Larry Carlton Says Gibson ES-335 Guitars Are ’Inconsistent,’

[Trenchant63]

I take Larry's comment with a grain of salt. I've heard so many great sounding 335s along with 345 and 355 models
from all ages over the years that it really doesn't matter.

I like Larry’s playing, but have not always been a fan of his guitar sound. I really like his sound on the Rockford Files theme music, The Nightfly album and on most of his solo work. I don’t like his guitar sound on Kid Charlemagne (rhythm or solo) but his playing on that tune is superb. It’s some kind of hashy breakup tone through maybe a small amp? Not a pleasant OD sound to me but to each their own.

 

[middy]

I like Larry’s playing, but have not always been a fan of his guitar sound. I really like his sound on the Rockford Files theme music, The Nightfly album and on most of his solo work. I don’t like his guitar sound on Kid Charlemagne (rhythm or solo) but his playing on that tune is superb. It’s some kind of hashy breakup tone through maybe a small amp? Not a pleasant OD sound to me but to each their own.

That’s his famous tweed deluxe that top producers ask for specifically.

 

[Shango66]

I went on an 335 hunt just last month.
ended up with an Eastman 486.
Tried a few G 335s .
Imo the 335, 60s slim taper neck is akin to putting a child’s sized neck on a man sized guitar. Not for me.

 

[Trenchant63]

That’s his famous tweed deluxe that top producers ask for specifically.

I know! I’m like - what the he** is wrong with me? I really like so much if his stuff but that particular sound bounced off my ears. I don’t think it’s awful, but just not a sound I’d seek out to listen to.

 

[TheCheapGuitarist]

I have to agree with LC.
Played a lot of them that were as different as can be.
But, once in a while, you find one that blows you out of the water.

Well that's the thing: they can be all over the place, but you have to look for the one that suits you the best, personally. He's right about that, but it doesn't mean that the ones that don't suit a certain person aren't as good. Those Sires are going to work perfectly for him, because they are based off his personal 335.

I'm cheap, so I'm going to wait for the Sires to show up on the used market.

 

[middy]

I know! I’m like - what the he** is wrong with me? I really like so much if his stuff but that particular sound bounced off my ears. I don’t think it’s awful, but just not a sound I’d seek out to listen to.

The tone control rolled off on the bridge pickup is not his usual tone. I like it for this song.

 

[Brett Valentine]

The thing I got from what he said is that his signature ES-335 was inconsistent which is a different story.

And my only experience with a 335 ('65-'68) was the one I traded a 3 pickup Les Paul SG for (it had a warped neck and lived next to a hot water pipe in a broken down cardboard case (this was back in '77). It STILL outplayed my SG!

 

[Happy Enchilada]

OK guys - I've 4wheeled through this entire thread and NOBODY has said they've actually PLAYED one. Lots of opinions, some well-deserved Gibson bashing, and good suggestions of alternatives (I'm checking out Eastman, but it's 2x the price of the Sire). But no HANDS-ON evaluations.

Years ago I saved up and finally got a CS '64 Reissue 335 in red.
It was gorgeous and a joy to play.
Had to sell it for monetary reasons.
Fixed up a Firefly and a Hamer 335 clones since, but nowhere near close.

If this Sire is all that and a bag of chips for $700, I'd like to know.
Unfortunately, none are available for me to test drive locally.

So can somebody who's actually PLAYED one weigh in?
Thanks in advance.

 

[imwjl]

OK guys - I've 4wheeled through this entire thread and NOBODY has said they've actually PLAYED one. Lots of opinions, some well-deserved Gibson bashing, and good suggestions of alternatives (I'm checking out Eastman, but it's 2x the price of the Sire). But no HANDS-ON evaluations.

Years ago I saved up and finally got a CS '64 Reissue 335 in red.
It was gorgeous and a joy to play.
Had to sell it for monetary reasons.
Fixed up a Firefly and a Hamer 335 clones since, but nowhere near close.

If this Sire is all that and a bag of chips for $700, I'd like to know.
Unfortunately, none are available for me to test drive locally.

So can somebody who's actually PLAYED one weigh in?
Thanks in advance.

The famous Dave's Guitar shop had 20+ new 335s when I was shopping for that style or similar. The similarly and even less expensive Collings semi-hollow models made the Gibon's seem like a joke for people with extreme brand fan boy blindness.

There were the Gibons, some Herritage, PRS, Gretsch plus the Collings. It was hard to find a Gibson with the all of fretwork, finish, feel etc.... made as well. It was also interesting that the Gibson pickups seemed hot or strong against their own vintage models.

A good instrument is a good instrument so I hope the post-Henry Gibsons are better, and that anyone shopping finds something that really impresses and satisfies.

 

[bustromo]

I love semihollows. I have a 2012 Gibson 335 (Memphis dot), an Ibanez JSM 100 (the Scofield signature model) and now an Eastman T/59v. All 3 are superb. The Gibson has the roughest finish and sounds acoustically quite dead, but plugged in it has a sweet, sweet tone and the relatively thin and slim neck makes it very easy to play. The Ibanez has the best fit and finish (flawless really) and an amazingly comfortable compound radius fretboard, but a slightly less appealing tone plugged in, to my ear. Thinking of swapping the stock Ibanez pickups (which many people think are fantastic, so it's very subjective) for some Lollars. The Eastman, half the price of the others, is the prettiest (with its vintage varnish finish), has a fit and finish at least on a par with the Gibson, and has a plugged in tone as appealing as the Gibson, with a bit more ring and sustain. Probably the pick of the bunch. I'm sure Gibsons do vary in QC, as Larry said, but most makers do. The Japanese factories are perhaps a bit more consistent - I have 2 Ibanez's and 2 Yamahas and the QC on all of them is beyond any reproach.

 

[msalama]

because it's 50 or 70 years old does not mean

Not opposing anything you say per se, so please don't take the following the wrong way. But still...

A particular guitar being a 70s product does not mean it can't be good, either, although many indeed were not. But I've six 70s axes myself, and they're all just as good as any older example I've ever owned.

Now, 70s guitars ARE different, and as a rule heavier too, but for me, the best are just fine regardless because I don't find that problematic. Mine f.ex. are all well made with tight mech tolerances and good machining, and I personally can't fault them for the thick poly and dense woods used, because neither attribute bothers me one bit.

OK, rant done and sorry for the aside

PS. And good luck trying to find, say, a pre-CBS WRHB anyway if you happen to like those
PPS. Was a bit of a pointless post, granted

 

[teletail]

OK guys - I've 4wheeled through this entire thread and NOBODY has said they've actually PLAYED one. Lots of opinions, some well-deserved Gibson bashing, and good suggestions of alternatives (I'm checking out Eastman, but it's 2x the price of the Sire). But no HANDS-ON evaluations.

Years ago I saved up and finally got a CS '64 Reissue 335 in red.
It was gorgeous and a joy to play.
Had to sell it for monetary reasons.
Fixed up a Firefly and a Hamer 335 clones since, but nowhere near close.

If this Sire is all that and a bag of chips for $700, I'd like to know.
Unfortunately, none are available for me to test drive locally.

So can somebody who's actually PLAYED one weigh in?
Thanks in advance.

I’ve owned 2 Gibson ES-335s, an Epiphone ES-335, a Heritage version of the 335 and a Gibson BB Kkng Model. All nice guitars, although the Epiphone was not in the same class as the Gibson, but I never bonded with any of them.

I currently own a Sire H7 and H7V. They both look great, play great and sound great. I’m not sure I could tell the difference between the Gibson and the Sire in a blind test.

If you’re looking for a 335, I highly recommend the Sire.

 

[ronzhd]

This, that or the other, bottom line, is it's the bottom line. All about the money. If ya got the stroke you gonna get paid.

 

[Matt Sarad]

I've had a '62, '75, 2002, and now I don't have any.
The '62 was my favorite. Sold it to Norm years ago.

 

[Happy Enchilada]

I’ve owned 2 Gibson ES-335s, an Epiphone ES-335, a Heritage version of the 335 and a Gibson BB Kkng Model. All nice guitars, although the Epiphone was not in the same class as the Gibson, but I never bonded with any of them.

I currently own a Sire H7 and H7V. They both look great, play great and sound great. I’m not sure I could tell the difference between the Gibson and the Sire in a blind test.

If you’re looking for a 335, I highly recommend the Sire.

I have had both ends of the spectrum as well.
CS '64 reissue.
Hamer Echotone with upgrades.
Firefly 338 with upgrades.
Gibson is the only one I miss.

Thanks for your testimonial @ the Sire H7.
I have several in my watchlist on Reverb and will pull the trigger pending sale of some other gear.

Questions:

What kind of stuff do you play on your Sire?
How do you compare the pickups to your Gibsons?
Is your Sire comparatively light or heavy?
Did you get your Sire new or used?
And how much did you pay?

Thanks!!!

 

[teletail]

What kind of stuff do you play on your Sire?
How do you compare the pickups to your Gibsons?
Is your Sire comparatively light or heavy?
Did you get your Sire new or used?
And how much did you pay?

Thanks!!!

I play blues, jazz, rock and roll, and funk on it. Everything but country.

I think the pickups are on par with the Gibson but I haven’t played the Gibson in a couple of years, so it’s not a side by side comparison.

I think both Sires are about 8 lbs.

I bought the H7V new from proaudiostar.com for $705, but I had a 10% off coupon. I bought my H7 from Guitarcenter.com for $439 and it showed up with a brand new $150 case.

 

[teletimetx]

OK guys - I've 4wheeled through this entire thread and NOBODY has said they've actually PLAYED one. Lots of opinions, some well-deserved Gibson bashing, and good suggestions of alternatives (I'm checking out Eastman, but it's 2x the price of the Sire). But no HANDS-ON So can somebody who's actually PLAYED one weigh in?
Thanks in advance.

Happy, I don’t know what it means to 4 wheel through a thread (but I’m familiar with 4-wheel drive, etc, having grown up in the Rockies), but if you have the chance to revisit posts #7, 10, 11, 15, 43, 49, 51, 54, 63 and 67, you’ll find people making statements about owning and playing 335’s - including many folks whose opinions I value (not that my values suggest anything in particular), but it’s there, if you’re looking for some experience stated.

Just trying to respect contributions that were made.

 

[boris bubbanov]

I played about 90 MIM 50s Baja Telecasters and bought seven.

I've played about 40-45 ES-335s in the last 15 years and have yet to buy one. I think Mr. Carlton is right. They are inconsistent. The great ones are $$$$$$ and the rest aren't worth having. I keep looking, but those in the know, hang on to the nice ones for the most part.

 

[bholder]

Has anyone tried a Sire L7V?

I have one coming next month, will update when it's here.

 

[billy logan]

Didn't read the whole thread - just to say:
In '78 I bought a used 335 that didn't have a good amplified sound.

The only likable tone:

neck pickup, tone 100%, volume dialed back to 66%
WITH
bridge, tone and volume at 100%

A jazz guy wanted to try it, I lent it to him for one gig. Comes back, "ya know, the only tone I used was [see above]"

The 335 was not a dot pattern fingerboard, iirc rectangles.

It happened to have a Bigsby.
Playing it unplugged, there was an interesting idk "stereo phase flange chorus what have you" acoustic effect seemingly going back and forth from one f-hole to the other when whammy-barring.