Marriage worries...

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by NateD81, Feb 20, 2020.

  1. Mike Eskimo

    Mike Eskimo Telefied Ad Free Member

    Nov 9, 2008

    Yep. The he-man woman-haters club is active and strong on this forum.

    Basically a bunch of guys that didn’t see it coming/didn’t know how to handle their business during their divorces.

    Bitterness/hate has many fathers but one of the strongest is shame/embarrassment...o_O
  2. Fiesta Red

    Fiesta Red Friend of Leo's

    Nov 15, 2010
    This April we’ll be married 27 years.

    We’ve gone through everything except infidelity. I told her from Day One that that’s the one thing I wouldn’t tolerate from either of us—otherwise, we’d work it out...and we have had to work through a lot.

    We’ve had cultural differences (she’s of Mexican descent, I’m a mutt), financial difficulties, loss of friends and family to death, loss of friends and family to disloyalty, my issues with drink, our difficulties in conceiving, miscarriages, challenges of raising a child (who’s wonderful and 18), health crises for both of us (plural), communication difficulties...the list goes on.

    The two biggest things I can say that help us are this:

    #1–Drop your pride and be willing to work a 99/99 relationship.
    Marriage is not 50/50–it’s 99/99, because you have to be willing to “give” 99% on something you don’t like or agree with...not 99% on everything, but on a subject that could turn into a “deal-breaker” for one of the other mate.
    For example, I cannot stand one of her cousins, who’s very good at forcing her way into our “business.” Because my wife is Mexican, la familia is very important. For years, my wife could not stand up to her, and it put a wedge between us. I was willing to put up with the bruja to have my wife in my life (there’s that 99%) until the bruja started recommending that my wife and I separate and/or divorce (due to some difficulties my wife and I were having, some of which were started/amplified by the bruja herself!)...and that’s where the 1% came in.
    I hit the problem head-on. I told my wife’s family (the cousin, the parents of the cousin and others) that no one in the family would have no access to my wife or our daughter unless the behavior of the bruja changed. She was not welcome in our home unless I expressly invited her; if she continued to force her way into our life, none of them would be welcome in our home. I put down several other restrictions, and after I iced them out of several events/situations—lo and behold—her behavior changed.

    #2–LISTEN TO HER AND GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THE PROBLEM; the initial “issue” she’s having with the relationship may not be the actual problem.
    Early in our marriage, my wife would push me away emotionally and speak like our marriage would probably/possibly fail. It hurt me—it angered me! I was committed...but as I listened I eventually realized The issue wasn't that she didn’t love me or that she didn’t want the relationship to work—it was my wife’s abandonment issues.

    Due to her tumultuous childhood, she’d gotten in the habit of leaving people before they left her.

    Her mother died giving birth to her; her mom’s husband (my wife’s sperm donor) gave her and her two older brothers to her grandparents to raise; her grandparents started raising her as if she were their daughter; when my wife was 6, her grandmother had a massive stroke and lost the ability to communicate, and that same month she found out the truth about her mom and sperm donor; her aunt and uncle started “helping out” with my wife, but they were more concerned with their drug-addicted in-and-out-of-prison son and drug-abusing, manipulative daughter (the bruja mentioned above), so they pushed her into the corner and treated her like a task to be completed than a child...she was pushed aside and left alone constantly.

    When I finally figured out it wasn’t me, it was her fear of losing what we had (relationship-wise) that made her push me away, I (again) had to whip out that 99%...I had to repeatedly and regularly reassure her that I love her and would not leave her in any way...I still have to do this, even though I didn’t/don’t feel it was a necessary thing (I’m a typical male in some ways).

    ...and, because she is now more assured that we’re going to last and I’m not going anywhere, she now pushes her family into second place to our relationship (were it should have been all along).

    So talk to your wife and ask why she thinks the relationship isn’t working. The first thing she says is important (“We’re not communicating”, “We have intimacy issues”, “I’m depressed”, “You don’t do _____”)—you can work on those things immediately...but as you continue to communicate, there may be a larger baseline issue that needs to be addressed.
  3. Ironwolf

    Ironwolf Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

    Mar 11, 2008
    Boise, Idaho
    She has met a new guy at work. To be expected.
  4. TelenTubes

    TelenTubes Tele-Holic

    Oct 17, 2018
    Waco, Texas
    There definitely has been some bad advice here. Sure, I'd be worried about infidelity when a girlfriend or spouse says they have doubts. Keep an eye open for that, and I hate to even say that. However...

    1) From a practical standpoint, going out and finding another woman "on the side" is a good way to end up with alimony on top of child support. Not all states are alimony states, but it looks like you're in CA, so, yeah, don't do that. Besides, if you two would have otherwise been able to resolve her doubts, having a fling is throwing gasoline on the house fire.

    2) Playing the pickup artist games with your wife seems silly, too. If you have to play games and be someone you're not, what's the point?

    3) Giving up immediately and running is a poor choice, too. At the end of this rough patch, you want to be able to say that you made a Herculean effort to make it work. And if it does work, then success! If it doesn't, then you can know that you gave it all the effort you could. I tried 1,000 things in my marriage, and none of them worked for more than about 5 minutes, but I learned a lot about women trying to figure that crazy one out. And now that I'm back dating, I'm a much better date now than I was a decade ago for it.

    DO go on date nights and go have fun together... regularly. Date your wife.
    Stay cool and collected best you can when having discussions.
    Listen and think before you speak.
    Counseling is a good option, too, if she's open to going (yep, tried that, too - doesn't work if you're the only one that goes).

    Only you can talk to her and figure out what's bugging her. The five love languages were definitely something worth learning about for me, so I recommend that, too. There are enough blog posts written about it you don't have to buy the book to get the concept. Figure out what makes her feel appreciated and do more of that.

    Hopefully your efforts pay off and it works out. Keep us posted.
    8barlouie likes this.
  5. Northern Tele

    Northern Tele Tele-Meister

    Oct 10, 2016
    We just celebrated 17yrs together, definitely some tough times but you work through them. The problem these days is that people think it will be so easy,well that is not reality. Marriage is permanent, when you say those vows, you better mean them. For better for worse etc.

    Boredom is not a valid reason to split up. The fact that you guys have a kid is all the more reason to not split up. I think you need to have a serious no holds barred discussion,tell her why you want to stay together, the devastating effects of divorce on kids is no small thing. The fact that no infidelity has taken place...If you are church goers see the Pastor if not, seek marriage counselling.

    With all that said,with regret, you need to look into what her leaving could cost you financially. You could end up supporting her for a very long time. Most time the courts favour the wife. If it looks like she is going to bail you should consult a lawyer.
    8barlouie likes this.
  6. Charlie Bernstein

    Charlie Bernstein Poster Extraordinaire

    Apr 26, 2003
    Augusta, Maine
    Good advice.
  7. Charlie Bernstein

    Charlie Bernstein Poster Extraordinaire

    Apr 26, 2003
    Augusta, Maine
    That was my thought, too.
  8. Charlie Bernstein

    Charlie Bernstein Poster Extraordinaire

    Apr 26, 2003
    Augusta, Maine
    Fair points, but pessimistic. On a crowded planet there's always someone in the wings. That's not the point. The point is that it sounds like they both want to work it out.

    We know she does because she brought it up with him. We know he does because he brought it up with us.

    Now they can get together to work on it.

    (And remember: An iPhone is a good example of planned obsolescence. A marriage is not.)
    EsquireBoy, stevemc and DarkKnight37 like this.
  9. Steerforth

    Steerforth Tele-Afflicted

    May 17, 2009
    I’m retired military, and didn’t retire voluntarily. I was informed that I’d be retiring after being disabled in the line of duty. I’ve lived on or visited six out of seven continents. I tried to get to Antarctica, but there were no billets for someone in my area of expertise. I’ve been married three times.

    All that being established, forgive me if what I have to say seems a bit less than warm and wonderful.

    If this kind of talk is in the air, there is a high probability that it’s already over and she thinks she’s letting you down easy. So prep your mind. Start planning to protect your own interests, or you’ll get taken to the cleaners in court.

    Also, you need to emotionally prepare. I’d suggest changing your point of view on this, right now. If somebody leaves you, what have you lost? You’ve lost somebody who would leave you. And that’s not a loss. That’s being released from a life sentence.

    After my second divorce, I wrote off marriage. I was happy all by myself. I had no intention of ever marrying again. And then one day I met a beautiful young redhead from another country. She had done both photographic and runway modeling. She was in her twenties and I was in my forties. She took one look at me, and for reasons that I can’t fathom to this day, that was it for her. And that was it for me, too. She was gorgeous, with an accent that was like music to my ears. I couldn’t believe what was happening, but it happened.

    We’ve been married for twenty-some years now. She’s still crazy about me and spends every moment that she can with me. She went on to become a medical professional, and makes a lot more money than me. I did well in the military and they pay me very nicely myself. But she still makes more than me. If she thinks that I want something, it will turn up without me seeking it, presented by her with a big smile and plenty of excitement.

    I’m a bit busted up after the crazy life that I’ve led, lots of old injuries, wake up stiff and sore, but madame fusses over me like a mother hen, and I’m well looked after. She’s somewhat high strung and tends to see everything as a crisis of one degree or another. I’m calm, and don’t get too worked up about anything. We compliment one another. We laugh a lot and she takes great delight in explaining to me why all things French are superior. After twenty plus years, I’m starting to believe her. And she’s still the most beautiful woman that I’ve ever seen. We’ve had a great time, and still love each other’s company.

    The point here is, if your marriage ends, it’s not the end of the world. There’s probably something great waiting for you up ahead. So don’t get too distraught and waste a lot of time grieving about it. C’est la vie. Such is life.

    If things go bad, try to work out an amicable settlement, and then get on with your life. Don’t volunteer anything. Come out of it as clean as you can. But be prepared. You’re probably going to pay more than you’d like.

    But life goes on. You’re the one with boots on the ground. You’re the on scene commander. I can talk to you over the radio until we’re both blue in the face, but you’re there, and you have to call the shots. Ultimately, you have to decide whether it’s worth trying to salvage things.

    But in my own experience, once that kind of talk starts, it’s over. Don’t waste another year or two while she makes up her mind and maneuvers to take the high ground. You make up your mind, and do not grieve about losing someone who sprung this ambush on you. Control the situation, make up your mind, and if it’s over get on with your life. You’re in charge of your life, not her.

    Women are like buses. If you miss one, there’ll be another one along in ten minutes or so. The world will keep turning, and you’ll be fine, however it goes. I wish you well, and plenty of happiness in life, even if you have to travel some rough roads to get there.
  10. beagle

    beagle Friend of Leo's

    Jul 20, 2010
    Just two pieces of advice from me.

    Remember, that despite what you may read here, women are people too.

    If you want to have a good marriage, don't discuss it on internet forums.
    EJG1, P Thought, 68tele and 3 others like this.
  11. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Mar 17, 2003
    Nate...I think the lackluster relationship is rampant. Mine was that way after maybe 6 or 7 years and continued for another 15.
    I began to view our life as something of a business...raising the kids, making sure we took vacations, taking care of the house, etc...and the wife was more of a business partner than anything.
    It was pretty damn glum, but divorce is just so desperately difficult for the kids. Their investment in their parents staying together is one of the foundations of their lives...even into adulthood.
    I finally fell so crazy in love, I needed a divorce. One kid was 10, the other 18 and in college.
    That was 10 years ago. I'm as happy as a clam with my new wife, bug the divorce scars run deep.
    Maybe, for you, some counseling.
    You know how when you're talking to someone and you forget their name?
    The longer you talk to them, the less likely you are to ask their name.
    Marriages are like this.
    Communication is everything.
    You have to find a way to say those things that are being unsaid.
    And think about what brought you together and try to reclaim that.
    Best of luck, brother.
    It's a hard way to go.
  12. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Jun 2, 2003
    Try to find out what she needs, what isn't working for her. Often after years we feel "stuck" in the same old routine. I have to say, moving on seems good at some point in your life, but looking back, not sure that was really the answer....
  13. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

    Jan 12, 2011
    Snellman MN
    Hopefully your situation is a better one than the doom and gloom marriages I've been through and seen friends and coworkers go through.
    Maybe I just have friends in low places but I really haven't seen too many of these things ending well.
    I sincerely hope this doesn't end up in a custody battle that's based more on revenge than the children's best interests. That happened in my first divorce. My youngest child is 26 now and only my oldest daughter talks to her mother now, 3 girls one boy. Someday I should write a book about that divorce. But it was so bad people wouldn't believe it.
    Ever hear of Munchausen by proxy?
    Probably not and I hope you never do!
    My two youngsters daughters survived that from their mother during and after the divorce. My youngest has health issues from the medication her mother and the Mayo Clinic put her on starting at 8 years old.
    I absolutely knew there was nothing wrong with my girls but like my attorney said, how are you going to walk into court and tell the judge this woman has hoodwinked the Mayo Clinic?
    Besides that they had to know full well at the time. You see she was trying to claim my girls had mental problems and they were doing a study on the health effects of lithium in young children. The two girls had been to 4 or 5 doctors already before and thay all said they were fine. But the Mayo was doing a study and their mother got paid for them using my little girls as lab rats. Probably not easy finding a custodial parent that'll risk long term health problems with their children and she presented them two. Of course they bought her predetermined diagnosis, a huge sign of Munchausen by proxy! They simply didn't care.
    That's how bad it can get.
    Hope for the best but prepare for the worst.
    Good luck !

    Oh that part would only be a few chapters in the book.
    Chunkocaster likes this.
  14. brookdalebill

    brookdalebill Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

    Nov 15, 2009
    Austin, Tx
    Romantic relationship advice, from me?
    With my track record?
    Uh, I’ll just invoke my simplistic “religion”, The Golden Rule.
    It’s often as difficult do as it is simple to remember.
    I’m not it’s greatest practitioner, but I do keep it uppermost in my mind when dealing with others.
    Oh, and I have been unattached for close to 20 years.
    Relationship advice, from me?
    Good luck, sir.
  15. RatBug

    RatBug Tele-Meister

    Jan 25, 2019
    My guess.

    I hate to bring up the monkey analogy but ... Women are like monkeys, they don't let go of one branch till they have a grip on another.
    sjwieczorkow, stevemc, BobbyZ and 3 others like this.
  16. dougstrum

    dougstrum Tele-Afflicted

    Oct 6, 2015
    blu ridge mtn cabin
    The need for the two of you to talk is important. Take a drive, hike, day trip
    with the intention talking about your relationship. What brought you together, what do you each need in the relationship, what strengths do each of you have, what weaknesses, what would changes would make your relationship better
    Greggorios likes this.
  17. Greggorios

    Greggorios Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Jun 18, 2016
    Patterson, NY
    Sorry for your pain. As usual the forum is at the ready with so much caring, solid life experience and suggestions. My 2 cents would be to echo much of what has been already said and to suggest to try not to "project" too much. Take a quick peak into the future to prepare for the worst but don't dwell there. Get back into today (the now...) and see if there's any desire to try to re-establish your relationship after exploring what her dissatisfaction is all about. If any desire maybe look for some professional help at least for the short term.

    Good luck and try to stay positive.
    Chunkocaster likes this.
  18. scrapyardblue

    scrapyardblue Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Feb 6, 2007
    central illinois
    Figure out some time away, by yourself and for yourself. Your son will still be your son. It'll give you a chance to re-evaluate and her a opportunity to see if she misses you. There's an excellent chance that she's already decided to move on to the next thing (and probably doesn't even know what that is).

    Hope you can keep it together but, in my opinion, the harder you try the sappier you may become. If you're constantly eating out of her hand, your fall and recovery will be long and painful.

    Don't be a fool trying to figure her out. There is no explanation. It may not be anything that you've done. Take care of yourself and the boy.
  19. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

    Sep 1, 2009
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    A number of forum members are assuming your wife has met a guy, or girl. From what you wrote, your wife sounds honest and you know in your heart if she is. I would get to the bottom of her doubts first. Another +1 to talking as openly as you can, and counselling.
    Harry Styron and 8barlouie like this.
  20. tery

    tery Poster Extraordinaire

    Sep 21, 2012
    Stay friends no matter what … one never knows what will happen the day after tomorrow :)
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