I've United The Clans

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by cometazzi, Oct 24, 2021.

  1. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Well I find a huge difference between canned "tomato sauce" and jarred "spaghetti sauce"!
    Just not the same thing, even aside from jar spaghetti sauce being wildly variable, and often better stuff is great for the base you make YOUR spaghetti sauce from.
     
  2. cometazzi

    cometazzi Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

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    By that "better stuff for the base", you mean starting with the canned, whole plum tomatoes? Do you cook them until they turn to mush, or do you mechanically bludgeon them into sauce somehow?
     
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  3. StoneH

    StoneH Tele-Holic Gold Supporter

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    The Hofbräuhaus in Munich (and probably every other good biergarten) keeps a perpetual sauerkraut vat going 24/7. I was not a fan of sauerkraut until a friend recommended it on my first visit to the Hofbräuhaus in the early '90s. I have tried to approximate the recipe ever since.
     
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  4. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Band name alert: (she’s a real) Tomato Bludgeon

    Sorry, uh, no I meant a good jarred spaghetti sauce can make a great base for a more home made spaghetti sauce.
    Pretty much how I’ve always made spaghetti sauce but now and then a good jar sauce brand becomes unavailable and I have to try some to find another I like.

    But when I make chili I do actually manually bludgeon the whole plum tomatoes one at a time in my hand, and remove the hard stem bit too.
     
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  5. cometazzi

    cometazzi Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

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    Fun fact: I have a stoneware mug from The Hofbräuhaus that my Dad accidentally walked home with in the 1960s while stationed in Germany. Apparently this is a big deal, since they watch for that stuff. Dad wasn't trying to be sneaky, he was just a teenager who got his a$$ kicked by German bier and left with it in his hand.

    [​IMG]

    Regular bar glass for scale. This is one that I uh.... "accidentally" walked home with from a local brew pub. Yep. Yessiree, toadilly an accident.
     
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  6. beanluc

    beanluc Tele-Afflicted

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    Nah.

    I mean, maybe certain sucky brands, I don't know. But cans themselves aren't to blame. Specific canners maybe.

    Or maybe they were talking about canned spaghetti sauce rather than using canned PLAIN tomato sauce to make spaghetti sauce.

    The cheater "Italian grandmother recipe" I learned around Boston takes half an hour - though, like we've been discussing, it benefits wildly from a night in the refrigerator. It really does taste like good Italian grandmother "gravy" but starts with good plain tomato sauce (only ingredient, good tomatoes and maybe salt, ideally not) which you add to the secret ingredients. Bring to full bubbling heat, done.

    They're secret. Don't ask. No, Boston doesn't only have Irish.
     
  7. beanluc

    beanluc Tele-Afflicted

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    One of my mom's white whales is gravy. Well, she'd say so, anyway. She uses real roasting-pan drippings so it comes out fine, but she's self conscious about lumps. I promised I'd show her precisely/exactly how to avoid or fix that.

    So, one year I showed her how to avoid it: I showed her how to make roux, and to add hot roux to the hot broth, no lumps. Too fussy and involved for her, so the following year she continued just sprinkling and whisking raw white flour directly into the roasting pan (after taking the meat out, natch.)

    Wouldn't you know it, lumps. So I showed her how to fix it. "Where's your wire strainer?" I poured that gravy through, trapped the lumps, and caught the perfectly smooth result in the gravy boat.

    "That's CHEATING!"

    Sigh! So much for professional experience.

    So I showed her that if she's not going to make roux, she can mix cold water into the flour to make a slurry before whisking it in to the hot pan drippings. No lumps.

    Regarding baked chicken. Roasted meat is the best gravy genesis. For several years I had the routine of roasting two whole chickens in the oven every Sunday, cutting them apart and storing most of it in the refrigerator for the coming week, and making the copious juice that had run into the pan into gravy. Mm mm good.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
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  8. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Maybe SOME “tomato sauce” is fine in with “crushed tomatoes” or “puréed tomatoes” and whole or stewed tomatoes but a spaghetti sauce made with all canned “tomato sauce” never tastes right to me, and does have an unpleasant acidic thing.
    Brands don’t fix that whether pastene, contadina, hunts or any other, it’s just not suited to be the entire tomato content in spaghetti sauce.
    And certainly not in chili.
    I’ll use some tomato sauce with some more whole tomato ingredients.

    That’s what I find anyhow.
    FWIW I don’t put sugar in spaghetti sauce either, no mint for me, fennel seed sometimes, cumin usually, oregano and EVOO of course, tons of garlic and I prefer sweet Visalia onions. Maybe meat or not, maybe Italian sausage or not, maybe fresh basil if available but not often dried basil.
    Simmered all day NOT!

    My spaghetti sauces vary by mood and season!
    Of course that cat can be skinned oh so many ways!
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
  9. MarkieMark

    MarkieMark Friend of Leo's

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    I get this, though I have no idea what specifically is to blame.
    Any time I "cheat" and use canned tomato products in a sauce or dish, that acidic presence overwhelms the natural sweet/acidic balance that makes a tomato sauce good. Its a specific little "bite" in the flavor that bugs me.
    Maybe few others notice it, but to me, its obvious.
    And the only solutions I have found are either a lot of work, or just dealing with it. Or sweetening the base, which I dont do.
    Jalapeno peppers help cover it up. Generous portions of flavorful proteins help. But its still there.
    And I wont disagree that its probably not the can. I dont know if its the process, or something. I dunno.
    But its a thing.

    I do think it is something that mellows over a day or two when its leftover time.
    Always better.
    Especially chilli maybe?
     
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  10. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I was taught to make roux and pan gravy as soon as I was taller than the stove.
    Cooked in a bunch of good restaurants etc, folks remember my cooking.
    In the late ‘90s though I was the NYC 90th precincts least likely white boy to survive due to speedballs every couple hours so I went to a dozen rehabs and surprisingly did survive.
    In early recovery there were thanksgiving and Christmas Day 12 step meetings that ran 24 hours, and being all excited I roasted TWO turkeys then made really nice traditional gravy with the deluded thought that love in food could save all the junkies.
    You clearly carry that love in the food ideal, right?
    Because I had been accepted back by family at that point, I dropped off the turkeys, two boats of gravy, and some whole cranberry sauce I made, also with big cooking love.
    After hours at family dinner I went back to the meeting and my turkeys looked ravaged by zombies but the gravy and cranberry were untouched.
    Literally still full to the brim.

    I have to figure that most of the crowd may have never seen home cooking?
    (Or mostly rice & beans style)
    Most hanging there rather than seeing family lived at the homeless shelter on the next street and had sold drugs or their own butts for a living, but it really struck me that so many just couldn’t identify a home made turkey gravy.

    That’s my roux rue and I’m sticking to it!
     
  11. MarkieMark

    MarkieMark Friend of Leo's

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    Thats a cold hard rue!

    The best phases of my life are the result of a lot of introspection my brother, but you can preach on...

    Step one. Dont massacre the fowl, nor fowl the massacre.

    Step two. Respect for the sides, for they supporteth the entire theme.

    Step three. Appreciate the love and care, which createth the whole.
     
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  12. tfarny

    tfarny Poster Extraordinaire

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    When I lived in Kyoto there was a legendarily stinky ramen shop (hole in the wall type place) that had insanely good noodles. They had a perpetual stock going or at least that was the story. You could smell the place from a block away. It was always packed late at night and for good reason!
     
  13. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    The stock is always the secret!

     
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