Lacquer repair

[Boreas]

Today the seller told me the lacquer was melted from heat on that spot. They‘ve tried to steam out a dent with a hot iron and overbuffed the melted area. Does that make sense? If so, I guess the problem is limited to that spot.

Not really. It certainly can damage a finish, but doesn't explain the "two-layer" effect we see. I suppose the color base could be a nitro that was incompatible with the clear nitro. There are many products out there called nitro that aren't nitro in the truest sense. Think StewMac Color Tone finishes. Depending on formulation and application, two different types/brands may not melt together as they should.

If you test both the clear and the color and find them both to be softened by acetone or lacquer thinner, you may have a better chance at a less-conspicuous repair. But if you choose not to repair, I at least would consider an overspray that will minimize future chipping at the edges.

I can't say that I recommend it, but I "treated" some SMALL flaking areas on a vintage nitro finish recently with a TruOil-type product to see what it would do. It darkened some bare wood slightly, but seemed to "glue down" the flaky nitro. I didn't want to perform a nitro overspray - which had been done decades ago and was basically what was flaking off. How long this treatment lasts remains to be seen.

 

[stefanhotrod]

Not really. It certainly can damage a finish, but doesn't explain the "two-layer" effect we see. I suppose the color base could be a nitro that was incompatible with the clear nitro. There are many products out there called nitro that aren't nitro in the truest sense. Think StewMac Color Tone finishes. Depending on formulation and application, two different types/brands may not melt together as they should.

If you test both the clear and the color and find them both to be softened by acetone or lacquer thinner, you may have a better chance at a less-conspicuous repair. But if you choose not to repair, I at least would consider an overspray that will minimize future chipping at the edges.

I can't say that I recommend it, but I "treated" some SMALL flaking areas on a vintage nitro finish recently with a TruOil-type product to see what it would do. It darkened some bare wood slightly, but seemed to "glue down" the flaky nitro. I didn't want to perform a nitro overspray - which had been done decades ago and was basically what was flaking off. How long this treatment lasts remains to be seen.

Thanks, thought about TO myself…but there is no chipping, the spot feels perfectly smooth and the rest of the body is flawless. Dunno, I‘ll have to see. Thanks again!

 

[Boreas]

Thanks, thought about TO myself…but there is no chipping, the spot feels perfectly smooth and the rest of the body is flawless. Dunno, I‘ll have to see. Thanks again!

Perhaps as others have mentioned, a good (non-silicone) polish may make it less noticeable.

Good luck and post your results if you do anything.

 

[old wrench]

Today the seller told me the lacquer was melted from heat on that spot. They‘ve tried to steam out a dent with a hot iron and overbuffed the melted area. Does that make sense? If so, I guess the problem is limited to that spot.

Does that make sense?

Partly yes and partly no

I'm not a professional or an expert finisher, just someone who has done enough finishing to make most of the common finishing mistakes myself - so when I see them, they often look familiar to me


I say partly no, because - although "steaming out" a dent usually works well on an unfinished body, it usually leads to problems on a finished body - generally not a good idea

Partly yes, because - that is exactly what it looks like to me - over-buffed and burned through the top layer of finish


At least the seller acknowledged the problem and took responsibility for it - that's always the first step towards working out a resolution

I usually tend towards transparent or translucent finishes, but I've always liked that Fender blue color and the white binding really sets it off nicely

Consider this - If you use a pickguard on that body, nobody other than yourself will ever know that spot is there

.

 

[Sea Devil]

Do not polish or buff it! It will only make it larger. Hit it with this:




Hold the guitar so that the blemish is facing slightly downward and is on the bottom side. Shoot past it in one quick burst from about ten inches away. It will disappear and blend in with no need for sanding or buffing. Dries completely in eleven minutes.

 

[stefanhotrod]

Do not polish or buff it! It will only make it larger. Hit it with this:

View attachment 1072788


Hold the guitar so that the blemish is facing slightly downward and is on the bottom side. Shoot past it in one quick burst from about ten inches away. It will disappear and blend in with no need for sanding or buffing. Dries completely in eleven minutes.

Thanks for your help! Unfortunately this product isn’t available in europe.

 

[Sea Devil]

You could achieve a similar result with any true lacquer, but it would dry more slowly and require some sanding and buffing.

 

[Rhomco]

A pickguard will make it disappear.

 

[stratisfied]

Someone sanded through the clearcoat into the basecoat, attempted a touchup overspray before the clearcoat was fully dry. Solvent got under the edge and made it more obvious. All this “lacquer melts into the old finish applies to an old, fully dried finish that is free of polish or wax. If you rush to touch-up, you can wind up having to refinish.

If you decide to tackle it yourself, Make sure the top is clean and completely dry first. Wet sand with 1600 grit and a fingertip size block (like a pink Faber eraser) to feather the clear edges. Clean with mineral spirits or Duplicolor wax and grease remover. Wipe down with a tack rag just before you spray it with the Mohawk UltraFlo. If possible, use an air brush for best results. Overlap the repair, allow to dry and buff with fine polishing compound by hand.

The Mohawk UltraFlo flows out better and thinner for an invisible blend.

 

[58Bassman]

Perhaps it is a nitro clear coat applied over a poly base. Buffing could have removed the nitro but left the poly unscathed. I could see that leaving witness lines, because the nitro sits on the poly.

A full repair may not be necessary, but if it is indeed nitro over a different color base, it would probably be wise to apply numerous coats of clear nitro over the lesion to keep the nitro from chipping at.the edges. Full repair may not be cost effective or advisable.

Poly doesn't usually need a clear coat, they want to use as few steps as possible. Why would they put Nitro over Poly?

They wouldn't use nitro over poly because there's no benefit. Nitro is used because it's a thin coating, not like poly.

 

[58Bassman]

I would start with fine polishing compound (3M Finesse-It or equivalent), but would first see if it leaves any swirl marks on an inconspicuous spot (like under the heel plate).

 

[Boreas]

Poly doesn't usually need a clear coat, they want to use as few steps as possible. Why would they put Nitro over Poly?

They wouldn't use nitro over poly because there's no benefit. Nitro is used because it's a thin coating, not like poly.

Don't know this brand/manufacturer. Builders have certainly been known to apply nitro over poly and call it a "nitro" finish. Look up the history/use of Fullerplast at Fender for instance. I have done it myself on necks because I like the feel of nitro better than poly.

From my eye, I see two distinct layers. To me, it looks like a top layer was buffed or sanded through in that small area. That shouldn't happen with a purely nitro finish, as subsequent layers burn/melt into lower layers and do not sit on top. What and why the manufacturer did I do not know. I am just offering suggestions to what I see in one picture. OP can take or leave my opinion.

 

[58Bassman]

Don't know this brand/manufacturer. Builders have certainly been known to apply nitro over poly and call it a "nitro" finish. Look up the history/use of Fullerplast at Fender for instance. I have done it myself on necks because I like the feel of nitro better than poly.

From my eye, I see two distinct layers. To me, it looks like a top layer was buffed or sanded through in that small area. That shouldn't happen with a purely nitro finish, as subsequent layers burn/melt into lower layers and do not sit on top. What and why the manufacturer did I do not know. I am just offering suggestions to what I see in one picture. OP can take or leave my opinion.

Do you think this photo could be a poly finish with a repair, done using Poly, but the original surface might have been contaminated?

 

[Boreas]

Do you think this photo could be a poly finish with a repair, done using Poly, but the original surface might have been contaminated?

Entirely possible. Instead of a "sand-through" situation (that I assumed), it could be a small area of poly or other "overspray" covering a blemish in the base nitro.

I was going by the OP stating it was a new body and that it was sold as a "nitro" finish. Like I say, unless you test the two layers with solvent, it is hard to tell from a photograph. But obviously, that isn't an area you would want to test with a solvent like acetone, as it will further damage a nitro finish. Testing could possibly be done in pickup routes or other obscured areas of finish. Usually a fingernail test or scratch test will reveal whether the lesion is a depression or an elevation. But I can't tell by the picture.

 

[schmee]

That’s the problem. I‘ve buffed the spot with wet Micro Mesh from 1500-12000, it got bigger because of it
The body smells a lot like Nitro, by the way

That's exactly what happened on a spot repair about the size of a nickel I did. Even going to 2000 grit and hand buffing wouldn't blend to the surrounding area. As I mentioned in post #9 the foam wheel and Finesse-It blended it fast. I had the foam wheel laying around for a couple years but never tried it. Bam! done in 10 seconds.

 

[Intubator]

Maybe consider re-clearing the entire body. I would be concerned that there may be other areas that will flake over time, it does look like it was a prep issue. Sand it down to the base with 600, Prepsol it or eqivalent, tackcloth, then reshoot the whole thing with Laquer. I'd have an autobody or cabinet painter do it if you're not experienced.

 

[stratisfied]

It almost looks like lacquer applied over a polyurethane or polyester finish that was sanded through. Why would some one apply lacquer over the poly? Fender apparently thought it was a great idea to move more guitars (Highway Ones) by calling them "Nitro Finished" to appeal to those who froth at mouth per Nitrocellulose lacquer. That could very well be a poly body from another maker that was over-sprayed with lacquer to increase ROI on a purchased pre-finished body.

Another possibility is that the original finish was Acrylic lacquer since it appears to be a "surfy '60's" color. While you can spray Nttrocellulose over acrylic lacquer, the acrylic lacquer typically needs to be sanded lightly just like you would with polyurethane to assure adhesion.

Either way you have a sand or buff through that may/not touch up acceptably. You try the ultra Flo Lacquer as mentioned but depending on your technique and skill, a full clearcoat respray may be needed.

 

[stefanhotrod]

Thanks guys, the body is now completely refinished. Best decision.

Edit: and it is (and was) Nitroclear over a Nitrobasecolor. The color is btw a Porsche 356 color from the later 1950‘s, hard to photograph properly. It‘s warmer with a touch more green in reality.