I think I understand the tonemaster amp thing now

Milspec

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The honeymoon is over for me and my Deluxe Reverb TM, not ready for divorce, but we are going through counseling.

I purchased the Black tolex version with the Neo Jensen, played it now for a few months, and it makes sense now to me what this amp is and where it is going. It is a modern interpretation of the Deluxe Reverb in solid state. It is not a clone, it is not a digital version of the tube amp, it is really it's own thing....a modern amp that looks like a duck, walks like a duck, but chirps instead of quacks.

We all tend to hear with our eyes and having the cabinet be a well crafted dead ringer for the BF Fender Deluxe Reverb only helps plant those tones in our mind before we hit the first note. We will hear a tone much closer than it likely is for a few months. Something was a little off, it sounded good, but something was a little different. I (like many) started to conclude that it must be the speaker to blame.

Enough people ended the honeymoon with the same conclusion so out rolls the blond tolex version with the neo creamback speaker and people decided that it was too early to give up on this amp. People with the first gen started swapping speakers and the blond tolex players walked around seemingly happy....until the next problem which gives pause.

With that in mind, I will share what is bugging me right now. I did the reverb update and removed the bright cap, still have the neo Jensen though as a disclaimer. What I finally realized after playing this amp for months is that the mids are not all that scooped like a vintage Blackface amp would be. It seems like a flatter EQ to me and is just enough that it bothered me without really knowing why. Maybe that is the result of the neo magnet or more likely the result of the amp simulation itself? It really does sound like a more modern tone than a vintage one...still pleasing, but different and those same eyes are now betraying my expecations for the tone from acceptence to wondering what is wrong here?

I have no real need for the line out and mic simulations for my usage, but I really do like the power scaling feature which I find really handy, but is it enough to keep the amp?

I think it is a great amp for people who want the modern sound with the vintage looks...sort of like all those car clubs featuring cars from the 1950's with modern motors and internet stereos. Not everyone wants to tune carbs every 4 months and not everyone wants to deal with vacuum tubes either. That is what the Tonemaster is...it really is.
 

moosie

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Good to know. In a theoretical, schadenfreude kinda way LOL. Not really. I just was never gonna get one anyway, and this is one reason why. I just didn't know it yet.

The other reason would be 'app upgrades'. I can't even watch TV these days without constant prompts for upgrading 'apps'. Huh, I'm watching friggin' TV!

What I want now is a booteek tube TV. I bet there's a market. Well, maybe there was. Until a few weeks ago.
 

The Ballzz

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Why no effects loop? I get the multiple why's Fender hasn't added them to the all tube reissues, but it's a no brainer on solid state. I also get that most "vintage" aficionados could care less about an effects loop, but…….In this day and age of few being able to afford a great sound engineer kept on retainer, its becoming more and more important to be able to do all of our "effects enhancements" for ourselves. This includes delay, echo, chorus, etc, ad nauseam and also requires us to be able to send a fully "mixed" guitar sound from the stage to the mixer. The The only ways to "effectively" achieve this is with a good loop or a multiple amp, wet/dry rig.
Again, Why No Effects Loop?
Gene
 

getbent

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i like the product as it was designed. The tradeoff to get people who know a sound (like a deluxe sound) and to attract people who want a non tube amp (less expensive, less old tech) and who want to have depth to tweak as they choose.

When people started swapping speakers in the mustang series, I was baffled. The solution was designed with the existing speaker, adding in a different element unnecessarily changed the solution. I have been able to use the depth of the old software to get exactly the sounds out of my mustang III that I need. So much so, I sold my tone king. Imagine that!

It takes a little time (an evening or so) to really dial in all the sounds I wanted, but then I could save them and I don't have to mess with the amp at all to get what I want....

Is the amp a tube amp? no. Does it make its own sounds? yes. Can I find sounds that completely work for me? yes. I'm puzzled that you can't tweak it to get what you are looking for.
 

W.L.Weller

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...This includes delay, echo, chorus, etc, ad nauseam and also requires us to be able to send a fully "mixed" guitar sound from the stage to the mixer. The The only ways to "effectively" achieve this is with a good loop or a multiple amp, wet/dry rig.
1st guess - most Fender players don't use effects loops. 3 cords to plug/unplug/trip over.

2nd guess - it's cheaper to omit the two (2) jacks and a level control.

If you'd like a SS Fender with an effects loop, check on the 90s "Red Knob" amps. The Power Chorus has mono AND stereo effects loops, the mono loop includes -16dBv, -7dBv, and +4dBv settings, as well as a +/-9dB gain offset.
 

archetype

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i like the product as it was designed. The tradeoff to get people who know a sound (like a deluxe sound) and to attract people who want a non tube amp (less expensive, less old tech) and who want to have depth to tweak as they choose.

When people started swapping speakers in the mustang series, I was baffled. The solution was designed with the existing speaker, adding in a different element unnecessarily changed the solution. I have been able to use the depth of the old software to get exactly the sounds out of my mustang III that I need. So much so, I sold my tone king. Imagine that!

It takes a little time (an evening or so) to really dial in all the sounds I wanted, but then I could save them and I don't have to mess with the amp at all to get what I want....

Is the amp a tube amp? no. Does it make its own sounds? yes. Can I find sounds that completely work for me? yes. I'm puzzled that you can't tweak it to get what you are looking for.

IMO they really got it right with the Mustang III. Tone, power, and enough dispersion in the room. I shouldn't have sold mine.
 

The Ballzz

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If you love that B15, try to find a V4B and a 4x10. When lovin' that Ampeg sound for bass, nothing else comes close. While I hate moving 'em, the Ampeg 8x10 refrigerator is the icing on the cake AND the cherry on top! Nothin' else like 'em! Even as a guitarist, I own 2 refrigerators a V4B and an SVT Classic, just so that I can make sure the bass sounds just the way I like it! Best guitar effects device/tone enhancer ever invented!

I do however agree that a Showman or bigger wattage Bassman would come a close second to a good Ampeg.

Although, if you can ever get your hands on a mid '90s, 100 watt B-15-R you'd be the happiest bass playin' camper on the planet. Ya gotta click on the "Gallery" to actually see pics, and be aware that these are rare as hens' teeth!


Have 2 Beers & Thank Me In The Mornin'
Gene

I'm finally seeing them at fairly good use prices

That ought to tell us something? If they were "all that" nobody would be selling them used!
Just A Thought,
Gene
 

Joe M

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Is the amp a tube amp? no. Does it make its own sounds? yes. Can I find sounds that completely work for me? yes. I'm puzzled that you can't tweak it to get what you are looking for.
I agree with the first two comments, not, unfortunately, for me, the third. I spent at least two or three weeks messing with the controls trying to find “sounds that completely work for me”. All the tweaking was to no avail. And, after all, one of the main attractions of most BF and SF Fender’s, is their inherent simplicity.
 

unixfish

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If the DRTM EQ seems less mid-scooped and flatter than a DR, do the controls respond like a DR? I.e. does increasing bass and treble produce a mid-scoop?

It should. It was supposed to be set up to work "just like" a DR. I cannot say for sure.
 

unixfish

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I agree with the first two comments, not, unfortunately, for me, the third. I spent at least two or three weeks messing with the controls trying to find “sounds that completely work for me”. All the tweaking was to no avail. And, after all, one of the main attractions of most BF and SF Fender’s, is their inherent simplicity.

Hmmm. So, if you bought a Vox and could not get a sound you like within a few minutes, you would sell it?

I do get your point. I played with mine for a few weeks before I found the small handful of settings that work for me. I set them up and stored them, and now when I go to them they are there.

It is a bit more time up front to find the sound.

However, I now have a DR sound, a Bassman sound, a SuperSonic sound, and a sort-of Marshall sound in one amp. There are others that I dabble with as well, but those four get 99%+ of my playing time.
 
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