mid/high.

 

[Dacious]

I'd second the SV20 if money is no option and you aren't Johann Segeborg with your own factory and industrial hearing protection. It appears to behave exactly like a real Plexi in terms of controls minus the last 20db of a Jumbo taking off they have.

The Origin sounds fine on sample videos I've seen. It sounds a bit spongier than a JTM. The boost is handy - but that's not Plexi.

I'd agree that for new speakers G12 or don't forget G10 Greenbacks which came with small quads intended for 50 watt smallbox heads are great. There's obviously Eminence, Warehouse etc alternatives - but a real 112 or 210 would be cool

 

[El Marin]

I went your same thoughts... but I got the 50

I have two, head and combo. Different bands in different towns. I prefer the head as I paired it with a 2x12". Combo is perfect too, but I prefer 2x12". Combo is really Light due the neo speaker. I prefer combo for a gigging trio and head+2x12 for a two guitars band. But that is just my opinion and taste

I gig so I preferred the ability of having 50W. Many places I cannot mic the amp... rustic places I could say... Most of the time, and ALL rehears I play it at 10W setting. I tested the 50 and the 20 in a shop and the 50's 10W is almost the 20 at full power.

Tone wise, is more a JTM45. The sound is like an angry Bassman 59. I had a Bassman 59 LTD when I bought it. But with an useful Master

At home I play a THR10, I live in a flat and cannot make a lot of loud noise... sorry, music

If you don't gig, get the 20 head and a Marshall 1922. You just have to move the head feet. Teh 20 is enough and it goes lower than the 50, more home friendly. If you start gigging, is capable to do it if you don't want cristal cleans, but who gets a Marshall for that duty?

 

[Rufus]

Great thoughts everyone...thanks.
I could swing the $$ for the SV20, but don't want overkill...
and I always say my equipment is better than my skills.
But I DO love to play, so at age 60, I might as well get what I want NOW, rather than waiting.

I'm sitting here, switching between this site and the Marshall Forum.
There's a 169 page thread on the SV20!
Also excellent threads on the Origin 20 and Origin 50.

I also watched a few YT videos...Robin Trower apparently loved the SV20, though I'm not RT.
Heard a guy get damn good SRV tones out of the SV20 with a Strat.

I'm playing thru my Super Reverb with volume on 6, but with my Weber attenuator bringing it down to a level that lets my wife sleep.
I don't get any breakup, but I get the ...I don't know..."sweetness and subtlety" of the tubes. I plug in a Boss Katana and it sounds very sterile. Maybe its my lack of skill in dialing in a digital amp.
I really like the simplicity of the tube stuff, direct to amp or with a few pedals...even MY playing sounds decent.

Whatever I decide on, I'm sure I will enjoy it.
When I decide, I will let you know.
Until then keep the input coming...

 

[LoveHz]

If in doubt go for the big one.

 

[Shango66]

I second @PoorNoodle
The origins were on my radar for the Marshall vibe.
Very happy I shelled out for the SV20.

 

[Axis29]

So, I am also an Origin 20 owner (of the combo). I have used it at home and gigged it with great success.

I love my Origin amp... I bought mine originally because I wanted an amp to take with me on a road trip across the Country. I liked the whole silent D/I Out with cab sim. This is a he-uuuuuge bump up over the SV20 amp. The power scaling is another big feature for me. I like being able to get a nice grungy greasy overdrive at reasonable volumes.

The other difference is the JTM vs. Plexi thing. I am a JTM fan. I play Blues, not Rock. I've always loved the Plexi tones, but when we get into the 800 stuff, it's a bit too much for my playing style (I still love it when others can do it well, though... It's just not my thing). Realistically, I like the spongier, softer JMT tones of the Origin, over the plexi stuff. If I wanted a lower wattage Plexi, I'd be all over a Dirty Shirley. I almost bought when, then Marshall came out with the more affordable (another great feature) Origins and I couldn't wait to try them. I was not disappointed.

I love my 20 so much, when gigging starts happening again, I may pick up a 50 Head... Maybe. The difference I heard between the two was the typical difference between 20 and 50 watt amps, a bit more bass presence... But, it wasn't like night and day! It's a subtle difference.

If you want Plexi tones, go with the Studio Vintage series. But, if you want a little 'older' sound, grab an Origin. Worth every penny.


As far as speakers, the 10" Greenbacks get great reviews, the 10" Creambacks are well received as well. I've actually been really impressed with the stock speaker. So much so, I've owned the amp for almost two years and haven't changed it yet. Heck, the only thing I've done to the amp was have the speaker out repair done by a registered Marshall Service Center, and played the snot out of it. Although, I have contemplated doing a new cabinet, out of pine, or something lighter and styling it after the Bluesbreaker amps, maybe doing a 1x12 with a Creamback (I have a CB65 sitting in a box waiting for another amp).

 

[teletail]

Not to hijack the thread, but I was set to buy the Origin 20 until I saw the Marshall 1974X. Any opinions on how that fits into the mix? Thanks.

 

[archetype]

I realize that coming to this website looking to be talked out of a purchase is like a meth-head going to a crackhouse for an AA meeting.

I was thinking that even if I didn't crank the 50, I may end up getting more use out of the 10 and 5 watt settings on the Origin50 than the 3 and 0.5 watt settings on the Origin 20.

I have had good success with my Weber MASS attenuator but I sometimes turn my SR up to "6" at home with no attenuation. Its pretty loud but tolerable...WHAT!?!?!

Since Guitar Center has reopened, I might see if the local stores have any in stock and go compare them.

I'd bet there's no audible difference between 3 and 5 Watts unless the two circuits are different in how they achieve the power reduction.

 

[KC]

I've had the 20 combo for a while, swapped out the speaker for a Greenback 10 which seemed to stiffen up the bass response. Great little amp, sounds very good at the middle & full power settings. The low power setting changes the feel of the amp, still usable for next-to-the-TV work but to my ear a lot nicer at higher settings. This is plenty of amp for home, rehearsal, small to medium gigs, depending on your style of music & how much of a maniac your drummer is.

Last summer I did find myself running out of amp on a couple of big stages / outdoor shows. When the 50c combo turned up for under $500 new / b-stock I grabbed one. It's a great amp, stock speaker and all, but loud, even on the middle setting. The 20 is more versatile if you don't need the volume -- but I really like the 50, too.