Little Walter 22 specs and circuit

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by CapnCrunch, Aug 28, 2020.

  1. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Anyone familiar with this amp and the circuit? The MBritt profiles of this amp on the Kemper are stuningly incredible. They've caused me to look up all the information I've been able to find on this amp. I'm thinking seriously of buying one, but I'd like to understand the circuit first.

    On it's face it looks a bit like a Deluxe but it is Point to Point without a turret or eyelet board. I've read it may be based on an earlier octal version of the Deluxe. It sounds nothing like a 5c3 or a 5e3, however, otherwise I would not be at all interested. It has none of the loose, flabby, farty low end of a Fender Deluxe, and seems to have more gain on tap. Any knowledge or insight would be appreciated.:)
     
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  2. MickM

    MickM Friend of Leo's Platinum Supporter

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    Here's 3 minutes of Little Walter and Jack Pearson.
     
  3. King Fan

    King Fan Poster Extraordinaire

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    Well, that's righteous.

    http://www.littlewaltertubeamps.com/22 Watt.html

    2 x 6SC7 preamp
    2 x 6V6
    5Y3
    22W of course
    A few things I read sound like it might have an interactive vol/tone setup. And there's a hint of 5E3 family resemblance in their description:

    "The remarkable thing about this amp is the way you'd set it up on stage. You would set the volume for the most breakup tone you would be using in the venue. Then you would roll your instrument volume back a bit to achieve as clean a sound as you wish with no loss of tonality. A slight roll of the volume pot on your instrument will give you the overdriven breakup you want on demand."
     
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  4. tubegeek

    tubegeek Friend of Leo's

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    6SC7 is very nearly a 6SL7 with its cathodes shared. My Ampeg Rocket uses 6SL7's in the preamp and it's a glorious sound. Octal is where it's at.
     
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  5. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Here's Vince Gill playing the same amp:



    and another more comprehensive demo:

     
  6. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    I've watched and read everything I can find on the amp, I'm just looking for some technical information that I have not been able to dig up in my search.
     
  7. King Fan

    King Fan Poster Extraordinaire

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    Heh, Cap, I know you know, I figured others might be interested.
     
  8. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    Obviously there have to be some significant differences between any of the Tweed Deluxe's and the LW because to get 22 watts out of 6v6's, voltages have to be higher, transformers are likely bigger, and most importantly, the amp pretty much has to be fixed bias rather than Cathode bias. I read a post over on the Hammond board that the amp is based on a 5c3 and that it is cathode biased. I don't see how you get 22 watts from cathode biased 6v6's which is one of the reasons I posted this question. I love how it sounds, and the profile on the Kemper is as sweet as they come.
     
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  9. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    No worries and thanks. I didn't mean to imply "I already know this". I should have said "I've read and listened to everything I've been able to dig up." All input is welcome, because I doubt I've seen all the relevant information that is out there.;)
     
  10. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    When he reaches down and bumps up the guitar volume at around 1:20 and onward, you get a sense of what the amp is capable of. Notice the low notes don't mush at all. I've only played a Kemper profile of the amp, but the MBritt profile I use is very very close to this.
     
  11. printer2

    printer2 Poster Extraordinaire

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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
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  12. tubegeek

    tubegeek Friend of Leo's

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    But does he know that you know that he knows?

    I guess now, yeah.
     
  13. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    That's what I was thinking too. Of course, if he's getting 15ish watts out of the 6v6's you'd be fairly hard pressed to hear the difference between that and 20-22. I was trying to work backwards to deduce some things about the amp. 22 is a conspicuous # and with 6v6's that meant "fixed bias" to me.
     
  14. King Fan

    King Fan Poster Extraordinaire

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    OK, I picked a bad week to stop sniffing glue, and this post Printer2 found picked a bad time to have all its pics go missing:

    upload_2020-8-28_16-20-4.jpeg
     
  15. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    It's never a bad time to quit sniffing glue. It causes drain bamage. I ran into those mysteriously disappeared gut shots for the 22 on the Hammond site too. It's a conspiracy. I've never been good at figuring out anything about a circuit from pics of PTP wired amps anyway though.
     
  16. King Fan

    King Fan Poster Extraordinaire

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    Sorry, it's a line from "Airport." I never sniffed glue on purpose, though I loved building plastic model planes and cars as a kid. Nowadays I just sniff solder fumes... :)
     
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  17. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    That ampgarage link is gold. I had to work a little to remember my login, but once I logged in and could view the pics, theres lots there. Then......I did a little search and it is the tip of the ice berg over there. Thanks for that.
     
  18. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch Friend of Leo's

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    That's not good for you either. Some say that solder fumes played some part in Ken Fischer's early demise.
     
  19. printer2

    printer2 Poster Extraordinaire

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    Sometimes I wish for an early demise. Mind you that was earlier, I am later now and since I did not com to my demise I would rather leave it for later. Well, much later.

    What did you say about that glue?
     
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  20. milocj

    milocj Friend of Leo's

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    I have one and I wish I could help you more. Mine is a head with a 1x12 cabinet. I was about 8 feet in front of Vince Gill in that first video. Lots of killer players that night, up close and personal.

    I did have gut shots of mine but unfortunately they have been held hostage in a cell phone that decided to permanently lock up. I'm trying to remember a bit of the history of the 22 and am having a hard time finding some of the links. I believe that it was initially called a 15 and was reworked a bit to fit a certain player's request (maybe Jerry Donahue?) and at that time eventually became the 22.

    I didn't completely trace out the circuit in mine because I wasn't too concerned but my best guess is that it's a rework of the 5B3 or 5C3 Deluxe circuit to eliminate a lot of that low-end fart and still be able to let the warmth of the big bottle preamp tubes to come through. There is some channel interaction but it sure doesn't sound like a Deluxe clone.

    I believe that the voltages are a bit higher than the Fender circuits because it came with JJ 6V6 tubes and the recommendation to use them for replacements when the time came. That possibly/probably is where the 22 name came from to distinguish it from the earlier model and from true clones of other circuits.
     
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